4 or 5

[CameronJ]

12 minutes ago, Cuzzie said:

Also nowt wrong with a fret wrap gently placed to aid the learning process whilst technique impro

Truth

[chris_b]

31 minutes ago, CameronJ said:

. . . . for those who may be new to 5 stringers: I’d strongly argue that the shape of the neck, fingerboard radius and string spacing at the nut are just as important as spacing at the bridge.

. . . I'd also make the point that if your left hand technique is good then the size/depth/width of the fretboard/neck is less important.

If you use a full handed grip on the neck then size/depth/width are going to be noticeable. If you place your thumb in the middle of the neck and arch your fingers over the neck to the strings, so only thumb and fingertips are touching the bass, then the size will be less of an issue.

[Rich]

The thing I love about a 5 is not so much the sub-E notes (although I play with brass, so they do come in handy), but the fact that I can play across the neck rather than just up and down. I find this very useful. Personally I would definitely stick with the 5. Persevere, it will all come good.

There are loads of 18-19mm spaced fivers around. I believe the Yamahas are 19 or even 20 (my RBX certainly was), my Sire V7 is 18. If they were less than 18, I wouldn't get on with them either.

 

[itu]

1 hour ago, CameronJ said:

These are all off the top of my head so I’m happy to be corrected, but the point I’m trying to make is that basses with wider string spacing aren’t uncommon. 

Also, and this isn’t necessarily aimed at you @itu but more for those who may be new to 5 stringers: I’d strongly argue that the shape of the neck, fingerboard radius and string spacing at the nut are just as important as spacing at the bridge. For example, playing an MTD and an Ibanez BTB side by side feels very different...

Yes, thank you, I am aware that they do exist. But I do not understand, why aren't they the norm?

BTB's have nice specs but they do not fit my hands. Your comments on feel is important - I do have that 19 mm as the start, but as you stated, there are lots of other details, too, that affect the overall feel. For the sound and size I would love to own a Steinberger L-2 but the neck is awful. Thick and round like a log. MM SR 5 was everything but wide, as is my Modulus Graphite (wide 5 was not available at the time when I had the money...).

On the other hand, it is good that there are variations of the theme. 14 mm bridge spacing sounds like a mission impossible to me but for someone else that is the thing. But why >4 string spacing is usually less than a 4-string?

[Al Krow]

3 hours ago, itu said:

...But why >4 string spacing is usually less than a 4-string?

Narrower string spacing potentially allows for marginally faster right hand technique and more importantly puts less strain on the left hand, not least by allowing for slimmer necks whilst also avoiding neck dive. These are both more of an issue with 5'ers.

For me, my Ibby SRs with 16.5mm bridge string spacing are an absolute delight to play. But I agree that is at narrow end of what's out there.

18.0mm seems to be a widely accepted compromise between string spacing and not having ridiculously bulky necks. A shout out to the necks on Yammy BB 5ers, they are the opposite of baseball bats and really are very comfortable to play. 

Edited July 10, 2019 by Al Krow

[BreadBin]

Yamaha RBX are 19mm at the bridge.

To counter some of the points above - I find a narrow spacing at the nut gives me pain across the back of my fretting hand.

I have pretty big hands though.

Edited July 10, 2019 by BreadBin

[lozkerr]

10 hours ago, paul_c2 said:

I'm probably not qualified to comment - because I don't own a 5 string  - but I've never seen those lower notes as a sufficient incentive to 'upgrade' to 5 string. I've tried them, in the past, but found the B string was never really touched.

You're right, they're not. The great advantage of the five-string is that you get two full octaves over five frets everywhere on the fretboard. 

I switched from a four to a five about fifteen months ago and I can't see myself ever going back. Keeping the B string quiet took a bit of getting used to, but the main work was in changing the root of each scale. I started with E major and E minor rooting on the fifth fret of the B string; once I had those patterns in my head, the rest was easy.

[stewblack]

I switched to 5 string 10 - 15 years ago. Loved it. Enjoyed the challenge of learning something new, but still familiar. 

Stayed with the 5 for a few years in various bands but one day I just switched back. The 4 felt more comfortable, more natural. Also I suspected that learning the 5 was kind of a distraction from studying the 4.  I was a very long way from a deep understanding of my instrument and I made up my mind to learn more of the 4 before considering other disciplines. 

Happy with my choice, hope you'll be happy with yours. 

[Barking Spiders]

Just never been able to get to grips with fretted 5 stringers. I've always used a lot of slap, double thumbing and plucking and I cant get my thumb and forefinger under the the strings to play quite fast runs. On the other hand I do like 5 string fretlesses and being able to play a bit faster cos of closer string spacings

[Monkey Steve]

5, the answer is 5, always.  5

For the string spacing, Wawick's standard is 19mm for a 4 and 16.5mm for a 5 but goes up to 20mm for a broad neck 5

[Cuzzie]

56 minutes ago, Monkey Steve said:

5, the answer is 5, always.  5

For the string spacing, Wawick's standard is 19mm for a 4 and 16.5mm for a 5 but goes up to 20mm for a broad neck 5

Except when it’s 4

[CameronJ]

8 minutes ago, Cuzzie said:

Except when it’s 4

Heresy.

[Al Krow]

4 hours ago, Barking Spiders said:

Just never been able to get to grips with fretted 5 stringers. I've always used a lot of slap, double thumbing and plucking and I cant get my thumb and forefinger under the the strings to play quite fast runs. On the other hand I do like 5 string fretlesses and being able to play a bit faster cos of closer string spacings

Glad that the ability to play a bit faster with closer string spacings is a 'thing' and not just me spouting off!

But it does conceptually make good sense as you have (marginally) less distance to move your fingers or plectrum.

[Cuzzie]

.

Edited July 11, 2019 by Cuzzie

[Cuzzie]

8 minutes ago, CameronJ said:

Heresy.

I’ll take a stoning for my beliefs big nose

[Monkey Steve]

19 minutes ago, Cuzzie said:

Except when it’s 4

5

always 5

[Cuzzie]

4 minutes ago, Monkey Steve said:

5

always 5

More strings than fingers on the one hand(mostly)

Thats getting into witchcraft territory

[Muzz]

I'm gonna suggest that if the lower notes are the deciding factor, a good pitch shifter will allow a 4 down to that territory without compromise. Two of the bands I'm in have dropped tunings, and I simply have them set on my Helix. Job done.

I've never taken to 5s because I can't be doing with necks much bigger than a Jazz...40mm is about my limit.

[Cuzzie]

5 minutes ago, Muzz said:

I'm gonna suggest that if the lower notes are the deciding factor, a good pitch shifter will allow a 4 down to that territory without compromise. Two of the bands I'm in have dropped tunings, and I simply have them set on my Helix. Job done.

I've never taken to 5s because I can't be doing with necks much bigger than a Jazz...40mm is about my limit.

It’s not a bad suggestion, but reading the OP comments it didn’t sound like a whole drop tune, merely lower notes whatever tuning, and rarely Lower than D, which suggests Drop D on a 4 banger as optimal, this can all be half a step down or even drop C

[Muzz]

Tho the pedal, being an external device, takes away all the compromises with string tension, gauge, feel, setup etc that physical drop tuning can involve. Personally I like a higher tension string, so Drop C would be a bit of a faff. Plus, standard tuning for songs which require/suit it, is just a Stomp* away...

 

* SWIDT? I'll get me coat... 😀

[Cuzzie]

1 minute ago, Muzz said:

Tho the pedal, being an external device, takes away all the compromises with string tension, gauge, feel, setup etc that physical drop tuning can involve. Personally I like a higher tension string, so Drop C would be a bit of a faff. Plus, standard tuning for songs which require/suit it, is just a Stomp* away...

 

* SWIDT? I'll get me coat... 😀

Or a flick with a d tuner

[Muzz]

Can't argue with that - I've got one on all my basses... 🙂

[Cuzzie]

Just now, Muzz said:

Can't argue with that - I've got one on all my basses... 🙂

Things of legends they are

[tauzero]

On 10/07/2019 at 10:53, paul_c2 said:

I'm probably not qualified to comment - because I don't own a 5 string  - but I've never seen those lower notes as a sufficient incentive to 'upgrade' to 5 string. I've tried them, in the past, but found the B string was never really touched. As others have pointed out DADG is really handy (I have sight read in DADG tuning - that's interesting!) and also recently, just to achieve the low Eb, I used EbADG for one song but that's an exception really.

If anything, if I ever switched now I'g go straight for 6 string, or maybe 5 string EADGC.

But, as has been said on BC thousands of times, the lower notes aren't the only reason to use a 5-string. You can do more across and less up and down.