Stevie’s 12” FRFR Cab Build Thread (Basschat Cab v3)

[stevie]

16 hours ago, Ghost_Bass said:

Regarding the finish, after achieving the leather effect, do you think it would be possible to remove the shine of the tuff-cab simply by scrubbing it with steel wool?

@funkle, could you please try this, if you have some steel wool at hand, in one of your test blocks?

If it works it may give a more convincing leather look without any shine.

I'm not sure steel wool is a great idea. As Luke says, a roughed-up surface is likely to attract dirt.

I've been using gloss black paint on my grilles and then flattening the finish with clear lacquer. It's invisible, provides extra protection and takes away the shine to leave a satin matt finish. I used it on the grille I sent to funkle.

This is the kind of thing: <https://www.toolstation.com/plastikote-quick-dry-clear-lacquer-spray-paint/p56142>

- although there are lots of other companies making a similar thing.

I used a Baufix satin lacquer from Lidl and have a bit left in the can. I'll try it out on the bottom of my cab and let you know how it works.

The new 'pro' Tuff Cab is less shiny than the original stuff, but it's definitely not matt.

 

[Ghost_Bass]

4 hours ago, stevie said:

I'm not sure steel wool is a great idea. As Luke says, a roughed-up surface is likely to attract dirt.

(...)

 

It was just an idea, like people use to do in the necks of high gloss finishes, it makes them smoother and with a matt look. In theory it should give a more convincing leather look.

I also don't think it will atract that much dirt, it will still be washable with a damp cloth, not much diferent from a tolex cover or a very textured tuff-cab finish, a carpet cover will be way worse.

Cheers

[funkle]

I’ll try it when I can. That will put the matter to rest. But first much more high volume testing, when I’m at home again. 

[funkle]

A quick update after a lot more testing and a band rehearsal. 

I have measured the distance between the central woofer dome and the rear of the grille and I now have 37-38mm of space. That should be plenty for the woofer excursion. If it hits the grill, the driver is going to die...or is already dead...

I sat down with my test setup and a comparison cab. 

The One10 is about half the size of the BC 112, lol. 

It’s actually not a bad cab to compare to. Long throw driver, well braced, rated for 250W though apparently will take up to 500W with clean sounds. So it’s a potent little driver, albeit a 10”. 

I maxed out the volume available from the One10 with the amp set optimally flat and the Gain at 3 o’clock and the Master at 12 o’clock. At that point I could distort the woofer with note accents.

The One10 gives a very satisfying low end, easily comparable to the BC 112, but only up to a certain volume. I’ll call it jazz gig volume. It’s very good, but there are limits. it also takes a huge amount of bass boost before it farts out. Veiled top end, but enough, just. The cab clearly adds more colouration to the sound as it gets louder.  It’s a nice colour and it really suits bass. It’s a great cab.

Swapped over to the BC 112, leaving the amp set optimally flat. Gain at 3 o’clock and Master at 12 o’clock, as before. The upper mids and treble sparkle and the clarity is great. As expected, really. Cranked in max bass boost on the amp and the cab tolerated it at this level. Impressive for such abuse.

Put bass back to flat on the amp and turned up. Could get the woofer to fart out with accents with Gain at 3 o’clock and the Master at 3 o’clock. It was stupendously loud; the wall and window shaking volume I described previously that will drown out any drummer and will definitely keep up with a full band. It remains clear at volume.

Slapping at that point caused a click noise which I suspect might have been the voice coil hitting the back plate, or just a very unpleasant transient. It didn’t sound natural so I stopped doing that. (If it was the woofer travelling beyond Xdamage it would have been wrecked. It obviously wasn’t...lol...). Adding any bass boost at this point also caused woofer distortion. 

I am confident that this is the mechanical limits of how far the cabinet can go. I won’t go near this again; the amp can give a lot more but it will kill the cab.

I started adding an HPF but had to stop to pick up the kids. 

Took the cab out to a very moderate volume keys/sax jazz rehearsal. Carrying it around was easy. Had to turn down the bass frequencies at the amp; otherwise I just plugged and played. Great sounds all night. The band loved it and the keys player may want to build his own after we tried the keys through it and it sounded amazing. I may have retired my One10 from the moderate volume jazz stuff.

I have concluded two things. 

1. The setting of volume knobs on the amp is not a good indicator of the power getting delivered. Basically this amp is very powerful and can distort woofers at settings far less than maximum. Not a surprise. 

2. The BC 112 is a very capable cab. 

The BC cab reminds me a bit of the Faital-loaded Berg CN112. The same smoothness of the mids, mainly. However that cab was a little bass-shy; the BC 112 has more lows (more like the BF BB2). And the high end is smoother sounding than the CN112 as well, and extends higher also.

I’m probably only going to bother with an HPF for loud gigs or rehearsals. In my ordinary use it doesn’t look like it will be necessary. 
 

Edited September 24, 2019 by funkle

[funkle]

I’m really looking forward to hearing thoughts from other people, and seeing their builds. 
 

@Ghost_Bass I’m not sure if I’ll get to the trials of steel wool on the finish. I’m happy with how it looks and I just want to play it, lol. 

 

[LukeFRC]

@funkle - do you want the rest of us adding our builds on this thread? 
 

[Chienmortbb]

1 hour ago, LukeFRC said:

@funkle - do you want the rest of us adding our builds on this thread? 
 

We should probably put them on the builds forum.

[funkle]

@LukeFRC I’m easy. I’m delighted for everyone to put theirs here. Equally, if it feels like it could be clunky, builders can start their own. 

Edited September 26, 2019 by funkle

[stevie]

On 24/09/2019 at 19:13, funkle said:

 

@Ghost_Bass I’m not sure if I’ll get to the trials of steel wool on the finish. I’m happy with how it looks and I just want to play it, lol. 

 

I tried out the clear matt spray and it worked fine. It takes the sheen off without changing the colour. I reckon the Plastikote one would be even better, as that's an acrylic paint, the same as the Tuff Cab.

[stevie]

8 hours ago, LukeFRC said:

@funkle - do you want the rest of us adding our builds on this thread? 
 

Sounds like a good idea to me. However, it would be good if we could have a private message thread where all current builders could ask for advice without boring the pants off the entire Basschat population.

I think there is a maximum number of participants in any pm conversation, isn't there?

[Pea Turgh]

6 minutes ago, stevie said:

 ... ask for advice without boring the pants off the entire Basschat population.

Ha!  I read that as “without being pants down to the entire Basschat population”.

Was going to direct you to related subject;

 

[stewblack]

8 minutes ago, stevie said:

Sounds like a good idea to me. However, it would be good if we could have a private message thread where all current builders could ask for advice without boring the pants off the entire Basschat population.

I think there is a maximum number of participants in any pm conversation, isn't there?

We could set up a WhatsApp or messenger chat? 

[RichardH]

Why not just have a thread for advice - those who don't want to read it can ignore it, but it may well be useful to others thinking about building etc.

Separate threads for each person's build sounds like the way to go IMO - easier to follow progress that way.

[LukeFRC]

9 hours ago, stevie said:

Sounds like a good idea to me. However, it would be good if we could have a private message thread where all current builders could ask for advice without boring the pants off the entire Basschat population.

I think there is a maximum number of participants in any pm conversation, isn't there?

The one downside of this is how much I’ve learned from reading advice build threads on here, bassich and Talkbass  - it’s often in them that the “try this technique” type comments come out. Example being the tuffcab/leather effect funkle went for was originally found in a fearful cab build thread. 

My guess is more than a few people will build these themselves without the kit. 

[LukeFRC]

10 hours ago, stevie said:

I tried out the clear matt spray and it worked fine. It takes the sheen off without changing the colour. I reckon the Plastikote one would be even better, as that's an acrylic paint, the same as the Tuff Cab.

Careful with plasticoat on top of anything.... test it first as it adheres by melting the first layer of plastic slightly.... as a sculpture student in slightly different uses we found it horrid stuff and used the better and cheaper Molitow graff paint

[stevie]

My experience with Plastikote goes back to a time when I was involved in speaker cab manufacturing. Grilles for all the models were normally powder coated. However, when we needed to produce a small batch of grilles in a hurry, we used to paint them with Hammerite or Plastikote black spray paint, which at the time were pretty much the same. Their formulations may have changed since then, and the Hammerite spray is now a lot more expensive, but the end result was indistinguishable from powder coating.

That was painting straight onto bare mild steel. When I tried the Baufix spray on the Tuff Cab coating as I described earlier, it initially softened the paint, but  then hardened up after a day or two. So I reckon that the Plastikote clear acrylic matt spray would be ideal but haven't tried it myself.

 

[stevie]

1 hour ago, LukeFRC said:

The one downside of this is how much I’ve learned from reading advice build threads on here, bassich and Talkbass  - it’s often in them that the “try this technique” type comments come out. Example being the tuffcab/leather effect funkle went for was originally found in a fearful cab build thread. 

My guess is more than a few people will build these themselves without the kit. 

Maybe we should just keep it all in this thread in that case. When Pete was building his cab, we were in touch regularly by pm; we reached page seven in the end. Quite a lot of the information that was exchanged will be useful to other builders.

 

[funkle]

I've tried to put as much info here as I can that Stevie and I exchanged....however I may need to go back over the PMs exchanged and see if there is more to add.

[stevie]

I have a few things to point out before people start building, but then it will be up to the builders to ask questions as they go. One thing I do remember is that you asked for a pictorial wiring diagram, Pete, which I'll post before everyone starts wiring their cabs up.

One cab kit has been collected so far, and I hope to send two out today.

[stevie]

RichardH, who produced the fantastic drawings and diagrams on page 1 of this thread, has stepped forward and produced a really neat pictorial wiring diagram that will make wiring up very easy.

I'll get it onto page 1 eventually, but here it is for reference. I just love the community spirit here.

[Chienmortbb]

Just picked my kit up from Stevie. I am really excited as, when the “continued” thread started, I built the prototype on which much of the initial development was done. I have been gigging versions of this cabinet for over two years now and have never regretted it.

I will put as much as I can on here as I build it. 

Edited October 3, 2019 by Chienmortbb

[Chienmortbb]

Dry fit done. I realised after looking at the photo that I had left off the four of the five small braces but like any good journalist, I won’t let the truth spoil a good story. 

[stevie]

It's REALLY important that you do a dry fit before you do anything else. That way, you can be sure that you have all the parts and that they fit.

The rebates on this batch seem to be a bit tighter than on funkle's first one. However, I've measured them and they aren't undersized. If you feel that any of the panels are a bit tight in the rebates, take a piece of 40-grit sandpaper (which you'll need later to round off the corners of the cab) and rub it along the edges of the rebate a few times -  then round off the corners of the mating panel slightly.

[stevie]

Here's an article on wood joint strength:https://woodgears.ca/joint_strength/glue_methods.html

What I took away from this is that you should not apply excessive force to a joint when gluing but you should apply glue to all mating surfaces.

[Chienmortbb]

I agree with Stevie, I used sandpaper on the edges and used a rubber faced-mallet to tap them into place. It is remarkable how strong the structure is without glue.