Playing covers - how accurate do you need to be?

[Sandypjb]

Relieved to read most of the points raised in the posts above. 

One thing I keep reminding myself is that when the track was originally recorded, the bass player (let's suppose it's Flea) could play exactly what he wanted in any given bar - after all it's his bass line. Or he's made a mistake but the producer leaves it in because he and the other band members like it.

There's us poor souls trying to play it note-for-note 20 years later.

I wonder how many original bass players hear their song (bass line) and laugh at the attempts to copy their noodling.😁

Edited April 10, 2019 by Sandypjb

[ChunkyMunky]

Would you rather play the wrong rhythm but hit the right pitches? For me, the rhythm is far more key than the pitch, if absolutes were to exist in this.

 

As a little thought experiement, try this;

- Find a small theme, a melody, line or something.

- Play the wrong pitches deliberately but keep the rhythm as tight as possible.

- Play the right pitches but play the rhythm as poorly as possible.

- Observe the difference and make your conclusions from there.

 

Don't worry, I ripped off Victor Wooten on this. I tried to find the video but couldn't. If you can't play the lick intricately and rhythmically sound, don't overcomplicate it. It's very similar to when a drummer tries an audacious fill and makes a hash of it, same concept. 

[bassmachine2112]

In tune,In time job done

[Stub Mandrel]

4 minutes ago, bassmachine2112 said:

In tune,In time job done

SSH! Don't let the guitar heroes find out...

[itu]

Have to say that these are all good, but so different: Wonderwall by Oasis, Ryan Adams, and Paul Anka. Talk about arrangements.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bx1Bh8ZvH84

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0gVxRvNfFLg

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EAzyBWZf6wQ

[stewblack]

The only real answer is it depends. I was in a tribute band once and we came from all over so we never rehearsed. It was vital everyone learn and play every part note for note as per the agreed versions. You could have improvised but then how do you know one of the other 8 musicians wasn't taking a cue from the part you changed? However in most other cases it isn't at all important to learn the exact part. Some bands I'm in I improvise everything, never the same twice and no one gives a hoot. In another the band leader is crazy anal about everyone playing precisely what was played on the chart single version, not an album or live version, god forbid. I tried asking if they thought the original artists themselves ever played it like that live but to no avail. Other bands I'm in I do as people here suggest and only recreate those stand out bass parts without which the song would sound unrehearsed. Another band I'm in play almost all originals so they're my bass lines and I can do whatever I want with them. Of course there are covers where I love the bass line and want to learn it for that reason alone, and others where the original was written by someone like James Jamerson and I think to myself if it was good enough for the master who the hell am I to change it?

Like I said, it depends.

[joeystrange]

Just remember that not one person watching you play cares whether or not you play it exactly like the original and most of them probably can’t even tell the difference.

There’s s difference between playing it differently and playing it wrong. As long as you’re not playing it wrong (or so different that it drastically changes the song - assuming that isn’t the intention) then it doesn’t really matter.

To add to that you tend to find that most people will play a song slightly different to the way they recorded it as subtleties evolve over time.

[el borracho]

11 hours ago, ordep said:

Flea never played it the same way live anyway. 

I found this out the hard way. I spent weeks practicing one of their songs to get up to speed (can't remember which one it was) and had got through it at a couple of gigs.

Then I saw some footage of Flea playing it live - and he had simplified it 😄... I wouldn't worry too much!

[super al]

I got back into covers again a couple of years ago (so much easier writing your own basslines for originals).

I did agonize over the whole playing it note for note thing but in the end I thought if I'm not doing it right for the level of band I'm in they'll probably tell me! The punters aren't usually there to listen out for the bass player so I'll probably be safe not playing 'Footloose' like Nathan East!

Does anybody play all the farty slide bits in 'I Wish'? I doubt it, play it straight and it sounds just as good (as long as the drummer doesn't speed up throughout the song!).

I'm now playing in a band where the original bassist switched to guitar and he's very good on both instruments. It can be a help, it can be a hindrance (on my part, mentally), I'm not exactly the new boy but I don't feel I've bedded into the band yet. Having said that they're all great. 

Give an infinite number of monkeys bass guitars and still only Flea will play 'dani california' like Flea

[stewblack]

11 hours ago, super al said:

so I'll probably be safe not playing 'Footloose' like Nathan East!

Does anybody play all the farty slide bits in 'I Wish'

I do try to play Footloose as per the original but only as a challenge to myself and no other reason - even then there's a couple of variations which I gloss over! 

I try to do the fart slides in I Wish but never in the right places. Fart Slides. Band name, I call it. 

Edited April 11, 2019 by stewblack

[Paul S]

If one of my farts slide I believe I am in trouble.

[nightsun]

11 hours ago, super al said:

The punters aren't usually there to listen out for the bass player so I'll probably be safe not playing 'Footloose' like Nathan East!

Footloose was a mountain I had to conquer, just for me

[chris_b]

I'd play Footloose with the same feel and maybe most of the same notes. The intro and verse are pretty straightforward. The chorus is basically the left hand of a rock and roll piano line. On the record the chorus is written because it is doubled up with a guitar. Unless your guitarist wants to do that, keep the feel and busk it.

[super al]

56 minutes ago, nightsun said:

Footloose was a mountain I had to conquer, just for me

Maybe one day...

Too many other mountains to climb with the new band like 'I want you back' in F and now Earth, Wind & Fire tunes!

Every day's a school day!

[super al]

1 hour ago, stewblack said:

I do try to play Footloose as per the original but only as a challenge to myself and no other reason - even then there's a couple of variations which I gloss over! 

I try to do the fart slides in I Wish but never in the right places. Fart Slides. Band name, I call it. 

I should ask the old bassist if he did farty slides (in I Wish 😊).

Good call on the band name, I was in a covers band called the Lava Trees one time and a drummer mate was in Hoof Hearted.

[mentalextra]

Just wondering how many of you guys have ever had to sit in the audience and endure a covers band half assing their way through a song you care about?

[uk_lefty]

Just now, mentalextra said:

Just wondering how many of you guys have ever had to sit in the audience and endure a covers band half assing their way through a song you care about?

Haha it's true, sometimes people over simplify stuff to the point of annoyance. But you ask a non muso if they know there's something missing or something different... And also sometimes you have to accept if your watching a gig for free in the back room of a pub in the derrière end of nowhere you are watching amateurs, you can't exactly expect a superb and completely accurate performance I suppose.

[Stub Mandrel]

11 minutes ago, mentalextra said:

Just wondering how many of you guys have ever had to sit in the audience and endure a covers band half assing their way through a song you care about?

Think about the alternatives - Sky Sport or Jive Bunny on the juke box...

Edited April 11, 2019 by Stub Mandrel
Or even worse - Karaoke...

[Stub Mandrel]

Just a philosophical thought.

Someone made a good distinction between tributes and cover bands.

A tribute is like an impersonator or an impressionist  -and those two different words imply different things.

Outside 'popular music' it is the norm for the performer to put their personal stamp on a performance.

In classical music, orchestras vary in their composition and conductors vary in their styles. An classical soloists have their signature styles. Bach's Tocatta and Fugue sounds very different on depending on the organist and organ.

Jazz is all about improvisation developing the themes in a piece.

Folk music is all about a huge canon of music that gets continually reinterpreted.

Perhaps the question should be 'why do covers bands try so hard to sound like the originals'?

[mentalextra]

3 minutes ago, Stub Mandrel said:

Just a philosophical thought.

Someone made a good distinction between tributes and cover bands.

A tribute is like an impersonator or an impressionist  -and those two different words imply different things.

Outside 'popular music' it is the norm for the performer to put their personal stamp on a performance.

In classical music, orchestras vary in their composition and conductors vary in their styles. An classical soloists have their signature styles. Bach's Tocatta and Fugue sounds very different on depending on the organist and organ.

Jazz is all about improvisation developing the themes in a piece.

Folk music is all about a huge canon of music that gets continually reinterpreted.

Perhaps the question should be 'why do covers bands try so hard to sound like the originals'?

Or how little of the original performance do they need to class as a cover? half assed is a cover, totally half assed, a tribute! lol

Edited April 11, 2019 by mentalextra

[nightsun]

7 minutes ago, Stub Mandrel said:

Perhaps the question should be 'why do covers bands try so hard to sound like the originals'?

I've always argued that we are a covers band, not a copies band.  I like to put my own spin on things, as long as it isn't to the detriment of the song and I'm not being paid the big bucks (I'm not being paid the big bucks) then I don't see it as a problem.  Also being strictly in the 'amateur' camp, slavishly copying songs would soon get boring and it would turn into yet another job,at which point you'll find my gear on the market place.  Saying that I do agree on the 'known' bassline argument, for example I do try to get Cream/Who/Beatles etc stuff as right as I can while adding a little of myself to the sauce.

Edited April 11, 2019 by nightsun

[mentalextra]

Just now, nightsun said:

I've always argued that we are a covers band, not a copies band.  I like to put my own spin on things, as long as it isn't to the detriment of the song and I'm not being paid the big bucks (I'm not being paid the big bucks) then I don't see it as a problem.  Also being strictly in the 'amateur' camp, slavishly copying songs would soon get boring and it would turn into yet another job,at which point you'll find my gear on the market place.  Saying that I do agree on the 'know' bassline argument, for example I do try to get Cream/Who/Beatles etc stuff as right as I can while adding a little of myself to the sauce.

I don't think the average non muso audience would notice that you weren't trying to do a note for note copy, but would assume you weren't capable of it?lol

[mentalextra]

If I had to play music I wasn't interested in i'd be more willing to 'tribute' it too?

[chris_b]

34 minutes ago, mentalextra said:

Just wondering how many of you guys have ever had to sit in the audience and endure a covers band half assing their way through a song you care about?

If you are watching a semi pro cover band why do you care about caring for the songs?

I don't go to see bands who don't play well. It's not an enjoyable experience, but they are not playing for me, so as long as the intended audience is enjoying themselves all is good.

[tony_m]

I just aim to play a song to the best of my ability, as close to the original as I can manage. I will try to get it note-for-note perfect, but I'm not ashamed to miss out an occasional note here and there as long as the crucial tones, timing, rhythm and feel are all there. For example, in my last band we used to do A Whiter Shade of Pale, and at the same point every time the keyboard player tried to fit in a particular six note run, but never quite managed it with the result being the timing always fell apart. If it had been me, I'd have made sure I hit the first and last notes of the run, then fitted in as many of the passing notes as I could comfortably manage so that the overall effect was right, but the timing didn't suffer. That's how I tend to approach learning and playing new bass lines, rightly or wrongly - start with a cut-down / simplified version if necessary, then the more I practice it, the more stuff  I'll add in and the closer I'll try to get it until it is correct, but always with the caveat that ultimately it's always going to be *our* version, and that some things are just never meant to be!