Gig Getting

[Unknown_User]

Does anyone else find getting gigs for a new band doing original songs is really heavy going?  After emailing loads of venues and promoters I'm finding that I'm mostly getting roundly ignored.  Barely even so much as a "Thanks for your email, get stuffed."  Just one gig has resulted so far.  I'm sure it wasn't this difficult fifteen years or so ago.

Anyone else similarly cheesed off with this endeavour or do you have any top tips (humorous or sensible!) for persuading promoters to give us a half hour somewhere to make a load of noise?

[Guest oZZma]

I have no experience with that but from what I can see originals new bands most often share gigs with other bands (sometimes even three/four of them!) 

Rather than asking venues maybe you could try to get in touch with similar genres bands  (I guess you'll have better chances with bands at the same level as you, new or not too well established anyways) and see if you can organize something together or propose a 2-3 bands gig to venues.

What kind of "noise" anyways?  

 

Edited May 30, 2019 by oZZma

[Cat Burrito]

Effectively you are an unknown entity so promoters are reluctant to take a chance. It's definitely harder now. Do you do any covers at all? If so I would bill yourself as whatever genre you are and state it is a mix of originals and covers. Then when you do your set that is 95% originals, if it goes down well and people come - you have a foot in the door.

[Lozz196]

When we started out - punk/Oi band - we realised that as unknowns we’d have to work at it, take first on the bill gigs for no money just to get the name out there. We literally contacted the venues/promoters who already had say 3 bands on and said we’d do a 30min set as first band on and for no money. Then turned up early, played and were professional, set up/broke down gear quickly, hung around for the whole event. You might have to do 6 months to a year of this but be patient. The other thing is go to gigs of the type of music, speak to the sound man, promoters, owners etc. Sometimes the personal touch works as face to face they can tell that they’re dealing with someone who they feel they can work with.

[Monkey Steve]

yes, all of what Lozz says

With my last originals band, what we found worked quite well was contacting venues that seemed completely out of our league as complete unknowns, places like the Boston Arms and venues around Camden like the Unicorn that do their own bookings. Turns out they're often quite keen to get an opener in the same genre for a three or four band evening and don't mind taking a chance on a complete unknown.  You will play a lot of Wednesday nights to a couple of dozen people (or less) but turning up on time, acting professionally and being nice to everybody (as well as playing well) got us on their call back list for when they needed a band, even though we weren't bringing a huge crowd with us

One tip I would add is to be very flexible about dates, and ready to play at short notice

[Unknown_User]

28 minutes ago, oZZma said:

I have no experience with that but from what I can see originals new bands most often share gigs with other bands (sometimes even three/four of them!) 

Rather than asking venues maybe you could try to get in touch with similar genres bands  (I guess you'll have better chances with bands at the same level as you, new or not too well established anyways) and see if you can organize something together or propose a 2-3 bands gig to venues.

What kind of "noise" anyways?  

 

Yeah that's exactly what I'm looking for.  I'm asking places for a half hour support slot on a band night somewhere.  I know we only have like 35 minutes of material so we couldn't carry a night on our own.

27 minutes ago, Cat Burrito said:

Effectively you are an unknown entity so promoters are reluctant to take a chance. It's definitely harder now. Do you do any covers at all? If so I would bill yourself as whatever genre you are and state it is a mix of originals and covers. Then when you do your set that is 95% originals, if it goes down well and people come - you have a foot in the door.

We don't do any covers.  Would that be selling point?  I'm also in a covers band which gigs fairly regularly so I'd prefer to just stick to originals with this band but would do it if it gave us a better chance of getting a gig.

13 minutes ago, Lozz196 said:

When we started out - punk/Oi band - we realised that as unknowns we’d have to work at it, take first on the bill gigs for no money just to get the name out there. We literally contacted the venues/promoters who already had say 3 bands on and said we’d do a 30min set as first band on and for no money. Then turned up early, played and were professional, set up/broke down gear quickly, hung around for the whole event. You might have to do 6 months to a year of this but be patient. The other thing is go to gigs of the type of music, speak to the sound man, promoters, owners etc. Sometimes the personal touch works as face to face they can tell that they’re dealing with someone who they feel they can work with.

Oh yeah I'm not expecting a bean for playing original songs!  I'd be delighted to get to the stage you describe of playing those sorts of gigs regularly.

I keep saying we should go around town and bug some venues, but the rest of the lazy gets don't seem that bothered.  Then again most of the venues I've been in touch with have batted back to me that they only put gigs on through promoters. 

I've thought of the possibility of putting on our own nights, but then you're taking a financial risk and I don't really know any other original bands.

[Cat Burrito]

Lozz's post is really helpful. I play in 4 acts, 3 originals and one covers. The covers circuit is just easier because everybody knows what they are getting. It's about being professional when you do get in as the personal touch goes a long way, but maybe bending to fit to get that all important foot in the door.

[bertbass]

It certainly was this difficult 15 years ago, in fact, it was worse.  No emails then.  No Facebook, no websites only your phone, land line of course and good old Royal Mail who faithfully delivered promo material and demos that were totally ignored.  The only way to find gigs was to read the gig pages in the music press or possibly word of mouth then it was off the the library to read the Yellow Pages to try to find addresses.

 

At least now you can easily find venues to be ignored by!

[Twigman]

36 minutes ago, Lozz196 said:

We literally contacted the venues/promoters who already had say 3 bands on and said we’d do a 30min set as first band on and for no money.

Being in a band that often headlines such shows I would hope the promoter would tell you to fosters off.

It's bad enough when there are 3 bands on the bill but 4? The hassle of doing a swap out with gear on stage - we will not share our backline. The pile up of gear backstage - the cramped backstage - we insist on max 2 support bands and prefer acts with no drummer. I would hope our promoter would tell you to fosters off.

 

[Lozz196]

I’m sure the promoters who agreed to it wouldn’t have if the logistics of the venues couldn’t accommodate an extra band. As I’m equally sure that for every gig which we asked this and got on the bill there were probably 10 where we didn’t due to it not being logistically possible. As a band that now headlines (not every gig though ) we’re more than happy to give opportunities to bands just starting out and to not forget we all had to start somewhere.

[Dankology]

We've found it easier with slightly bigger promoters - the smaller single-handed guys seem to much prefer putting on a night of solo performers but when we've contacted the bigger outfits we've had more luck getting support slots and the dreaded multi-band nights. 

I think it's key to personalise your overtures- if a promoter or venue can tell that you're familar with them and have identified them as appropriate it surely goes down better than a blanket one size fits all message.

Getting to know the promoters and other bands pays massive dividends - we're not shy about turning up to other people's gigs with a pile of CDrs that we hand out as people are leaving.

I'd also make sure you have stuff on all the major online platforms so that you can email someone a list of easily clickable links to suss you out. And videos - always videos, good quality ones, including at least one of you nailing it onstage.

 

The other thing we've done is just cutting out the middleman and putting our own gig on - even (or especially) off the beaten track to build a local following and then later on you get to drag them all into town for a big night out 🐵

Apologies if this is all eggs and grannies but it's what's been working for us. Good luck!

[Tom 24]

I joined my band doing our own punk/oi in January
As Lozz says, you've got to do start at the bottom, be prepared to travel, it's really only after folk have seen you live that they get the gist of you and word gets around that you're good enough for a gig and can be relied on
I'm lovin' it, money means nothing to me when it comes to playing  

[Twigman]

23 minutes ago, Lozz196 said:

I’m sure the promoters who agreed to it wouldn’t have if the logistics of the venues couldn’t accommodate an extra band.

Really?

In my experience promoters are totally ignorant of the logistics at venues.

It's not so much whether the venues can accommodate but the grief caused by swapping gear out between sets. Nothing ever ends up being exactly as it was at the soundcheck.

While I recognise we all had to start somewhere we always try to keep the number of supports to a minimum (prefer 1, 2 at a push - any more and we won't do the gig - apart from 'festivals'). Where possible we insist on no drummer in support bands and we never share backline.

It's our gig after all.

 

[Lozz196]

Well the only reason I’m sure about that is the number of gigs we did when starting out - our gig-getter is somewhat enthusiastic so I’m sure there would have been more requests than acceptances.

I do understand what you mean, we’ve been on 8 band bills in a venue  with only one room to store gear, but if a nightmare to say the least . As a regular gigging band we won’t let bands use amp heads or drum breakables but it’s usually possible to arrange gear shares if the promoter is up to scratch - and luckily many that we deal with are. But not all!

[mcnach]

2 hours ago, Unknown_User said:

Does anyone else find getting gigs for a new band doing original songs is really heavy going?  After emailing loads of venues and promoters I'm finding that I'm mostly getting roundly ignored.  Barely even so much as a "Thanks for your email, get stuffed."  Just one gig has resulted so far.  I'm sure it wasn't this difficult fifteen years or so ago.

Anyone else similarly cheesed off with this endeavour or do you have any top tips (humorous or sensible!) for persuading promoters to give us a half hour somewhere to make a load of noise?

 

Keep trying, but don't become a nuisance.

Find shows with other compatible bands so that you can play on the same evening, maybe book a place yourself and get other bands to support you too... and just keep doing it. It takes time to get traction.

Film a couple of songs and put them on youtube. We've been asked for videos often, when approaching venues that didn't know us.

 

edit: and network! Probably the single most effective way of getting gigs. Go see other bands, talk to them...

Edited May 30, 2019 by mcnach

[Unknown_User]

1 hour ago, mcnach said:

 

Keep trying, but don't become a nuisance.

Find shows with other compatible bands so that you can play on the same evening, maybe book a place yourself and get other bands to support you too... and just keep doing it. It takes time to get traction.

Film a couple of songs and put them on youtube. We've been asked for videos often, when approaching venues that didn't know us.

 

edit: and network! Probably the single most effective way of getting gigs. Go see other bands, talk to them...

Gah!  Going up and talking to people and being friendly and stuff?  I'm no good at that!  Seems a good idea though.  I'll have to try and drag some of the others out to a gig somewhere.

Videos are a good idea too.  We definitely need to work out a way to sort one of those out.  I know playing a few songs in a practice room isn't great but it would be better than nothing. 

[Monkey Steve]

Big +1 for networking with other bands, especially at the gigs you do get. We got more than a few gigs from other bands telling promoters that we were good for a support slot if they needed another band, and returned the favour. 

If nothing else, it builds a good community...although the lot I depped with at Christmas ended up on an unwantedly large bill when two different band members each invited mates bands to play the one support slot and telling the venue/promoter to add them on...ended up with three support acts getting half an hour each rather than two getting the 45 minutes they were all expecting. 

Of course we stuck to our full headline slot and swanned around like rock stars

[mcnach]

44 minutes ago, Unknown_User said:

Gah!  Going up and talking to people and being friendly and stuff?  I'm no good at that!  Seems a good idea though.  I'll have to try and drag some of the others out to a gig somewhere.

Videos are a good idea too.  We definitely need to work out a way to sort one of those out.  I know playing a few songs in a practice room isn't great but it would be better than nothing. 

 

Ha! I know the feeling... It's my least favourite part too. I mean, sometimes I really enjoy talking to someone, but I hate *having to* do it. Fortunately, in my main band we had the singer who was a natural mingler. We got offered many gigs simply because he had made himself known and shared a few beers with the right people. But we should all contribute a bit. At least make ourselves visible and available so that people can approach us. The interpersonal relationships are the most important factor, just like at work really, in order to get and keep good gigs.

Videos... the best are live videos. Venues want to check out what you're like live, not how good your audiovisual production is... but our first video was based on playing back a recording of one of our songs and us playing a long in a rehearsal room. Get a few takes from different angles, edit them together, and add any live footage you can find... quick and dirty, it's far better than having none at all.

This is what we made. It's based on that rehearsal room recording and some video captured at our first album launch a few weeks earlier. For the album launch, we booked the place ourselves. We had been lucky in that we had a regular gig at one of the most popular music bars in town, so we had a bit of an income and we didn't care if we just broke even or even lost some money (we had a band kitty so nobody has to get their hands in their pockets), and just wanted to have a good party. It was a good party and people had a good time, which shows in the video: it was very useful to send to other venues and we got more gigs based on that.

 

 

edit: even a mobile phone video taken by someone walking around can be very useful. And if gets pixelated like this one, all the best as you can't see just how ugly we are 😛

 

 

Edited May 30, 2019 by mcnach

[Unknown_User]

Yeah we only had one gig so far and it was an hour away in the middle of nowhere (at least as far as anyone we know was concerned) so with that and unavailabilty of babysitters for those of us with spouses we all completely failed to bring anyone with us.  So after me spending a fortnight telling everyone to tell the people they bring to take a million photos and videos, we ended up with nothing.  Typical!

So I think practice room stuff will have to suffice for now.  That said the sound man seemed to like us and the venue said they were keen to have us back on so hopefully they weren't just being polite and we'll get another chance to bring some people in soon!

[Monkey Steve]

25 minutes ago, Unknown_User said:

Yeah we only had one gig so far and it was an hour away in the middle of nowhere (at least as far as anyone we know was concerned) so with that and unavailabilty of babysitters for those of us with spouses we all completely failed to bring anyone with us.  So after me spending a fortnight telling everyone to tell the people they bring to take a million photos and videos, we ended up with nothing.  Typical!

So I think practice room stuff will have to suffice for now.  That said the sound man seemed to like us and the venue said they were keen to have us back on so hopefully they weren't just being polite and we'll get another chance to bring some people in soon!

have you followed up and asked them for another gig?  Remind them of the fact that they wanted to have you back

I've certainly done a couple where the venue has put the band low on the bill for a midweek gig that they know nobody will come to, not exactly as an audition, but certainly with an element of keeping an eye out for bands who are worth asking back for better slots.  A Thursday night bottom of the bill gig at the Horn in St Albans (another one to contact direct and ask about gigs) got us invited back for a Saturday night main support as soon as we'd finished the soundcheck (and the Saturday night support got us an invite to play other gigs with the headliner)

[Unknown_User]

1 minute ago, Monkey Steve said:

have you followed up and asked them for another gig?  Remind them of the fact that they wanted to have you back

I've certainly done a couple where the venue has put the band low on the bill for a midweek gig that they know nobody will come to, not exactly as an audition, but certainly with an element of keeping an eye out for bands who are worth asking back for better slots.  A Thursday night bottom of the bill gig at the Horn in St Albans (another one to contact direct and ask about gigs) got us invited back for a Saturday night main support as soon as we'd finished the soundcheck (and the Saturday night support got us an invite to play other gigs with the headliner)

Yeah it was on my follow up asking if they had any more slots available that they said they'd have us back on.  That was ten days ago.  Might be worth a follow up or would that be pestering?

Thanks for the tip, but we're based in Liverpool so St. Albans might be a bit too much of a trek, but I should probably see what places there are to play in Manchester next.

[Monkey Steve]

1 minute ago, Unknown_User said:

Yeah it was on my follow up asking if they had any more slots available that they said they'd have us back on.  That was ten days ago.  Might be worth a follow up or would that be pestering?

Thanks for the tip, but we're based in Liverpool so St. Albans might be a bit too much of a trek, but I should probably see what places there are to play in Manchester next.

for the first point, you need to strike the balance between being keen without being too annoying.  That you are following up and would be really keen to play again whenever there's a suitable slot, rather than "you said you want us back so when's the gig? We're free next Saturday"  Even then, if they haven't followed up by now I doubt they're going to any time soon so you have nothing to lose by giving them a shout, even if they tell you that they were just being polite.  If you don't ask

Can't help you much with any venues in the North West, but I did play Rebellion in Manchester at Christmas, and that's exactly the sort of venue I'm talking about (with the caveat that I didn't book the gig, so I can't say for certain if the venue books their own bands or only hires out to promoters...there is a bit on their website that implies that bands can contact them direct...)

[Unknown_User]

1 hour ago, Monkey Steve said:

for the first point, you need to strike the balance between being keen without being too annoying.  That you are following up and would be really keen to play again whenever there's a suitable slot, rather than "you said you want us back so when's the gig? We're free next Saturday"  Even then, if they haven't followed up by now I doubt they're going to any time soon so you have nothing to lose by giving them a shout, even if they tell you that they were just being polite.  If you don't ask

Can't help you much with any venues in the North West, but I did play Rebellion in Manchester at Christmas, and that's exactly the sort of venue I'm talking about (with the caveat that I didn't book the gig, so I can't say for certain if the venue books their own bands or only hires out to promoters...there is a bit on their website that implies that bands can contact them direct...)

Cheers.  Yeah I'm not a pushy person at all.  Generally more backwards in coming forwards so it doesn't come natural to me to pester people.  So hopefully I'm not too brassy when emailing people!

I'll check Rebellion out and see what, if anything, they come back with!

[Dankology]

2 hours ago, Unknown_User said:

 

Thanks for the tip, but we're based in Liverpool so St. Albans might be a bit too much of a trek, but I should probably see what places there are to play in Manchester next.

We should probably talk...

[Stub Mandrel]

You mean the old technique of going on a pub  crawl round town and handing out demo tapes to any landlords willing to give you a few minutes dopesn't work anymore?