paul, the Posted October 13, 2007 Author Share Posted October 13, 2007 I suppose APC can't insure due to not having responsibility for the third party couriers. And they have to use them to have competitive prices. Sameday might be premium service that presumably they take themselves allowing for viable insurance. I'm still confused though so I hope this gets cleared up. If it gets dragged out I'll get on the phone too. I'll update tomorrow as there's some Chinese cinema on in half an hour. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paul, the Posted October 13, 2007 Author Share Posted October 13, 2007 (edited) OK, from what I can gather from recent posts; as APC and [url="http://www.uksameday.co.uk/"]UK SameDay[/url] have different insurance policies, they ought to have separate reviews on the first page. Warwickhunt, I'm not giving APC -1 because you disagree with their insurance policies. Citylink are up on here because people use/have used them (presumably with their work account?) - Perhaps folk considering using their Citylink work account to send a personal item will be deterred by this thread. [quote name='paul, the' post='69280' date='Oct 3 2007, 10:18 PM']What's the deal with citylink? Do you have to have an account which you must continually use (eg. at least one delivery a week)? - Or is this only when posting outside mainland UK? Could someone please clarify so that I can put it in the notes.[/quote] But thanks for clearing that up. ---- If you feel that APC has lied/misguided/grossly mistreated you (that's the company, not BC members' recommendations) then they deserve a -1. Let me know if this is still the case. I don't know why APC couldn't give you a quote verbally. I gave them a ring with details at the ready and they gave me a price - great service. They also told me whether I had missed today's pickup and what time I should expect them to pickup tomorrow (if that's what I so wished). --- This all has got to be confirmed and cleaned up before I update though. --- [url="http://www.uksameday.co.uk/services.html"]UK SameDay[/url], confusingly, also have a 'Next Day Delivery' service among others, so it might be worth looking into that and the insurance possibilities and prices. Although this could just be APC again. __________________________________ It's looking at the moment (from page 3): Add [url="http://www.uksameday.co.uk/index.html"]UK SameDay[/url] Add [url="http://www.p4d.co.uk/"]Parcels 4 Delivery[/url] UK SameDay +1 ANC -1 APC stays the same *APC - [b]no[/b] insurance for [b]non[/b]-account holders *UK SameDay - (inclusive) insurance £13 per Kg *CityLink - requires business account with minimum weekly delivery limit. Supply specific links to insurance details Add relevant BC pages in notes [b]Remind people to add the type of item, the price of the service and what the service includes (insurance?)[/b] ----------------------------------------------- If any of that is inaccurate, let me know before I upd*te. So the search continues for a reasonably priced courier with excellent service and flexible insurance on cased instruments. Although, I'm hoping for dlloyd to jump in with a comment. And I'm looking forward to hearing of your experience with Interparcel, Warwickhunt. - They're mentioned on a few BC pages and it's mostly praise. Edited October 13, 2007 by paul, the Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
warwickhunt Posted October 13, 2007 Share Posted October 13, 2007 Interparcel delivered the bass safe and sound and it cost £40 (inc insurance). No issues or problems so they seem OK! When you say I disagree with APC's insurance policy that's a bit of a misnomer... they have a very clear policy, you can't insure it with them. Looking at the start of the thread the first courier up there is APC with +4 and no negatives, with people giving it praise left right and centre, that's why I went to use them before any other. However, as members of the general public our valuable instruments wouldn't be covered AT ALL. I'd love some of the APC users who've commented on this thread to give us some insight into how they feel knowing that they had no insurance when they sent their instruments, I'd be furious. Be assured I've checked yet again that APC's policy is no insurance to non-account holders, I rang a different branch yesterday afternoon and asked for a quote to send a guitar to London and I wanted it insured; I got a quote for £15 but was told there was no insurance cover nor could it be purchased separate! I don't have any beef with APC they are well within their rights to only offer insurance to account holders, hence I wouldn't argue that they warrant any negativity but let's get real, it certainly needs a big red flag to warn people that their instrument won't be insured at all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
silverfoxnik Posted October 13, 2007 Share Posted October 13, 2007 [quote name='warwickhunt' post='73664' date='Oct 13 2007, 08:16 AM']Interparcel delivered the bass safe and sound and it cost £40 (inc insurance). No issues or problems so they seem OK! When you say I disagree with APC's insurance policy that's a bit of a misnomer... they have a very clear policy, you can't insure it with them. Looking at the start of the thread the first courier up there is APC with +4 and no negatives, with people giving it praise left right and centre, that's why I went to use them before any other. However, as members of the general public our valuable instruments wouldn't be covered AT ALL. I'd love some of the APC users who've commented on this thread to give us some insight into how they feel knowing that they had no insurance when they sent their instruments, I'd be furious. Be assured I've checked yet again that APC's policy is no insurance to non-account holders, I rang a different branch yesterday afternoon and asked for a quote to send a guitar to London and I wanted it insured; I got a quote for £15 but was told there was no insurance cover nor could it be purchased separate! I don't have any beef with APC they are well within their rights to only offer insurance to account holders, hence I wouldn't argue that they warrant any negativity but let's get real, it certainly needs a big red flag to warn people that their instrument won't be insured at all.[/quote] This whole thing is pretty confusing about APC, but I can only react based upon my experience of using them and their network. So..This morning, the speaker that UK SameDay (via the APC network) were delivering for me, arrived safe and sound. Not only that, it was a day early and there wasn't an extra charge for a Saturday delivery, which some couriers like Parcelforce will charge you for. Communication along the way was excellent; they even rang me yesterday to say they couldn't get it to me Friday, so it would have to be Saturday morning. I didn't mind because I'd paid for a 3 day service and wasn't even expecting it until Monday! Even better still, this service turned out to be £14.00 cheaper than Parcelforce quoted me, until Parcelforce realised they couldn't ship something over 30 kg, which this speaker is, so they withdrew that quote?? I suppose the only way to really discover if the insurance UK SameDay quoted me is valid, would be if the item was damaged or lost in transit and I had to start making a claim? Fortunately, that hasn't been the case.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
warwickhunt Posted October 13, 2007 Share Posted October 13, 2007 As you say Nik, it was delivered safe and sound and no need to test out insurance liability, so a happy customer; just like I was with Interparcel. However, can you put hand on heart and say that you'd send a £500-£1000+ fragile instrument like a bass without knowing full well that you'd be covered? Even with insurance I always have a bit of a sleepless night or two if I sent anything through a courier, I couldn't even begin to imagine what I'd be like if I wasn't insured or I wasn't 100% clear on the T&C of the insurance. Ideally I'd like to hear from people who've had to make claims against couriers, as that's the real test of any insurance cover... then again even if someone was paid full compensation for a claim would I want to use the courier after they'd trashed someone else's gear Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paul, the Posted October 13, 2007 Author Share Posted October 13, 2007 [quote name='warwickhunt' post='73664' date='Oct 13 2007, 08:16 AM']When you say I disagree with APC's insurance policy that's a bit of a misnomer... they have a very clear policy, you can't insure it with them.[/quote] It's not a misnomer. You wanted to give them -1 because they don't insure. As you say, they have the right to only insure account holders. You are in disagreement with their insurance policy, wanted to scold them for it and that is not the nature of the thread. [quote name='warwickhunt' post='72266' date='Oct 10 2007, 04:50 PM']Sorry but that is a big -1 for APC from me.[/quote] [quote name='warwickhunt' post='73664' date='Oct 13 2007, 08:16 AM']I wouldn't argue that they warrant any negativity but let's get real, it certainly needs a big red flag to warn people that their instrument won't be insured at all.[/quote] I agree with this and will put it in bold. I'll leave them above ParcelForce though as I don't think APC have been misleading, they [b]have[/b] undisclosed important information though. I'm neither shocked nor horrified Perhaps I'm a cynic, but I would assume that a package is not being insured and that is something I would have to inquire about. It's not ideal of course, every website should have a coherent insurance section. But that's not the case. I'm sorry you feel the thread has wronged you but I don't think a 'comprehensive list' has yet to be made as the highest number of reviews for a single company is 4 and there is very few notes. It is your APC not insuring non-account holders that is the important discovery though - and I thank you for it! I think more important than the reviews themselves is the outing of surreptitious Terms & Conditions. Hopefully, as more information is developed the reviews wont be ordered in positive and negative experiences - but sincerity of service. [quote name='warwickhunt' post='73705' date='Oct 13 2007, 10:47 AM']Ideally I'd like to hear from people who've had to make claims against couriers, as that's the real test of any insurance cover... then again even if someone was paid full compensation for a claim would I want to use the courier after they'd trashed someone else's gear [/quote] +1 Perhaps as the input grows and a couple of companys start standing out as good service, price and provide insurance people will use them and will need to make claims. The thread is still in infancy, but it will grow with time. paul. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
silverfoxnik Posted October 13, 2007 Share Posted October 13, 2007 [quote name='warwickhunt' post='73705' date='Oct 13 2007, 10:47 AM']As you say Nik, it was delivered safe and sound and no need to test out insurance liability, so a happy customer; just like I was with Interparcel. However, can you put hand on heart and say that you'd send a £500-£1000+ fragile instrument like a bass without knowing full well that you'd be covered? Even with insurance I always have a bit of a sleepless night or two if I sent anything through a courier, I couldn't even begin to imagine what I'd be like if I wasn't insured or I wasn't 100% clear on the T&C of the insurance.[/quote] Hi John, Yes, I agree that I'd be much more concerned shipping an expensive instrument than a relatively cheap speaker and if it wasn't coverered, then I wouldn't use them. Because the service I've just received has been so good, I think I'm going to try and get a definitive answer about the insurance issue because I'd like to use APC again.. I'll let you know what happens, Nik Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paul, the Posted October 13, 2007 Author Share Posted October 13, 2007 [i][b]updated[/b][/i] - Thoughts on colours and spacing? One to look out for in the future: [url="http://www.nowparcel.com/"]NowParcel[/url] Still 'Under Construction' but the homepage looks promising: " Important Information Terms & Conditions Privacy Policy Packaging Advice Insurance Import Pro-forma Export Pro-forma Prohibited Items Volumetric Weight " Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paul, the Posted October 13, 2007 Author Share Posted October 13, 2007 [quote name='silverfoxnik' post='73802' date='Oct 13 2007, 03:22 PM']Hi John, Yes, I agree that I'd be much more concerned shipping an expensive instrument than a relatively cheap speaker and if it wasn't coverered, then I wouldn't use them. Because the service I've just received has been so good, I think I'm going to try and get a definitive answer about the insurance issue because I'd like to use APC again.. I'll let you know what happens, Nik[/quote] Nik, I've added you in as using UK SameDay rather than APC as the insurance policy is seemingly different. Let me know if you agree or not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beedster Posted October 13, 2007 Share Posted October 13, 2007 Haven't read the thread above but hope this is of some use? I had my new fretless (awesome by the way) delivered by UPS to my work address yesterday. The guy in charge of the good depot said "Glad to see you use UPS". On further questioning - and trust me, this guy takes in hundreds of courier deliveries a day and knows what a cardboard box looks like - he said that UPS deliveries are consistently the only boxes that arrive undamaged and are delivered by drivers who seem to have a sense of responsibility. Chris Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paul, the Posted October 13, 2007 Author Share Posted October 13, 2007 [quote name='Beedster' post='73831' date='Oct 13 2007, 04:12 PM']Haven't read the thread above but hope this is of some use? I had my new fretless (awesome by the way) delivered by UPS to my work address yesterday. The guy in charge of the good depot said "Glad to see you use UPS". On further questioning - and trust me, this guy takes in hundreds of courier deliveries a day and knows what a cardboard box looks like - he said that UPS deliveries are consistently the only boxes that arrive undamaged and are delivered by drivers who seem to have a sense of responsibility. Chris[/quote] That's a great help Chris, thanks for the informative input. [i][b]Updated[/b][/i] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
silverfoxnik Posted October 14, 2007 Share Posted October 14, 2007 [quote name='paul, the' post='73828' date='Oct 13 2007, 04:03 PM']Nik, I've added you in as using UK SameDay rather than APC as the insurance policy is seemingly different. Let me know if you agree or not.[/quote] That's absolutely fine as it was UK SameDay who I dealt with. However, it was another company - also part of the APC network - who delivered at my end..Confusing isn't it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paul, the Posted October 14, 2007 Author Share Posted October 14, 2007 [quote name='silverfoxnik' post='74019' date='Oct 14 2007, 02:11 AM']That's absolutely fine as it was UK SameDay who I dealt with. However, it was another company - also part of the APC network - who delivered at my end..Confusing isn't it? [/quote] She said who on the what now? - understood. ---------- Interesting reading on the [url="http://www.interparcel.com/terms.php"]Interparcel Terms & Conditions page[/url]: [i]In the rare event of damage all packaging must be kept for inspection by the carrier. The item must be available for inspection in the state it was delivered, at the address it was delivered to. If the item is moved / repaired or if the packaging is not kept any claim will be voided. Photographs of the internal and external packaging as well as the damaged item must be supplied to start a claim.[/i] [i]In the event of damage repair costs must be supplied. If the item cannot be repaired then we would need this in writing from a specialist for the full claim amount to be considered.[/i] And this I found surprising: Loss or damage under the following conditions will not be covered: [b]* Acts of God[/b] * Consequences of war * Insufficient packaging / Incorrect labelling * Prohibited / Restricted Items - listed in our Help and information section Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
silverfoxnik Posted October 14, 2007 Share Posted October 14, 2007 [quote name='paul, the' post='74030' date='Oct 14 2007, 03:27 AM']She said who on the what now? - understood. ---------- Interesting reading on the [url="http://www.interparcel.com/terms.php"]Interparcel Terms & Conditions page[/url]: [i]In the rare event of damage all packaging must be kept for inspection by the carrier. The item must be available for inspection in the state it was delivered, at the address it was delivered to. If the item is moved / repaired or if the packaging is not kept any claim will be voided. Photographs of the internal and external packaging as well as the damaged item must be supplied to start a claim.[/i] [i]In the event of damage repair costs must be supplied. If the item cannot be repaired then we would need this in writing from a specialist for the full claim amount to be considered.[/i] And this I found surprising: Loss or damage under the following conditions will not be covered: [b]* Acts of God[/b] * Consequences of war * Insufficient packaging / Incorrect labelling * Prohibited / Restricted Items - listed in our Help and information section[/quote] I think that translates to: "whatever happens, we can and will find a way not to pay out for your loss because it'll be your fault..and if it isn't your fault, then we'll find a way to make it look like it was your fault!!" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beedster Posted October 14, 2007 Share Posted October 14, 2007 I posted this in ebay links but it seemed relevant here. So, this guy has bought a brand new Gibson and , before even taking out of the cardboard box, he wants to sell it? Mmmmmmmmm............. [url="http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/NEW-Gibson-USA-Thunderbird-Studio-Cherry-Bass-Guitar_W0QQitemZ230181475104QQihZ013QQcategoryZ4713QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem"]http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/NEW-Gibson-USA-Thund...1QQcmdZViewItem[/url] And there it is, bold as brass... "NO SCAMMERS I WON'T ACCEPT CHEQUES AND I IT IS CASH ON DELIVERY OR PAYPAL TO A REGISTERED ADDRESS I WORK FOR A COURIER COMPANY AND KNOW ABOUT SECURITY" Yes, I suspect he does indeed know about security. At least I know where he got the bass now Anyone out there order a Thunderbird recently? Chris Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OldGit Posted October 14, 2007 Share Posted October 14, 2007 [quote name='paul, the' post='74030' date='Oct 14 2007, 03:27 AM']* Insufficient packaging / Incorrect labelling[/quote] That was the central pivot point in my dispute with the Post Office - who defines what is "insufficient packaging" and by what criteria .... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OldGit Posted October 14, 2007 Share Posted October 14, 2007 [quote name='Beedster' post='74131' date='Oct 14 2007, 01:26 PM']"NO SCAMMERS I WON'T ACCEPT CHEQUES AND I IT IS CASH ON DELIVERY OR PAYPAL TO A REGISTERED ADDRESS I WORK FOR A COURIER COMPANY AND KNOW ABOUT SECURITY"[/quote] Lets ask him who he recommends ..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paul, the Posted October 15, 2007 Author Share Posted October 15, 2007 [quote name='OldGit' post='74132' date='Oct 14 2007, 01:27 PM']That was the central pivot point in my dispute with the Post Office - who defines what is "insufficient packaging" and by what criteria ....[/quote] "Your consignment/s must be packed to a professional standard, packed within a double walled box with the contents cushioned and protected inside. The packaging must also be sufficient to protect the products weight. Any claim resulting from a parcel that is not packaged to a professional standard and in line with the above will be declined." Fair enough I suppose. No mention of instruments specifically though. [quote name='silverfoxnik' post='74075' date='Oct 14 2007, 10:23 AM']I think that translates to: "whatever happens, we can and will find a way not to pay out for your loss because it'll be your fault..and if it isn't your fault, then we'll find a way to make it look like it was your fault!!"[/quote] eggsactly. And what is an 'Act of God'? The leaf fell, oh that's an act of God. He gave money to charity, an act of God. The delivery lacky kicked the sh*t out of your bass, undoubtedly an act of God. [quote name='Beedster' post='74131' date='Oct 14 2007, 01:26 PM']Yes, I suspect he does indeed know about security. At least I know where he got the bass now Anyone out there order a Thunderbird recently? Chris[/quote] And I thought I was a proud, observant cynic. I feel so stupid knowing that I wouldn't have come to that conclusion. I bow to you master and pray that you disperse your wise mist of cynicism. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
markdavid Posted October 15, 2007 Share Posted October 15, 2007 [quote name='Beedster' post='74131' date='Oct 14 2007, 01:26 PM']I posted this in ebay links but it seemed relevant here. So, this guy has bought a brand new Gibson and , before even taking out of the cardboard box, he wants to sell it? Mmmmmmmmm............. [url="http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/NEW-Gibson-USA-Thunderbird-Studio-Cherry-Bass-Guitar_W0QQitemZ230181475104QQihZ013QQcategoryZ4713QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem"]http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/NEW-Gibson-USA-Thund...1QQcmdZViewItem[/url] And there it is, bold as brass... "NO SCAMMERS I WON'T ACCEPT CHEQUES AND I IT IS CASH ON DELIVERY OR PAYPAL TO A REGISTERED ADDRESS I WORK FOR A COURIER COMPANY AND KNOW ABOUT SECURITY" Yes, I suspect he does indeed know about security. At least I know where he got the bass now Anyone out there order a Thunderbird recently? That is so dodgy and so dumb , he may as well have just advertised it as a stolen guitar , thats practicially what hes done anyway Chris[/quote] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
markdavid Posted October 15, 2007 Share Posted October 15, 2007 [quote name='Beedster' post='74131' date='Oct 14 2007, 01:26 PM']I posted this in ebay links but it seemed relevant here. So, this guy has bought a brand new Gibson and , before even taking out of the cardboard box, he wants to sell it? Mmmmmmmmm............. [url="http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/NEW-Gibson-USA-Thunderbird-Studio-Cherry-Bass-Guitar_W0QQitemZ230181475104QQihZ013QQcategoryZ4713QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem"]http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/NEW-Gibson-USA-Thund...1QQcmdZViewItem[/url] And there it is, bold as brass... "NO SCAMMERS I WON'T ACCEPT CHEQUES AND I IT IS CASH ON DELIVERY OR PAYPAL TO A REGISTERED ADDRESS I WORK FOR A COURIER COMPANY AND KNOW ABOUT SECURITY" Yes, I suspect he does indeed know about security. At least I know where he got the bass now Anyone out there order a Thunderbird recently? Chris[/quote] Sorry that was dumb of me not knowin ghow to properly send a reply, should have looked like this: That is so dodgy and so dumb , he may as well have just advertised it as a stolen guitar , thats practicially what hes done anyway Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
markdavid Posted October 15, 2007 Share Posted October 15, 2007 [quote name='paul, the' post='74030' date='Oct 14 2007, 03:27 AM']She said who on the what now? - understood. ---------- Interesting reading on the [url="http://www.interparcel.com/terms.php"]Interparcel Terms & Conditions page[/url]: [i]In the event of damage repair costs must be supplied. If the item cannot be repaired then we would need this in writing from a specialist for the full claim amount to be considered.[/i][/quote] So what constitutes a specialist then? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
markdavid Posted October 15, 2007 Share Posted October 15, 2007 [quote name='warwickhunt' post='73705' date='Oct 13 2007, 10:47 AM']As you say Nik, it was delivered safe and sound and no need to test out insurance liability, so a happy customer; just like I was with Interparcel. However, can you put hand on heart and say that you'd send a £500-£1000+ fragile instrument like a bass without knowing full well that you'd be covered? Even with insurance I always have a bit of a sleepless night or two if I sent anything through a courier, I couldn't even begin to imagine what I'd be like if I wasn't insured or I wasn't 100% clear on the T&C of the insurance. Ideally I'd like to hear from people who've had to make claims against couriers, as that's the real test of any insurance cover... then again even if someone was paid full compensation for a claim would I want to use the courier after they'd trashed someone else's gear [/quote] I deal with citylink on a daily basis and have had to put in many claims , pm me if you want more info. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fretmeister Posted October 18, 2007 Share Posted October 18, 2007 Send it Quick.com are crap. They killed an Ashdown Mini48 I sent to Liverpool. Then they promised an inspection within 30 days - and didn't. 3 months of reminders later and they still did nothing. So I sued. I got judgment and I got the money back and the court fees. They are not PART of parcelforce at all. They are merely a go between. You pay them, then they book parcel force.n They operate out of a tiny 1 room office in London. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cetera Posted October 18, 2007 Share Posted October 18, 2007 (edited) I hate Parcelforce but had to use them at a buyers request last week. I sent a bass to Finland and it arrived within 4 days, fine.... however, they were late picking it up, showed little customer service and were unfriendly. Though I guess they should get a +1 (reluctantly) for completing the delivery successfully I feel like giving them a ZERO for the overall process. I also sent a guitar to the US a couple of weeks back by FedEx (48hr delivery) and that arrived safe & sound. Excellent timely pick-up, helpful & friendly staff and delivery within deadline. Excellent! +1 Edited October 18, 2007 by cetera Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gwilym Posted October 18, 2007 Share Posted October 18, 2007 +1 for UPS. They just delivered my Sadowsky Tokyo to Bassaussie in Portugal. It arrived in 1 piece, and within the quoted time. I dropped it off on Monday evening and their depot near Heathrow, and it arrived with Bassaussie on Thursday morning. They also factor in insurance based on the customs value. My main problems in finding a courier was finding one that would insure to the full value of the bass. Incidentally the only other time I've shipped an expensive bass was via UPS (although the buyer arranged the pickup and everything). It was a Wal 5 fretless and went to California in one piece. To sum up, they may not be the absolute cheapest, but they appear to be efficent and competent, and offer adequate insureance cover (up to $50000) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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