Two Bass Hit. Opinions? Options?

[mangotango]

I'm in a situation whereby in my main band, I use fretted and fretless 5-string basses, about a fifty-fifty split of tunes on the current set list. In the Workshop Jazz band with which I also play, it's fretless or EUB.

So I do need both types of bass guitar. Problem is that I have a real disparity between my fretted and fretless basses.

The fretted is a Bass Collection SB-315 (I think that's the model number?) - Active electronics; 2-octave neck; 2 jazz-style p/ups; vol/pan/treb/bass controls

The fretless is a Fernandes Gravity that I had de-fretted - Passive; 2-octave lined neck; 2 jazz-style p/ups; vol/vol/tone controls

So obviously they're completely different. Certainly enough to cause a bit of a headache at gigs - I'm constantly fiddling with controls to try to moderate levels for the sake of some kind of consistency, which takes away my focus from playing.  The best thing, as Steve Lawson said in a recent SBL Academy course, would be if I could match up my fretted and fretless basses.

The Fernandes was my "test-bed" bass - first of all to see if I could play 5 string, then to see if I could play fretless again after 35 years off. Both worked well, in the end, but now I'm in a situation where I need to pick one set of specs that would work better for me, and it really doesn't cut the mustard by comparison. I prefer the sound and range of the active bass, so at once that leads me in that direction.  I'm lucky enough to be in a position where I can upgrade either, or possibly both, but if the latter, then I don't have a massive budget for two mid-priced basses that are similar.

The obvious answer would be to find another Bass Collection 5'er and have it de-fretted. Which is a good solution in itself, but if I could find two versions of the same bass that I really like even more than the BC, except that one of them would be fretless, then that would be perfect. However, it turns out that 5-string fretless is a bit of a rarer breed than you might think - so it's been a bit of a search thus far.

 

I'm hoping for some sensible suggestions. A friend thought I should add a pre-amp on my board and just use that to ramp up the levels for the Passive Fretless to match the active Fretted. Tried it, really not very happy with the result.

Would love to go the route of 2 Sandbergs, but THAT's not going to happen any time soon. Or, absent a lottery win.....Ever.

Have considered Ibanez (hmmmm....), Sire (better), Yamaha, but open to Cort, maybe ESP, Schechter, Spector....but mostly I'm open to suggestions and would appreciate people's thoughts?

 

Aaaannnd......GO!!

 

[jrixn1]

8 minutes ago, mangotango said:

Certainly enough to cause a bit of a headache at gigs - I'm constantly fiddling with controls to try to moderate levels for the sake of some kind of consistency, which takes away my focus from playing. 

Once you do find the level, are you happy?  Or ultimately are you not happy with your current fretless bass?

Quote

A friend thought I should add a pre-amp on my board and just use that to ramp up the levels for the Passive Fretless to match the active Fretted. Tried it, really not very happy with the result.

What was the pre-amp you tried, and did you not like it because it changed the tone as well as the volume?  Would a "clean boost" pedal be any good?

[mangotango]

2 minutes ago, jrixn1 said:

Once you do find the level, are you happy?  Or ultimately are you not happy with your current fretless bass?

What was the pre-amp you tried, and did you not like it because it changed the tone as well as the volume?  Would a "clean boost" pedal be any good?

Truthfully......probably a bit of both. If I find that I just need, say, to turn down the fretted bass mid-gig, then because it's active and thus a lot louder than the passive, by the time I get to the next tune where I use the fretless, it's a really tricky job to match up the levels; and of course fiddling with the relative levels on a Jazz Bass-style two volume control system can be a little trickier than I would like to have to deal with in a gig situation. And if I'm honest...the Fernandes doesn't have the range or dynamic response of the active SGC Nanyo - I can't get the same upper range without then having to go back to my amp. Which means that the fretted bass sound is then wrong two songs later, the next time I change back.

Pre-amps - I thought about a Radial Bassbone (or whichever model it is) to be able to preset the volume lift, but if the bass needs changing.....I'd still rather have the control at my fingertips, so to speak.

A Carl Martin Hydra clean boost is exactly what I tried, but even with the gain rolled right back, the bass tone still sounded a bit harsh to me when boosted enough to get a similar level to that of the active bass.

[itu]

How about a passive A/B-box, that has a level pot in the other input? It would be very easy to construct (few components, a box, some wire, three stereo input jacks and a footswitch) and then the change would be a dream. My Glockenklang Soul has similar inputs. I can connect an EUB/fretless to the other input and an active fretted electric to the other. One level pot is enough, just put the more powerful behind the pot (or a trimmer that can be set by a tool) and do a set-and-forget.

I would use stereo jacks because it is better to solder the ring and sleeve together. If you ever happen to meet an active instrument and a stereo cable...

[Lfalex v1.1]

Put an onboard pre-amp in the fretless?

It needn't even have tone controls, just increase the level and be able to drive longer cables.

Failing that, maybe a hotter (passive) pickup ?

[LewisK1975]

What about something like this?  Level matching and switching made easy!

https://www.gear4music.com/Guitar-and-Bass/Morley-ABY-Mixer-Combiner/21BX?origin=product-ads&utm_campaign=*PLA+Shop+-+All+Products&utm_medium=vertical_search&network=google&adgroup=**All+Products&merchant_id=1279443&product_id=95037d1&product_country=GB&product_partition_id=41477300408&gclid=CjwKCAiAwJTjBRBhEiwA56V7qx678eCPG13TmpiRoNsmhgrvW7NKJR9uoNCWXRvWUPukyEcrfyzbYxoC9OAQAvD_BwE

Edited February 14, 2019 by LewisK1975

[tom5string]

Have the same problem and my solution is:

http://www.radialeng.com/product/bassbone-v2

[BigRedX]

Anything programmable with level and tone controls on it.

[jrixn1]

20 hours ago, mangotango said:

if I could find two versions of the same bass that I really like even more than the BC, except that one of them would be fretless, then that would be perfect. [...]  I'm hoping for some sensible suggestions.

For suggestions of five-string, active basses which come in both fretted and off-the-shelf-fretless: G&L L2500?  They don't make the fretless one as a (lower-priced) Tribute, so it'd have to be a USA - not sure of your budget, but I've seen them come up used from time to time around £700-£900.  Lots of tonal options and I found the controls easier to manage than (IMHO) the slightly-fiddly Sire.

[Grahambythesea]

If you want to replace the second bass, check first the string spacing. Like you I switch between the two, my fretted has the classic 19mm string spacing, mt fretless Spector only has 16.5. I’ve got used to it so I’m not replacing either at present but just for a short while when going from one to the other it feels different and I am conscious that I might just play the wrong string or hit two at once. I believe the Ibanez basses have close together string spacing ( but I’m sure others here can confirm/deny). There are quite a few bass collection basses coming up for sale here and elsewhere, why not get one and defret that if there is t a fretless one around already then everything will be the same! 🤩

[mangotango]

18 hours ago, tom5string said:

Have the same problem and my solution is:

http://www.radialeng.com/product/bassbone-v2

Ah, now that looks a bit more like it! Had seen other Radial products but for some reason didn't know this one, or if I did, (from the Bass/EUB thread), I didn't think of it.

However, now that I see it, it may be exactly what I'm looking for, if I decide that I can live with the current fretless.

Thanks, will investigate further!!

[chris_b]

You've got an immediate problem. As has already been suggested, a 2 channel outboard preamp would solve that. Then, if you feel you still need to, save to upgrade to better basses, one at a time.

[mangotango]

38 minutes ago, Grahambythesea said:

If you want to replace the second bass, check first the string spacing. Like you I switch between the two, my fretted has the classic 19mm string spacing, mt fretless Spector only has 16.5. I’ve got used to it so I’m not replacing either at present but just for a short while when going from one to the other it feels different and I am conscious that I might just play the wrong string or hit two at once. I believe the Ibanez basses have close together string spacing ( but I’m sure others here can confirm/deny). There are quite a few bass collection basses coming up for sale here and elsewhere, why not get one and defret that if there is t a fretless one around already then everything will be the same! 🤩

...and that's exactly why I struggled with all of the Ibanez 5'er basses that I tried, even when they looked like a good bet, I just struggled to play them.

Clearly my fault rather than that of the bass, but I guess their fine instruments are destined not to be a good match with my fat little sausage fingers

[TheGreek]

5 string Bass Collection Nanyo on ebay:

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Bass-Collection-Bass-Guitar-by-SGC-Nanyo/323696011636?hash=item4b5dc92974:g:iFYAAOSwCMRcZroX

[tauzero]

And another one:

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/BASS-COLLECTION-BY-SGC-NANYO-5-STRING-ACTIVE-JAZZ-BASS-FROM-LATE-80s/254127243521

[miles'tone]

What about just putting a couple of dots with a Sharpie pen on your volume dial on the amp?

Change bass, adjust, repeat.

Easy as, erm, dot-to-dot..😗

[mangotango]

On ‎17‎/‎02‎/‎2019 at 09:18, miles'tone said:

What about just putting a couple of dots with a Sharpie pen on your volume dial on the amp?

Change bass, adjust, repeat.

Easy as, erm, dot-to-dot..😗

Except, as per my second post, it doesn't deal with with mid-song or mid-set adjustments (volume or tone) to one bass that then need to be reflected in the other...

[mangotango]

Well, almost inevitably...and at the instigation of Mrs. Mango (yes I know, I couldn't believe it either!)....

 

Posting to follow soon in NB(s)D format.....

[uk_lefty]

The various breeds of Stingray could be good. I have a full blown USA Stingray and it's the mutts nutts, but to get within budget you could go for two of the cheaper Sub or Sterling ranges. Not sure if they do fretless off the shelf but buy second hand and get to work with your pliers? I'm waiting for a nice used Lefty Sterling to come up for sale so I can have a fretless stingray

[mangotango]

3 hours ago, uk_lefty said:

The various breeds of Stingray could be good. I have a full blown USA Stingray and it's the mutts nutts, but to get within budget you could go for two of the cheaper Sub or Sterling ranges. Not sure if they do fretless off the shelf but buy second hand and get to work with your pliers? I'm waiting for a nice used Lefty Sterling to come up for sale so I can have a fretless stingray

Thanks, but for some reason I've never really got on well with Musicman basses. Just not my cuppa, nothing wrong with them at all;  in the hands of others, notably me old mate @Stingray5, they clearly make very fine noises indeed.

Edited February 19, 2019 by mangotango

[Jack]

You're sorted now, but for the future those really tasty Sire basses come in identical fretted and fretless.

[mangotango]

12 hours ago, Jack said:

You're sorted now, but for the future those really tasty Sire basses come in identical fretted and fretless.

Well, the weekend before I was sorted out, Mrs. Mango and I went over to Anderton's and tried out matching fretted/fretless Sire Gen 2 P7's. Liked them very much indeed, as it happens.

Had the final £'s total up, and all was good until I tried a couple of tunes from the current repertoire and realised that I was running out of frets at the dusty end (current basses have 2-octave necks....). Accordingly, I held fire, despite having almost got to the point of pulling the trigger.

So the weekend just gone, we went up to Bass DIrect and consulted with the estimable Mark. I knew that I couldn't manage the Sandbergs that I really wanted, so what was going to be the answer?He told me that within my budget, it was going to be almost impossible to solve the problem.....

and then found exactly what I needed within a price that I was going to be able to afford!!

Except that I was dithering a bit over the dosh; so when the very lovely Mrs. M said "Well, if you're going to take the step up, you might as well do it properly....", it was all over bar the PIN number and we were out of there in just over an hour. Check out the NBD thread that I will post later, when I can get round to photo's...