MoonBassAlpha Posted July 11, 2019 Share Posted July 11, 2019 1 hour ago, Muzz said: "The popular tourist event at Edinburgh Castle wants to double its turnover to £20m by 2025..." Like I say, skint... Don't confuse turnover with profit though. ^ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ped Posted July 11, 2019 Share Posted July 11, 2019 Photographers have had the same problem for a long time - normally offered the 'opportunity' to photograph some idiot's wedding for 'Instagram exposure' - usually by people who say things like 'wow that camera takes great pictures' 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gjones Posted July 11, 2019 Share Posted July 11, 2019 Dont get me started about playing for free in Edinburgh during the Festival/Fringe. Exploitation is everywhere up here during the summer. Somebody is making money but it ain't the performers. 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DoubleOhStephan Posted July 11, 2019 Share Posted July 11, 2019 19 minutes ago, ped said: 'wow that iPhone takes great pictures' Fixed it for you 😉😁 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dood Posted July 11, 2019 Share Posted July 11, 2019 Yay! Exposure has successfully paid my mortgage for over ten years now! I am SO pleased to see another opportunity for some exposure bills to help keep me just about alive. Hurrahhhh for those who should know better! 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dan Dare Posted July 11, 2019 Share Posted July 11, 2019 Some types of exposure can even land you in gaol... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Muzz Posted July 11, 2019 Share Posted July 11, 2019 1 hour ago, MoonBassAlpha said: Don't confuse turnover with profit though. ^ Unsurprisingly, I couldn't find any profit figures...but with a turnover in ten figures, if they'd be seriously compromised by the wages bill for the band, I'll play my next gig for nowt... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EliasMooseblaster Posted July 11, 2019 Share Posted July 11, 2019 2 hours ago, Cuzzie said: I applaud the statement. This is not meant to be derogatory in any way, but...... How much teeth do the MU have? Can it affect a change for something like this? I'd hazard a guess that the most effective thing they can do is encourage musicians not to volunteer for it. The thing is, that although it's pretty s***ty of REMT to expect highly qualified musicians to play without receiving a fee, there's nothing illegal about it. Nobody's rounding up vagrant violinists or homeless harpists and forcing them to play; their participation would be entirely voluntary. In REMT's defence, it looks like they've been (reasonably) upfront about what they are willing and not willing to pay for - to be honest, getting your housing and food paid for is a step above what I've received for some gigs in the past! And nobody's being forced to do it against their will. There may well be some musicians who feel charitable towards the Tattoo and wish to do play it just for the fun of it. That's up to them. I hope there are not too many highly-qualified-but-very-naive musicians who hope that playing this event will help them tap into some treasure trove of more lucrative opportunities; unfortunately many of us only learn from making these mistakes in the first place. In any case, REMT aren't breaking any laws, which limits what action the MU can take from a legal standpoint. But, as I say, their attitude towards the musicians' livelihoods is pretty s***ty - hopefully it will deter a lot of suitably qualified musicians from volunteering their time for such an event, and if they come a-cropper and have to pay for appropriate musicians at short notice, perhaps that will teach them a lesson. So now we just have to hope for a shortage of applicants, the better that justice might prevail... 2 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
taunton-hobbit Posted July 11, 2019 Share Posted July 11, 2019 Just out of interest, MU are probably aware of this campaign by Equity (I'm a member btw) - www.equity.org.uk/getting-involved/campaigns/professionally-made-professionally-paid/ 😎 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Newfoundfreedom Posted July 11, 2019 Share Posted July 11, 2019 3 hours ago, fretmeister said: Spam their facebook with explanations as to what a crap idea it is Done! 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Muzz Posted July 11, 2019 Share Posted July 11, 2019 Unfortunately, they only have to find, for example, one bassist who'll fall for this, and their job is done. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Newfoundfreedom Posted July 11, 2019 Share Posted July 11, 2019 Just now, Muzz said: Unfortunately, they only have to find, for example, one bassist who'll fall for this, and their job is done. If they do we could always send the boys round the night before the first performance. 😂 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Muzz Posted July 11, 2019 Share Posted July 11, 2019 Or somebody very talented could pass the audition for me, and then I'll turn up. That'll teach them. What're they gonna do, dock my wages? 😀 8 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Delberthot Posted July 11, 2019 Share Posted July 11, 2019 And play Black Sabbath bass lines to every song 1 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EliasMooseblaster Posted July 11, 2019 Share Posted July 11, 2019 50 minutes ago, Muzz said: Unfortunately, they only have to find, for example, one bassist who'll fall for this, and their job is done. What if they could only find a bassist who would fall for it...would the Edinburgh Tattoo be brave enough to have an extended bass solo as its musical accompaniment? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
goblin Posted July 11, 2019 Share Posted July 11, 2019 As they say, turnover is vanity, profit is sanity! The problem I'm seeing with it being seen as a good way to get experience blah blah blah... I've done a music degree, I've been gigging for a living for around 6 years now... not once have I ever thought "damn, I wish I'd done that gig for the exposure". I just can't see how anyone in the right mind would see this as beneficial for their career. That, and they're saying professional standard etc. I've found that people fresh out of college generally speaking aren't of a professional standard. Hard truth, but that's only the start. It's like passing your driving test. Yeah, you can do this, that and the other. It's only when you're out in the real world doing it, you then develop properly. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dood Posted July 11, 2019 Share Posted July 11, 2019 6 hours ago, Dan Dare said: Some types of exposure can even land you in gaol... At least once there I'd have my meals paid for lol! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ambient Posted July 11, 2019 Share Posted July 11, 2019 It is accommodation and food only, there’s no wages. That’s been confirmed. Whoever does this, assuming they’ll get someone, will have spent hundreds of hours getting their skills together, and they want them to play for nothing. I think it’s terrible. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tauzero Posted July 11, 2019 Share Posted July 11, 2019 8 hours ago, Dood said: Yay! Exposure has successfully paid my mortgage for over ten years now! I am SO pleased to see another opportunity for some exposure bills to help keep me just about alive. Hurrahhhh for those who should know better! https://newsthump.com/2019/06/27/freelancers-landlord-happy-for-rent-to-be-paid-in-exposure/ 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jean-Luc Pickguard Posted July 11, 2019 Share Posted July 11, 2019 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LukeFRC Posted July 11, 2019 Share Posted July 11, 2019 11 hours ago, Cuzzie said: Is it much different from other acts at the festival? Took an act there for a 1 week run, had to fundraise and pay for venue hire, travel, accommodation etc. All ourselves, people had to buy tickets to see us The Tattoo is completely different to Edinburgh International Festival and even The Edinburgh Fringe. The one you're thinking of, and preformed at would have probably have been the fringe. That tends to be big comedy gigs that make money and then everyone else spending money to put on their shows. I'm not sure if how many acts break even. Quality can vary. I spent £15 I didn't want to once while unemployed listening to a shite Londoner spend half an hour talk about erectile disfunction. I also had free shows in a cafe I ran that were really really good. The International is the orchestras, opera, comedy and more "high" culture type stuff. Usually at very high levels of quality. The end of festival fireworks is possibly the best fireworks display ever, set to live music. Tattoo is all the marching bands, the terraces by the castle and fireworks waking you up at about 11pm every night for a month. Tourists love it. They can probably afford to pay for musicians... even if it's not much once they shell out for august priced accommodation for the band! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SubsonicSimpleton Posted July 11, 2019 Share Posted July 11, 2019 They must be a bit skint after the Duke lost his no claims bonus. 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted July 12, 2019 Share Posted July 12, 2019 Every opportunity offered without pay is another nail in the coffin of playing music being a vocation rather than a hobby. The fact they’re upfront about it makes little difference. What a sh*t society we live in. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jazzmaster62 Posted July 12, 2019 Share Posted July 12, 2019 I've turned down a lot of gigs recently on the principal that the person booking the gig does not understand I would rather be paid than do it for 'exposure'. The first line is always "How many tickets can you sell?" or "How many people can you bring?". I ask if there will be a set fee, which there never is, then am countered with "You get £1 back for every ticket you sell!" so they get to keep the remaining £4 and then in effect it has become pay to play... 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skidder652003 Posted July 12, 2019 Share Posted July 12, 2019 16 hours ago, Newfoundfreedom said: Done! Done as well Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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