Helix Stomp - Pedal Board Wars!

[Cuzzie]

2 hours ago, Quatschmacher said:

If you set the global mode differently you can have it so that the pedal immediately loads the preset shown. Pressing the encoder jumps in banks of 10. Pressing and holding the encoder then turning it allows you to very quickly scroll to any preset, releasing loads it. 

With any preset-based pedal, a rudimentary midi switching device makes everything much smoother. 

I get you on that and was doing that.

It’s still not Lickety split - jump a bank of ten - take care not to kiss your bank or go all the way around, press and hold, get preset between 1-10, release and lock - it’s not intuitive no matter how good it sounds in the flesh

as we both have said Midi makes it easier.

This is a practical thing and I would have no qualms about PC editing etc.

Its not denigrating the pedal, but it is a faff, and to my ears in a comparison test and in its own right, The Stomp has very useable synth sounds which would make the majority of people happy both player and audience, IMHO especially for those that don’t want to faff too much and have an all in one package.

 

 

[Al Krow]

Agree the FI is a faff - that's its one downside.

I would love to agree that the Stomp can provide usable synth sounds with great tracking when playing quickly, which is one of the key tests for 'live usability' in my book. But that's certainly not been my experience. 

If it did, believe me it would save me spending a tidy sum on an incoming Boss SY-1; this appears to have great tracking but also avoids the 'faff' element of the FI. Although for those of us who are into our synth pedals, the FI retains its crown as arguably still the very best synth pedal for bass in terms of the quality of the sounds it can deliver.

Really happy to be proved wrong on this by a fellow BC'er - I look forward to hearing some decent HX Stomp synth lines on this filter and synth samples thread (there are currently NO HX Stomp synth lines posted, which maybe says something?):

 

Edited August 16, 2019 by Al Krow

[krispn]

I suppose to be proved wrong one would have to have posted some audio examples on which to be disputed. Chicken and egg I suppose! What people find usable and what people find unusable is based on many factors.  Are you trying to copy a HH Chameleon sound or Sir Psycho Sexy? Are you looking to nail a Snarky Puppy thing or a Bruno Mars track? 

All this chat of synth emulation does is create more ambiguity. I asked ages ago  on the synth thread what songs people are covering and for audio examples to hear what could be achieved and only one person responded with a soundscapes/soundtrack vibe tune -  65daysofstaic meets a 70’s sci fi soundtrack and frankly the 15+ pedals on their board probably weren’t needed to get the sounds I heard. 

If someone, anyone, who actually knows how to record their signal chain can post some audio of what can be achieved on a track with a future impact, a stomp or a nasa worthy pedal board et al we can all identify with please step up do so so these basement warriors can be proven valid or otherwise. 

FFS!

Edited August 16, 2019 by krispn

[Al Krow]

54 minutes ago, krispn said:

I suppose to be proved wrong one would have to have posted some audio examples on which to be disputed. Chicken and egg I suppose! What people find usable and what people find unusable is based on many factors.  Are you trying to copy a HH Chameleon sound or Sir Psycho Sexy? Are you looking to nail a Snarky Puppy thing or a Bruno Mars track? 

All this chat of synth emulation does is create more ambiguity. I asked ages ago  on the synth thread what songs people are covering and for audio examples to hear what could be achieved and only one person responded with a soundscapes/soundtrack vibe tune -  65daysofstaic meets a 70’s sci fi soundtrack and frankly the 15+ pedals on their board probably weren’t needed to get the sounds I heard. 

If someone, anyone, who actually knows how to record their signal chain can post some audio of what can be achieved on a track with a future impact, a stomp or a nasa worthy pedal board et al we can all identify with please step up do so so these basement warriors can be proven valid or otherwise. 

FFS!

Have a listen to the last post on the filter and synth thread for a recent example of an FI in action.

FFS 😁

[krispn]

So not one of yours then

A good video though - kudos to that man

Edited August 16, 2019 by krispn

[Al Krow]

2 minutes ago, krispn said:

So not one of yours then

I mentioned in passing to Osiris earlier in the thread, who was pestering me to post a comparison clip of Stomp vs FI, that I moved my FI on a little while back; which makes doing such a clip quite tricky in my experience 😉

I look forward to a BC'er who thinks a Stomp can do something as good on the synth front (perhaps Osiris or Cuzzie?) posting their "evidence". But I'm not going to hold my breath...

In the meantime, let's reasonably conclude synth effects: HX Stomp 0... Future Impact 1

[krispn]

What synth sound would you like them to cop? A few suggestions of a song or tone would be useful.

 

[Al Krow]

4 minutes ago, krispn said:

What synth sound would you like them to cop? A few suggestions of a song or tone would be useful.

I don't want to limit cramp their style. Happy for you to play honest broker

Btw young Ms Krow saw your post as I was replying and strongly recommended I spend some time listening to Snarky Puppy! My lack of knowledge of whom seems to be on par with our 28 yo female lead vocalist not knowing who Buddy Holly was...

[krispn]

I listed at least 4 different generations of funk to choose from.

[krispn]

I'm sure various filters and such could do a good impression of some of these aforementioned tunes. A Red Ripper is available locally which does look interesting but not sure it'll do more than my current cheapie fuzz. I'll defo check out some audio and wrangle a demo if possible. I have stumbled upon a good octave up Royal Blood type thing when trying to do a 90's hiphop demo for the pub band on Logic as a kinda fun mash up for our NYE gig later in the year. At this stage it's just a band only demo but if I expand the pedal board beyond Logic I'll be happy to offer up audio

Edited August 16, 2019 by krispn
I said synth and I meant fuzz.

[Al Krow]

• something relatively easy for a synth that can manage polyphonic: Human League - Don't You Want Me 
• something challenging for monophonic synths: Darude - Sandstorm

Absolutely agree that filter + octave down + dirt = synthy sound.

But that's really a separate point - we are looking at the actual synth engine on the Stomp vs the synth engine on the current 'top 3' bass synth pedals (FI, C4, Boss SY-1 / SYB-300). You won't find most owners of any of these top 3 selling their synth pedals because the Stomp matches their capability, in the way that we might do with other (e.g. octave down, chorus etc).

[krispn]

3 minutes ago, Al Krow said:

.........on the current 'top 3' bass synth pedals (FI, C4, Boss SY-1 / SYB-300).

Is that the consensus and two of which you have yet to own or play....

 

Edited August 16, 2019 by krispn

[Osiris]

46 minutes ago, Al Krow said:

I mentioned in passing to Osiris earlier in the thread, who was pestering me to post a comparison clip of Stomp vs FI, that I moved my FI on a little while back; which makes doing such a clip quite tricky in my experience 😉

I look forward to a BC'er who thinks a Stomp can do something as good on the synth front (perhaps Osiris or Cuzzie?) posting their "evidence". But I'm not going to hold my breath...

In the meantime, let's reasonably conclude synth effects: HX Stomp 0... Future Impact 1

I still don't think you really understand what I was trying to get at. 

Lend me your interface and DAW and I'll see what I can knock up with the Stomp.

If anyone wants me, I'll be listening to this (with nary a synth in sight); 

 

[Al Krow]

12 minutes ago, krispn said:

Is that the consensus and two of which you have yet to own or play....

Yup, just relaying the view of fellow BC'ers who are passionate about bass synths (and whose views I am very happy to trust). Between us we've owned the FI, C4 and SYB-300 (which the SY-1 is based on) and several have owned two of the three.

Bit like taking the word of Dingwall owners that their basses are great, when I've never played one, innit? Or buying a Ken Smith based on the recommendation of 3 BC'ers whose opinions you rate highly and finding that everything they said was spot on.

Edited August 16, 2019 by Al Krow

[Al Krow]

7 minutes ago, Osiris said:

Lend me your interface and DAW and I'll see what I can knock up with the Stomp

Can you not record directly from the Stomp? I've been using a simple Boss RC-30 for my clips.

Edited August 16, 2019 by Al Krow

[krispn]

8 minutes ago, Al Krow said:

Bit like taking the word of Ken Smith owners that their basses are great, when I've never played one, innit?

Amended

[Al Krow]

Amended

Edited August 16, 2019 by Al Krow

[krispn]

Well prior to ownership I mean  - we all have to take a punt on new gear irrespective of opinions

 

[Al Krow]

4 minutes ago, krispn said:

Well prior to ownership I mean  - we all have to take a punt on new gear irrespective of opinions

Ok misunderstood what you meant (apologies). Yes true. However, it's great to get a steer from folk who's views you rate and who have lived with certain gear for a while.

Although having said that I went against the views of a couple of my BC buddies, recently, and got myself a Spector...tbf I did try before I bought.

You're right though, at the end of the day there is no substitute for seeing if it works for us.

Edited August 16, 2019 by Al Krow

[krispn]

8 minutes ago, Al Krow said:

That's bollox mate. 

Yes I'm not disputing your ability to purchase a high end bass. Who am I to question what people spend their money on.

[Al Krow]

PS what was particularly valuable was getting glowing feedback from two of the Ken Smith owners who had moved theirs on (for perfectly legit reasons) - and who clearly had no axe to grind. But were still raving about how fantastic their KS's had been. That counted for a lot to me.

Anyway we digress. This wasn't meant to be a KS appreciation thread  

Edited August 16, 2019 by Al Krow

[krispn]

it isn't

[LukeFRC]

Maybe a less contentious question would be - what’s the limits of synth or whatever a helix can do, and what would you need pedal X for?

Like if you are a complete SVT junkie you’re unlikely to use a multi fx to do it, or if you are really really particular about some random fuzz tone pedal made by a guy in Japan between 1978-81 then a helix is unlikely to scratch that itch... but for a lot of us if it gets 95% there then it probably is good enough, while most folk won’t doubt that it’s probably not ‘the best’. The most interesting comment in the last few pages of this thread was when someone was talking about how the tracking struggled with fast lines, which is something more solid than abstract “better” or “worse” 

[krispn]

@LukeFRC

I'm not a massive 'Ampeg sound' fan but I recall playing along to Celebrity Skin with a stomp (with some tweaks) on the basic Ampeg sound and it nailed it! Now can I employ it on my gigs? Doubtful but was it immensely gratifying to jam along with the track? Yes! The same can be said for some funk tracks. It's not a dead on synth but the Stomp can cop some tones which are 70% good enough for a live audience who might struggle to pick a bass guitar out of a police line up

[Cuzzie]

1 hour ago, LukeFRC said:

Maybe a less contentious question would be - what’s the limits of synth or whatever a helix can do, and what would you need pedal X for?

Like if you are a complete SVT junkie you’re unlikely to use a multi fx to do it, or if you are really really particular about some random fuzz tone pedal made by a guy in Japan between 1978-81 then a helix is unlikely to scratch that itch... but for a lot of us if it gets 95% there then it probably is good enough, while most folk won’t doubt that it’s probably not ‘the best’. The most interesting comment in the last few pages of this thread was when someone was talking about how the tracking struggled with fast lines, which is something more solid than abstract “better” or “worse” 

And that was exactly my point.

Depending on the synth of course, But it will struggle with fast lines surely - any type of envelope, or opening and embellishment of the note would require space, so if you try a fast line on that kind of synth, it will sound pants on any synth