Ibanez UB804 Upswing EUB

[tinyd]

1 hour ago, philparker said:

This clip doesn't really show the right hand, but gives a good indication of the sound/tone.

 

 

Thanks for that - to me that still sounds more like a fretless bass than an upright. I found this clip which is a lot more DB-like to my ears:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UrjoKSwt4iU

 

From the comments he says he's using nylon coated strings and a foam mute....

[Happy Jack]

Facebook Group https://www.facebook.com/groups/377691255697549/?hoisted_section_header_type=recently_seen&multi_permalinks=3078242042309110&__cft__[0]=AZWZqBK_jABeU95GSlaPRCNEZiLmXfsm8gcEunAPlRSrjZQ2EG5laysTjB71xDPw8QZavct0SBH7TxXJ_nVDwednssuam4i75Uxbrs-l_rbqKWWzzWDV4SwFwJIhozY4B41YgvHrEqTXVcmAzgbIht1FjKG8JFbtYyVWeiCDTaq-STGQmpl21smsKuCuNFRIWvCiAOA4BfdXZfwG8WyT7sGp&__tn__=-UC%2CP-R

 

has one for sale at £700 this evening, in Pulborough.

 

No idea if that's a good price.

 

 

[JimmyN2]

Hi Linus

I’ve been playing on of these beauties since 2020 and I can’t recommend it highly enough, and very easy to play for an ex Fender player.  The strings from new are Daddario ECB81 and I wouldn’t use anything else. I play a lot and have replaced them once. 
At jazz gigs people often come and tell me how like a double bass it sounds. 
 

Jim

Edited March 2 by JimmyN2
No foam or any pedals required it is best played clean. Depending on your amp eq at flat or even with the bass rolled back a bit is best.

[Linus27]

19 hours ago, JimmyN2 said:

Hi Linus

I’ve been playing on of these beauties since 2020 and I can’t recommend it highly enough, and very easy to play for an ex Fender player.  The strings from new are Daddario ECB81 and I wouldn’t use anything else. I play a lot and have replaced them once. 
At jazz gigs people often come and tell me how like a double bass it sounds. 
 

Jim

 

Thanks Jim, that's really good to know. I think mine came fitted with Rotosound rounds which really were doing the bass no favours. I had a set of Rotosound Flats spare which are strings I'm very fond of anyway, so I fitted them and they've transformed it. I'm still going to try a set of the D'addario ECB81's as I've read others have rated them as well. Thank you for your help.

[Linus27]

Just out of interest, does anyone use a Sansamp pedal or similar with the Ibanez Upswing? If so, any recommendations on settings that you use. I'm trying to get as close to a nice organic, thumpy double bass tone as possible.

[JimmyN2]

On 05/03/2024 at 00:01, Linus27 said:

Just out of interest, does anyone use a Sansamp pedal or similar with the Ibanez Upswing? If so, any recommendations on settings that you use. I'm trying to get as close to a nice organic, thumpy double bass tone as possible.

Hi Linus

Initially I used my Cali76 pedal which I had used with a Rickenbacker bass for years but to be honest I stopped using it because of the way it alters the sound from the UB804.

 

In my humble opinion straight into your amp is best and (depending on its characteristics) with the bass rolled back from flat. I often have people come up to me after a gig (jazz) to tell me how like a DB my instrument sounds. To me, close up, it sounds a little trebley but I’ve found that that cuts through the brass and drums.  When we record ourselves the bass sounds much like DB on jazz tracks. 

But you said thumpy so roll the tone knob back and it will stop the brightness of the bass. 
 

Somewhere on here someone once said that sound is really in your fingers so I just spent a lot of time trying out different fingering and pressure on the strings and saved myself a shed load of cash on pedals. 
 

I think the original strings are also best. 
 

However it’s all opinion and I’m sure others will say different. 
 

Good luck

 

Jimmy

[JPJ]

@Linus27 just to back up what JimmyN2 says, the secret to a double bass tone lies in the way you pluck. If you are playing ‘across’ the strings with your plucking fingers at 90 degrees to the strings like on a bass guitar you get a totally different sound to if you play with your plucking fingers parallel to the string using the side of your plucking finger rather than the tip. When I first got my NS EUB I found it to be too fretless bass sounding, but a NinoMute from bass direct added a lot more thump and a shorter decay, and then because I double between the NS and fretless bass, I added an EBS Stanley Clarke preamp to my meagre pedal board and found that the secret source is in the filter knob. Had I not been doubling, I would have probably gone for the Artec Parametric EQ instead as I have heard a few EUB players who swear by this pedal. Occasionally I will add a little touch of reverb to the NS too as this lets the notes breath like on an acoustic DB.  

[Linus27]

Thanks @JimmyN2 and @JPJ, your help is really appreciated and invaluable, thank you. So last night I did my first gig after only getting the UB804 2 weeks ago and it was a huge success. I've been putting in hours of practice each night to try and get comfortable, work on my technique and to tweak my bass lines as I'm normally a melodic fretless player. I needed to simplify them and play some parts in a lower octave. I knew the sound guy already and he's very good and knew exactly what I usually sound like with my fretless and what sort of sound I was after with the double bass and he got it absolutely spot on. I even got compliments afterwards and despite this being our first unplugged setup and mine with the double bass, we even got a standing ovation at the end so I'll take that as a hit 😁

 

As for compressor, for fretless, its vital for my sound but for the double bass I also found this had more of a negative effect than doing good so I kept this off. Reverb also is an essential part of my fretless tone but I found for the double bass, things got a bit mushy so I kept this off. I run it through my Warwick Gnome and TC Electronic BC208 and the settings were bass dialled back a little to 11 o clock, mids dialled back to 9 o clock and treble left at 12 o clock. The UB804 had the tone rolled all the way back and I got a nice warm rounded thumpy tone. Not necessarily pure double bass but nothing like a fretless bass. I did still run through my Sansamp but just as a DI rather than any tone shaping but I did dial all the blend off which helped.

 

As for how I play, one thing I learnt very quickly is a softer touch really really helps and the softer I played, the fuller the notes swelled but also stayed cleaner. I was finding some of the lower octave notes like F and G on the E string could get a bit mushy and boomy but with a lighter plucking hand, the notes would sing more and this seemed consistent across all the notes. I've also been trying plucking 90 degrees to the string and also side on like Ray Brown. The latter is much harder but something I'm going to keep working on for sure. 

 

As for something to use instead of the Sansamp, I'd read the Fishman Platinum Pro had great reviews. I will of course look into the Artec Parametric EQ but I have also managed to get a great tone from just going direct into my amp so it's more the DI option that's important to me.

[JimmyN2]

That’s really good Linus, so glad it worked for you and you had fun, excellent!  
 
Trying everything out is the only way.  
 

But if you really want to sound like a DB then the Ray Brown method is your best route.  Plucking at 90o will never sound like a DB.

 

Really pleased for you. 
 

Cheers,

 

Jim

[Linus27]

4 minutes ago, JimmyN2 said:

That’s really good Linus, so glad it worked for you and you had fun, excellent!  
 
Trying everything out is the only way.  
 

But if you really want to sound like a DB then the Ray Brown method is your best route.  Plucking at 90o will never sound like a DB.

 

Really pleased for you. 
 

Cheers,

 

Jim

 

Thanks Jim, really appreciate your help and kind words. It's only been 2 weeks so very very early day and certainly a long but fun road ahead.

[JimmyN2]

Took delivery of a MarkBass New York 121 yesterday to add to my CMD121. Quick delivery and good price from Bass Direct.  Anyway the difference in sound without changing any settings is quite surprising.  Let’s see what the other band members make of it on Tuesday.  I won’t bother at church as I put a mic in front of the cmd121. 

[Linus27]

1 hour ago, JimmyN2 said:

Took delivery of a MarkBass New York 121 yesterday to add to my CMD121. Quick delivery and good price from Bass Direct.  Anyway the difference in sound without changing any settings is quite surprising.  Let’s see what the other band members make of it on Tuesday.  I won’t bother at church as I put a mic in front of the cmd121. 

 

When you say different, in what way? 

[JimmyN2]

34 minutes ago, Linus27 said:

 

When you say different, in what way? 

Can’t be specific yet but immediately it was a fuller and more rounded sound. Waiting to explore the variable tweeter. 

[tinyd]

Not sure if this has been shared before but his results sound pretty good at the end:
 

 

[tinyd]

Finding the above video has introduced me to IR loaders (something that I was previously unaware of). As I'm skint, I'm wondering about using the TC IR Loader (about €140) with some upright bass IRs through my existing amp - has anybody else tried doing this? It seems like a promising way of enhacing the sound of the piezo output from my DB....

[JimmyN2]

On 08/03/2024 at 12:28, JimmyN2 said:

Can’t be specific yet but immediately it was a fuller and more rounded sound. Waiting to explore the variable tweeter. 

Hi Linus 

Had our weekly rehearsal this morning and all the band members,  and in particular the keys player, agreed with my comment above.  In fact he said the fuller, more rounded and ‘big’ sound made it sound even more like a DB. Incidentally I didn’t alter the controls on the MarkBass amp.  
cheers

Jim

[Burns-bass]

I reckon it's going to be about 3 months time until you're looking to buy a real DB.

[Linus27]

10 hours ago, JimmyN2 said:

Hi Linus 

Had our weekly rehearsal this morning and all the band members,  and in particular the keys player, agreed with my comment above.  In fact he said the fuller, more rounded and ‘big’ sound made it sound even more like a DB. Incidentally I didn’t alter the controls on the MarkBass amp.  
cheers

Jim

 

That sounds really promising, thank you for the update and letting me know.

[Marc S]

16 hours ago, tinyd said:

Not sure if this has been shared before but his results sound pretty good at the end:
 

 

 

Excellent. Thanks for sharing this video @tinyd  

[Mr Bassman]

16 hours ago, tinyd said:

Finding the above video has introduced me to IR loaders (something that I was previously unaware of). As I'm skint, I'm wondering about using the TC IR Loader (about €140) with some upright bass IRs through my existing amp - has anybody else tried doing this? It seems like a promising way of enhacing the sound of the piezo output from my DB....

I've been experimenting with double bass IR's for some time using a Mooer Radar. I'm not really using it anymore so might consider selling it including a few dozen IR's I've collected.

 

[tinyd]

17 minutes ago, Mr Bassman said:

I've been experimenting with double bass IR's for some time using a Mooer Radar. I'm not really using it anymore so might consider selling it including a few dozen IR's I've collected.

 

Thanks for that - any particular reason why do you don't use it any more? I'm guessing that with a decent pickup/amp setup an IR isn't really worth it for live situations.....

 

[Linus27]

17 hours ago, tinyd said:

Not sure if this has been shared before but his results sound pretty good at the end:
 

 

 

Thank you for sharing. Super interesting. When he talks about the height of the strings, where is he actually measuring from?

[tinyd]

21 minutes ago, Linus27 said:

 

Thank you for sharing. Super interesting. When he talks about the height of the strings, where is he actually measuring from?

On double bass you usually measure string height at the end of the fingerboard so I'd guess it's the same here. For comparison, on DB "typical" string heights are around 5mm for the G up to 8 or 10 on the E, but these are hugely variable between players.

[Linus27]

39 minutes ago, tinyd said:

On double bass you usually measure string height at the end of the fingerboard so I'd guess it's the same here. For comparison, on DB "typical" string heights are around 5mm for the G up to 8 or 10 on the E, but these are hugely variable between players.

 

Amazing thank you. I had to raise the height of my G string as it was buzzing a little and sounding too much like a fretless. When I raised it a little it sounded so much better but as the string sustained, it then vibrated into an annoying buzz. So I raised it some more and the buzz went and its now sounding good. However the D started to do the same so I just raised that a little and its ok again. Now I have the measurements and know where to measure from, I can check what the actual heights are. 

[JimmyN2]

6 hours ago, Burns-bass said:

I reckon it's going to be about 3 months time until you're looking to buy a real DB.

Not me I’m afraid. Probably couldn’t lift one anymore and certainly don’t have a suitable car or home anymore either 🤣