Skinnyman Posted March 2, 2019 Share Posted March 2, 2019 29 minutes ago, Beedster said: As I understand it, ‘gender neutral’ can be seen as somehow offensive to trans people who are sometime very gender specific, the ..... in a .....’s body thing. I started listening to a speaker on this a few weeks ago, but frankly started to feel so depressed at the needless complexity and labelling involved, that I got my phone out and looked at ‘Amps & Cabs for Sale’ on here, which relieved the depression but meant I never got to understand the full trans/same sex attraction/gender neutral debate A sensible strategy. I used to be in a band with a trans guitarist who was actually pretty relaxed about stuff. It just wasn't a topic we ever discussed but equally, not one we avoided. The scariest one was a lesbian acquaintance who was probably the most intolerant person I've ever met. She hates bisexuals, transsexuals and gays. I'm not saying she was representative of all lesbians, just that there are all sorts in this world and one label is rarely sufficient to cover them all Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bootleg Posted March 2, 2019 Share Posted March 2, 2019 I'd say the sound person and venue should be avoided. Name and shame. Im so old I'm gender neutral. I don't even know what my gender symbol is when it's on toilet doors. I hate the way it's assumed I am riddled with unconscious bias because of my age. I have fought for years so that who people are is irrelevant as long as they don't harm people or animals. Now identity politics is chucking someone's differences in your face and assuming you will have a problem with it (I don't) and looking for offence by setting traps. We're all human beings. Or is that too species specific? 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beedster Posted March 2, 2019 Share Posted March 2, 2019 31 minutes ago, Skinnyman said: A sensible strategy. I used to be in a band with a trans guitarist who was actually pretty relaxed about stuff. It just wasn't a topic we ever discussed but equally, not one we avoided. The scariest one was a lesbian acquaintance who was probably the most intolerant person I've ever met. She hates bisexuals, transsexuals and gays. I'm not saying she was representative of all lesbians, just that there are all sorts in this world and one label is rarely sufficient to cover them all I think a lot of people bundle gender identity and sexual orientation into the same broad category, and in doing so perhaps assume a degree of tolerance among/between the people and groups in question that is far from reality. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BreadBin Posted March 2, 2019 Share Posted March 2, 2019 31 minutes ago, bootleg said: I'd say the sound person and venue should be avoided. Name and shame. Im so old I'm gender neutral. I don't even know what my gender symbol is when it's on toilet doors. I hate the way it's assumed I am riddled with unconscious bias because of my age. I have fought for years so that who people are is irrelevant as long as they don't harm people or animals. Now identity politics is chucking someone's differences in your face and assuming you will have a problem with it (I don't) and looking for offence by setting traps. We're all human beings. Or is that too species specific? Earth-dwellers perhaps? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beedster Posted March 2, 2019 Share Posted March 2, 2019 33 minutes ago, bootleg said: Now identity politics is chucking someone's differences in your face and assuming you will have a problem with it (I don't) and looking for offence by setting traps. Absolutely 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Happy Jack Posted March 2, 2019 Share Posted March 2, 2019 57 minutes ago, petebassist said: Get your trousers on you're nicked ! 😉 So is "You slag!" a gender-neutral term? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve Browning Posted March 2, 2019 Share Posted March 2, 2019 3 hours ago, taunton-hobbit said: Great idea - count me in for a 'medium'............ 😎 Sizeist!! 🙂 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skinnyman Posted March 2, 2019 Share Posted March 2, 2019 2 minutes ago, Steve Browning said: Sizeist!! 🙂 Exactly. A Small would fit me but I'd get XXL to support body positivism.... Then camp in it. In every sense of the word. Whoops..... 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lemmywinks Posted March 2, 2019 Share Posted March 2, 2019 1 hour ago, oZZma said: IMO "gender neutral" is not offensive itself, but if you use it to be "ironic"... Just imagine how much stupid "irony" people who go under gender transition have beared in their lives. It was enough innocent here, but still. I think this is an important point to make. I'm going to guess that this may have not been the first time that day someone had made a veiled insult in the guise of an hilarious comment. Mrs. Lemmywinks used to work in a supermarket with a trans woman and she got daily abuse, snide comments and sniggering along with outright ridicule from members of the public in her place of work. She spent a good amount of time crying in the staff room and developed a lot of anxiety issues purely because other people wouldn't let her live her life without wanting to beat her down for it. So while it's nice and jolly for us to call people snowflakes, cry ad infinitum about everybody being so easily offended (whilst completely missing the irony of that) and think little jibes are ok it's worth remembering there are people who have to put up with this crap on a daily basis and what might seem like a harmless one off joke might be the straw that broke the camel's back. Basically life is much easier for everyone when you don't insist on being a complete @rsehole. Maybe the sound engineer would have been better having a little chat to the band, finding out what they actually think and altering their on stage mix accordingly. 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dmccombe7 Posted March 2, 2019 Share Posted March 2, 2019 Sacking offence as far as i'm concerned. Don't mix your personal life with work. No matter what sex you choose to be this week. Dave 5 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gareth Posted March 2, 2019 Share Posted March 2, 2019 I’ve been forced to muzzle my dog, because although it identifies as a cat it keeps bloody barking. 2 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thunderpaws Posted March 2, 2019 Author Share Posted March 2, 2019 34 minutes ago, lemmywinks said: I think this is an important point to make. I'm going to guess that this may have not been the first time that day someone had made a veiled insult in the guise of an hilarious comment. Mrs. Lemmywinks used to work in a supermarket with a trans woman and she got daily abuse, snide comments and sniggering along with outright ridicule from members of the public in her place of work. She spent a good amount of time crying in the staff room and developed a lot of anxiety issues purely because other people wouldn't let her live her life without wanting to beat her down for it. So while it's nice and jolly for us to call people snowflakes, cry ad infinitum about everybody being so easily offended (whilst completely missing the irony of that) and think little jibes are ok it's worth remembering there are people who have to put up with this crap on a daily basis and what might seem like a harmless one off joke might be the straw that broke the camel's back. Basically life is much easier for everyone when you don't insist on being a complete @rsehole. Maybe the sound engineer would have been better having a little chat to the band, finding out what they actually think and altering their on stage mix accordingly. Maybe the sound engineer should have let her work sort the issue out in the days or weeks leading up to the gig instead of leaving it until the minutes before sound check. Also, she fairly lumped is all in together, we have no connection with the “offensive” band in question!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steantval Posted March 2, 2019 Share Posted March 2, 2019 (edited) Folks on here are assuming the “sound person” was there just to manage the desk, it could have been the case that person also provides the actual PA, if that was the case then the booked bands were definitely in the sh*te and had no option. Maybe the original poster could clarify it for us. Edited March 2, 2019 by steantval Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
keeponehandloose Posted March 2, 2019 Share Posted March 2, 2019 So whats a snowflake? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yorks5stringer Posted March 2, 2019 Share Posted March 2, 2019 (edited) 1 minute ago, keeponehandloose said: So whats a snowflake? Snowflake is a 2010s derogatory slang term for a person, implying that they have an inflated sense of uniqueness, an unwarranted sense of entitlement, or are over-emotional, easily offended, and unable to deal with opposing opinions.Or those things that fell in huge quantities a year ago when the Beast from the East visited us... Edited March 2, 2019 by yorks5stringer 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thunderpaws Posted March 2, 2019 Author Share Posted March 2, 2019 3 minutes ago, steantval said: Folks on here are assuming the “sound person” was there just to manage the desk, it could have been the case that person also provides the actual PA, if that was the case then the booked bands were definitely in the sh*te and had no option. Maybe the original poster could clarify it for us. PA and all sound gear belongs to and remains at the venue. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bartelby Posted March 2, 2019 Share Posted March 2, 2019 I've done a gig where not only did the sound guy not show up, he called the venue 10 mins after soundcheck was due to start to say he was sick. We then discover all the venue's mics were missing and most of the cables. the bands playing cobble together some mics and cables. And someone from each band worked the desk. just before the last band go on a local walks in to say he'd just been talking to the sound guy at a different venue he was working at... the mics and cables... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Woodinblack Posted March 2, 2019 Share Posted March 2, 2019 24 minutes ago, keeponehandloose said: So whats a snowflake? A derogatory term used to indicate someone who cares about different things to you. Normally used by someone that gets offended easily about something else. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Teebs Posted March 2, 2019 Share Posted March 2, 2019 6 hours ago, warwickhunt said: I'm offended that you chose to use the male orientated chromosome! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lemmywinks Posted March 2, 2019 Share Posted March 2, 2019 48 minutes ago, keeponehandloose said: So whats a snowflake? A term used to dismiss the concerns of certain groups of people as things that normal people should just get over. Ironically it's frequently used by the terminally outraged who can't seem to get over others living their lives differently from them. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dmccombe7 Posted March 2, 2019 Share Posted March 2, 2019 (edited) Why not just ban the band that made the statement and either replace with another band or simply rely on the remaining 2 bands to fill the night. Too much reliance on a sound engineer isn't good for a venue or bands. There should always be a fallback person. Pretty ridiculous situation for venue and bands. I just can't get my head round this one and why someone else couldn't run the desk even just getting a reasonable soundcheck and let the bands take care of themselves. Surely one of the band members could run the desk when not actually playing. Think there's more to this than meets the eye. Lets start a Conspiracy Theory and see where it takes us Dave Edited March 2, 2019 by dmccombe7 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steantval Posted March 2, 2019 Share Posted March 2, 2019 (edited) 1 hour ago, Thunderpaws said: PA and all sound gear belongs to and remains at the venue. I have to agree with some of the posters on here that if all the PA was there, surely someone from either of the three bands could have sorted out something sound wise to allow all the bands to play. A basic set up would have carried things through, instruments through the back line and just use the in house PA for the vocals, simples. The only thing I can assume that stopped the gig, was the venue owner probably didn’t want anyone other than the usual sound person touching the equipment. Edited March 2, 2019 by steantval Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Woodinblack Posted March 2, 2019 Share Posted March 2, 2019 1 hour ago, Thunderpaws said: Maybe the sound engineer should have let her work sort the issue out in the days or weeks leading up to the gig instead of leaving it until the minutes before sound check. Also, she fairly lumped is all in together, we have no connection with the “offensive” band in question!! Was the band posting this intentionally to get at the sound engineer, ie, did they know them personally? If they had then it might have been ok for them to say 'well, I am not doing the sound for them, you will have to get someone else to do it, but not sure why that would affect the other bands. If I was the venue owner I would have no problem with that, in fact I would support it, but just not cancelling the whole night. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rich Posted March 2, 2019 Share Posted March 2, 2019 To my mind, the issues of who got offended over what and which bathroom they use are entirely irrelevant (and it's a bit sad that in the 21st century we, or some at least, still think someone's gender identity is fair game for ridicule). For me, the only issue here is the mind-boggling unprofessionalism of the engineer. Offended or not, upset or not, just not turning up without a word to anyone is inexcusable. If I did that at work, I'd be in a world of poo. 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LeftyP Posted March 2, 2019 Share Posted March 2, 2019 The word "Guys" seems to be applied to all genders these days. My wife and I have been called guys when eating at cafes and restaurants. "Hi guys, what would you like?" 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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