Jazz bass with flats

[bubinga5]

17 minutes ago, Reggaebass said:

A jazz isn’t just for jazz it’s for whatever you want to play on it , I’ve been playing reggae on one for 30 years 🙂

I dont think i said a Jazz bass was just for Jazz.

[Teebs]

54 minutes ago, Reggaebass said:

A jazz isn’t just for jazz it’s for whatever you want to play on it , I’ve been playing reggae on one for 30 years 🙂

Exactly!

Just as 'jazz cigarettes' aren't just for mirth-hoovers with black turtle-necks  & goatee beards

By-the bye...

The origin of the word "jazz" has resulted in considerable research, and its history is well documented. It is believed to be related to "jasm", a slang term dating back to 1860 meaning "pep, energy". The earliest written record of the word is in a 1912 article in the Los Angeles Times in which a minor league baseball pitcher described a pitch which he called a "jazz ball" "because it wobbles and you simply can't do anything with it".

The use of the word in a musical context was documented as early as 1915 in the Chicago Daily Tribune. Its first documented use in a musical context in New Orleans was in a November 14, 1916 Times-Picayune article about "jas bands". In an interview with NPR, musician Eubie Blake offered his recollections of the slang connotations of the term, saying, "When Broadway picked it up, they called it 'J-A-Z-Z'. It wasn't called that. It was spelled 'J-A-S-S'. That was dirty, and if you knew what it was, you wouldn't say it in front of ladies."

Mr Fender probably had this in mind more that 'jazz music' when he named the Jazz Bass.

Just sayin'

 

Edited May 28, 2019 by Teebs

[bubinga5]

1 minute ago, Teebs said:

Exactly!

Just as 'jazz cigarettes' aren't just for mirth-hoovers with black turtle-necks  & goatee beards

By-the bye... Mr Fender probably had this in mind more that 'jazz music' when he named the Jazz Bass.

  The origin of the word "jazz" has resulted in considerable research, and its history is well documented. It is believed to be related to "jasm", a slang term dating back to 1860 meaning "pep, energy". The earliest written record of the word is in a 1912 article in the Los Angeles Times in which a minor league baseball pitcher described a pitch which he called a "jazz ball" "because it wobbles and you simply can't do anything with it".

The use of the word in a musical context was documented as early as 1915 in the Chicago Daily Tribune. Its first documented use in a musical context in New Orleans was in a November 14, 1916 Times-Picayune article about "jas bands"^. In an interview with NPR, musician Eubie Blake offered his recollections of the slang connotations of the term, saying, "When Broadway picked it up, they called it 'J-A-Z-Z'. It wasn't called that. It was spelled 'J-A-S-S'. That was dirty, and if you knew what it was, you wouldn't say it in front of ladies."

Mr Fender probably had this in mind more that 'jazz music' when he named the Jazz Bass.

Just sayin'

 

Oh please. Read the previous comments.  We all know a jazz bass isnt just for jazz. 

[acidbass]

51 minutes ago, Reggaebass said:

A jazz isn’t just for jazz it’s for whatever you want to play on it , I’ve been playing reggae on one for 30 years 🙂

Yep - I actually don't associate the sound of a Jazz with zingy top end at all.  To me, the sound is round and full like JPJ, or all bridge pickup burp like Jaco.  I'm aware that people like Marcus Miller use theirs for bright slappy tappyness, but it's not a sound I could ever see myself needing.

[Skinnyman]

I think that Bubinga’s point (and I’m aware that he’s perfectly able to make it himself) was that - irrespective of the genre - by putting flats on, you are losing an element of the “Jazz bass sound” that would be present if you strung it with rounds.

And I have to agree with him. The same thing happens when you string a P bass with rounds - they add a “bite” that wasn’t there before. 

Where I slightly disagree is with the contention that the Jazz was designed for rounds and that by putting on flats you’re somehow going against the design brief. As rounds didn’t really come onto the scene until the early sixties and as the jazz came onto the market in 1960 (and must have been designed in the fifties) I think it’s okay to use flats on a jazz.

But for sure, Rounds make it sound different and that’s good and - as Bubinga originally said - it’s each to his own. Vive la difference!

 

[Teebs]

8 minutes ago, Skinnyman said:

...it’s each to his own. Vive la difference!

NO!!!

There are RULES!!!

And they must be followed!!!

Deviance will not be tolerated!!!

 

[Skinnyman]

3 minutes ago, Teebs said:

Deviance will not be tolerated!!!

That's a bit rich coming from ol' Fifty Shades of Teebs....

[Teebs]

15 minutes ago, Skinnyman said:

That's a bit rich coming from ol' Fifty Shades of Teebs....

(no TLRTs)

[SpondonBassed]

9 hours ago, Davo-London said:

I usually feel cheated when I put flats on a bass.  Cheated of the full spectrum of sounds.

That's the way I feel.

Davo

Are you sure you aren't a closet keyboardist?

I might feel similarly if I owned any tweeters but I don't have any HF tendencies in me.

Edited May 28, 2019 by SpondonBassed

[4000]

The only Jazz sounds that do it for me are JPJ, Gary Thain, Lenny Kravitz/ Jack Daley and similar. Love that plummy tone.

[EMG456]

6 hours ago, SpondonBassed said:

Are you sure you aren't a closet keyboardist?

I might feel similarly if I owned any tweeters but I don't have any HF tendencies in me.

I'm with Davo - full range all the way! Why buy an instrument and then only be able to get half the sound out of it?

[Linus27]

Can I just say, this thread is great. Informative, humorous and makes you contemplate. Carry on chaps.

[paul_5]

6 hours ago, EMG456 said:

I'm with Davo - full range all the way! Why buy an instrument and then only be able to get half the sound out of it?

Fair point, but it’s the best half!

[Soledad]

1 hour ago, paul_5 said:

Fair point, but it’s the best half!

Tried half-rounds a bit ago, kind of looking for best of both. I reckon half-rounds are a miss all over - don't get the low-end punch of flats or the ring of rounds, least I couldn't. If you want half of both try some half rounds
 

[EMG456]

3 hours ago, paul_5 said:

Fair point, but it’s the best half!

That's also a fair point!

Andy Lewis, proprietor of Acme Bass, the designer of my favourite bass cab the Low B2, was testing the design of a new cab for old school sounds and discovered that with an old P bass and flatwound strings, the tweeter made no difference to the sound whatsoever. So they just missed it out and called the cab the Flatwound!

https://www.acmebass.com/pdf/b112_flatwound.pdf

[Beer of the Bass]

 

11 hours ago, EMG456 said:

I'm with Davo - full range all the way! Why buy an instrument and then only be able to get half the sound out of it?

 

I'm going to go the other way and say that flats have an interesting attack/decay envelope that I can't entirely reproduce with rounds, and miss when it's not there.  It's true enough that this happens over a narrower range of frequencies, but that high end just isn't a big part of the voice I'm looking for from my bass guitar.  So I enjoy flats on my jazz-ish 5 string.  (Though if I had a P-bass around, I'd probably put rounds on that!)

[No lust in Jazz]

There are some gorgeous sounds available using flats, but if using a Jazz in a gig where we're playing back to back numbers with a variety of styles, I go for the flexibility offered by round wound strings,

[EMG456]

25 minutes ago, Beer of the Bass said:

 

 

I'm going to go the other way and say that flats have an interesting attack/decay envelope that I can't entirely reproduce with rounds, and miss when it's not there.  It's true enough that this happens over a narrower range of frequencies, but that high end just isn't a big part of the voice I'm looking for from my bass guitar.  So I enjoy flats on my jazz-ish 5 string.  (Though if I had a P-bass around, I'd probably put rounds on that!)

I like many of the recorded sounds produced by folks using flats but every time I tried them myself, I couldn't stand the clankyness of them - probably because I use a full range sound. I haven't bought a set of flats for oh… about 40 years but must confess I'm thinking about a wee experiment and will probably now throw a set onto my old Tokai PJ to see what transpires.

[mangotango]

11 minutes ago, EMG456 said:

I like many of the recorded sounds produced by folks using flats but every time I tried them myself, I couldn't stand the clankyness of them - probably because I use a full range sound. I haven't bought a set of flats for oh… about 40 years but must confess I'm thinking about a wee experiment and will probably now throw a set onto my old Tokai PJ to see what transpires.

Exactly this. My Spectors have rounds on, including the Fretless - may change that at some point, but for now, I'm happy with those.

I did use D'Addario half-rounds on a fretless Shergold Marathon that I had back in the day, so might give something like those a go (despite @Soledad's misgivings).

However, I also have my Bass Collection  with P/J configuration, and I've just put Rotosound flatwounds on that for the specific sound that they deliver. I like the results so far; I shall use it for recording on Saturday, so will let you know how that turns out.

[Soledad]

2 hours ago, EMG456 said:

I haven't bought a set of flats for oh… about 40 years

I do think flats have come on miles in the past 10 years or so - I recently asked for advice here about 'bright' flats and was recommended EB Cobalts or D'Addario chromes. I got a set of the EBs - amazing, the full-fat flat sound but with more than enough top - Ok not the ringy top of new rounds, but a crisp controllable crunch on the top... tasty. I'd used a set of Fenders recently and whilst many here like them, to me they are the old-school flats, not only devoid of top but no high-mids either. Depends what you want but sounds to me you would like the EBs (or Chromes maybe) a lot.

[Soledad]

2 hours ago, mangotango said:

I did use D'Addario half-rounds on a fretless Shergold Marathon that I had back in the day, so might give something like those a go (despite @Soledad's misgivings).

If the bass you want them for is a 2+2 34", don't buy new ones!! pm me and i'll send mine over. D'Addario 45-100 I recall. Spent a few days on so good as...

[SpondonBassed]

I have D'Addario half-rounds on two of my five strings, the Ibby and the Pit Bull.  I have tapewound Stainless Picatos on my Steiny five.  The only bass I have now with roundwounds is the B2A and they are lightweight superwounds.  The B2As pickups work well with these giving a full bottom end to the otherwise light superwounds.  My Vantage fretless has Rotosound 88 black nylon tapewounds - warm and thumpy.

I like the half-rounds.  On the Ibby I have more than enough bass and sometimes I will roll it off a bit and boost the mids and highs at the preamp but they sound fine flat too.  There's a nice interaction between bridge and neck pick-ups midway in the blend knob's travel that would work well for solos I think.

Edited May 29, 2019 by SpondonBassed

[Linus27]

Just as a side question, if I'd bought a fretless Fender Precision bass in the 70's, what strings would Fender have fitted to it, flats or rounds?

[EMG456]

Flats but it was quite difficult to find a fretless Fender in those days. Don’t think production numbers were very high. Oh, and they were all Precision’s- no fretless Jazzes. 

[Ricky 4000]

Seems odd that. Apparently Jaco had to fashion his own fretless jazz with a pliers & some wood filler.

Like a Jedi constructing his own lightsabre... ish.