Parallel Lines a Serial Killer?

[dannybuoy]

1 hour ago, Al Krow said:

HX Stomp is defo a good suggestion to follow up on. I think the only two downsides to using the HX Stomp for parallel routing are:

(i) although it has two FX loops, each loop takes up a 'block' so you're at risk of only having 4 blocks left out of the already limited (some would say) 6 blocks on offer at the outset;

(ii) not everyone reading this thread has a Stomp!

Just come across this neat piece of kit - circa £55 which will take up minimal board space and allows two effects loops (probably for synth and dirt in my case), which should be plenty to be getting on with for those of us just starting to get into parallel routing.

 

That looper does not do parallel, were you intended on using it in combination with another blender?

[Al Krow]

13 minutes ago, dannybuoy said:

That looper does not do parallel, were you intended on using it in combination with another blender?

Nope - and that's really helpful to know thank you. If it can't do parallel, why would you bother having it, other than being able to click on say three pedals in Loop 1 with one stomp rather than needing to engage them all separately with three stomps?

[dannybuoy]

That's precisely what it's for. Or for taking or pedals that suffer from tonesuck when bypassed out of your chain. It's just a mini version of the longer true bypass loops you often see on boards.

Edited August 27, 2019 by dannybuoy

[stewblack]

Playing with my TPM this evening, using just two send and returns. Blending a synth sound I've built on the B3 with a warm fuzzy old school distortion -  blending both, of course, with the clean signal. 

No need to mess with wet/dry mix on the Zoom just max out the wet signals, everything gets mixed on the TPM. 

So different from having the effects in series. I ended up with three different sounds. One synthy, one clean and one overdriven. I could alter their characteristics by increasing or decreasing the send volume, and the overall tone of each too. Then I got to decide how much of each to have in the mix with individual return volumes, and a dedicated volume for my clean signal. Oh, and a master volume to offset against all the other parameters. (Take down clean signal increase master = increasing all the loops equally compared to the clean sound). 

This all allowed me phenomenal control over the final sound. I could wind the drive around to crazy levels but reduce its volume so it produced a kind of audio penumbra around the clean sound. Or have it just breaking up and running alongside the clean. This lends definition to the distorted notes and allows me to set tone controls where they produced the most pleasing overdrive sound without worrying about losing bottom, or mid or top or whatever as those are all still present in the clean sound. Or have a toppy clean sound running together with a muddy distortion. Or a rich rounded clean bottom end with an aggressive snarling upper mid range distortion. And on and on. 

Oh and all this before blending in the synth which is effectively three pedals in series, with their overall sound in parallel with the two other sounds described above. The envelope and glitchy synth having precisely zero effect on my distortion which remains exactly as I like it. 

This pedal also allows me to Royal Blood the whole thing by sending my signal to two different amps. But that's for the future  I still have another loop to fill!

Edited August 28, 2019 by stewblack
add pic

[Al Krow]

@stewblackthat sounds awesome!

You're clearly a convert to parallel routing and I suspect about to convert a whole bunch of us in the process!

Some Soundcloud clips of your set up in parallel vs in series would be great to have as and when you get chance. 

[DanOwens]

I had a 5-loop pedal built for me. I put an M13 in one loop into a guitar amp (no return), had the audio out from my microkorg (pitch to midi) in another, had a board of singles in one loop (moogerfooger etc) and had an Adrenalinn 2 in one loop. The band was live DnB and we were all midi clocked. 

I loved the way I could build synth textures from multiple sources, and play with the ADSR settings of each loop so it sounded like multiple parts. I loved that set up, but I HATED setting it up. The loop pedal was fussy about power, often stages didn't have enough space. But the sound was immense!

[stewblack]

4 hours ago, Al Krow said:

@stewblackthat sounds awesome!

You're clearly a convert to parallel routing and I suspect about to convert a whole bunch of us in the process!

Some Soundcloud clips of your set up in parallel vs in series would be great to have as and when you get chance. 

I shall gladly do as you ask but side by side comparison is going to be a challenge because the endless variety of the parallel set up is its strength. Flexibility rather than a specific different sound. 

But a simple three pedals in parallel and then the same three in series I can do

[stewblack]

OK, obviously it's bass so you don't need to be reminded quality headphones or big speakers required! As ever the subtlety is in the deep end.

This is literally straightforward side by side. Three pedals OD, American sound and auto wah first parallel then no changes at all just same but in series. I still feel we're in apples and oranges territory because I would change the settings if I was running this set up in series to blend more clean sound. Also the wah was a little quiet in the parallel set up I realise after recording it. However the differences are clear. The distortion is obviously affecting the wah or vice versa.

Thing to remember you may say hey but I like these pedals together in seies, well that's cool have two three or four in series but have them in their own parallel loop!

My conclusion? Neither is definitively better, subjective innit?! But the parallel is more 'grown up'

Edited August 28, 2019 by stewblack

[dannybuoy]

Parallel definitely sounds better there, but I'm not a fan of dirt into filter unless you're going for synth sounds. My choice would have been filter into dirt in series!

[stewblack]

1 hour ago, dannybuoy said:

Parallel definitely sounds better there, but I'm not a fan of dirt into filter unless you're going for synth sounds. My choice would have been filter into dirt in series!

Yep and there's the rub.  How do you compare two such different systems? The series set up will alter dependant on pedal order, the parallel on mix levels 

 

[Stofferson]

I use a boss ls-2 for fuzz

set it on A and B so both loops are on when engaged,

Loop A - Russian muff into a GEB-7 set to mids

Loop B - nothing - clean signal to keep low end.

Cuts nicely

[javi_bassist]

The Russian muff is incredibly good when used in series. But in parallel it goes to a whole new level. I really love it. I also kept the overdrive and the chorus in the loop, but my main thought it was to try it with the muff.

[Al Krow]

2 hours ago, javi_bassist said:

The Russian muff is incredibly good when used in series. But in parallel it goes to a whole new level. I really love it. I also kept the overdrive and the chorus in the loop, but my main thought it was to try it with the muff.

What difference in sound are you getting with it in parallel? 

[mcnach]

On 24/08/2019 at 09:13, Al Krow said:

I've currently got all the pedals on my board set up in series. Simples! 

How about you guys? Any of you using any of your pedals in parallel loops on your boards (or possibly even in your amp's fx loop)? 

If so, be really interested in your thinking behind this and what improvement to the sound it's delivering; what pedals you have in parallel and what you've left in series and what your board set-ups look like (pics very welcome!)?

Are you just using the effects loops on existing pedals or have a separate dedicated pedal (e.g. a Boss LS2)? 

Cheers, AK

 

Not at the moment, but I used a LS2 for two reasons in the past. One, to blend in clean bass together with either an overdrive or an envelope filter. Two, to be able to switch two pedals at once easily (phaser, octave, overdrive and envelope filter all in the loop).

[stewblack]

48 minutes ago, mcnach said:

 

Not at the moment, but I used a LS2 for two reasons in the past. One, to blend in clean bass together with either an overdrive or an envelope filter. Two, to be able to switch two pedals at once easily (phaser, octave, overdrive and envelope filter all in the loop).

This is another reason for going parallel. My octave pedal produces exactly the sound I want but benefits from a small eq tweak and volume boost so I run it in series with a bass graphic eq. Placed in a loop they both get turned on with one switch