metronome v drum machine

[aceuggy]

I've heard say that it's best to practise with some kind of back beat to help timing. Would you say that a basic metronome would be best for the job, or would you recommend splashing out on a drum machine, or anything else for that matter?

Edited January 10, 2009 by aceuggy

[Pissman]

I just use a CD, ..but that may be because I'm cheap

[SteveK]

If you can afford it, definitely drum machine.

I can't think of anything more boring than playing to:

[b]Click[/b] click click click [b]Click[/b] click click click [b]Click[/b] click click click [b]Click[/b] click click click [b]Click[/b] click click click [b]Click[/b] click click click [b]Click[/b] click click click [b]Click[/b] click click click [b]Click[/b] click click click [b]Click[/b] click click click [b]Click[/b] click click click [b]Click[/b] click click click [b]Click[/b] click click click [b]Click[/b] click click click [b]Click[/b] click click click [b]Click[/b] click click click [b]Click[/b] click click click [b]Click[/b] click click click [b]Click[/b] click click click [b]Click[/b] click click click [b]Click[/b] click click click [b]Click[/b] click click click [b]Click[/b] click click click [b]Click[/b] click click click etc etc

5 minutes of that and I'm ready to kill

Music's s'posed to be fun...right?!

Steve

[Pissman]

[quote name='SteveK' post='376431' date='Jan 10 2009, 08:45 PM']Music's s'posed to be fun...right?! [/quote]

As long as your not a musician..

[lonestar]

Any reccomendations for a good cheap drum machine or software?

[acidbass]

I normally make some drum loops using Guitar Pro and then save them as MIDI files - serves as a great practice tool, although it does cost $30 or something to download. I'm sure there would be some sort of free equivalent out there?

As far as the original question goes - definitely drum machine. You'll get a much better idea of phrasing and locking in with patterns than you would playing along with a metronome.

[TimR]

I have a zoom Rhythmtec. Its nice and simple. Older ones on ebay. New ones are about £100. [url="http://www.andertons.co.uk/acatalog/info_RT223.html?utm_source=googlebase&utm_medium=pricecomp&utm_content=allproducts&utm_campaign=googlebaseRT223"]http://www.andertons.co.uk/acatalog/info_R...googlebaseRT223[/url]

A metronome will help your bass playing more, a drum machine will make you think you are better than you are. BUT you can always set a drum machine to only play 4 beats in the bar

[Eight]

I read somewhere that if you play with a metronome, get one you can turn off the accenting of the first beat. Can't remember why.

Lol. That was no help at all.

There was another thread recently about drum software - it had some suggestions in there which might be worth a look.

[Ou7shined]

I use [url="http://www.byterapers.com/BeatEd/blog/"]BeatEd[/url].
It's a free drum machine for Symbian phones. I've always got my phone on me, so this means I've always got a drum machine on me. I put it through my stereo or PC at home for noodling. It's great if a pattern pops into my head or if I come up with a pattern that matches a new riff that I want to show the guys at rehearsal - plug it into the PA and Bob's yer auntie.

There are a few ok kits available but for some reason I usually end up using the TR-808 kit. It's not hi-fi quality but it's fine for what it is.
This guy is using the default kit which normally sounds better but you get the idea....

[jakenewmanbass]

[quote name='SteveK' post='376431' date='Jan 10 2009, 08:45 PM']If you can afford it, definitely drum machine.

I can't think of anything more boring than playing to:

[b]Click[/b] click click click [b]Click[/b] click click click [b]Click[/b] click click click [b]Click[/b] click click click [b]Click[/b] click click click [b]Click[/b] click click click [b]Click[/b] click click click [b]Click[/b] click click click [b]Click[/b] click click click [b]Click[/b] click click click [b]Click[/b] click click click [b]Click[/b] click click click [b]Click[/b] click click click [b]Click[/b] click click click [b]Click[/b] click click click [b]Click[/b] click click click [b]Click[/b] click click click [b]Click[/b] click click click [b]Click[/b] click click click [b]Click[/b] click click click [b]Click[/b] click click click [b]Click[/b] click click click [b]Click[/b] click click click [b]Click[/b] click click click etc etc

5 minutes of that and I'm ready to kill

Music's s'posed to be fun...right?!

Steve[/quote]

Not quite with you on that Steve, I take great pleasure in turning those clicks into a good sound, with the right consistency and feel you can make a metronome sound like it's swinging, grooving rocking.. whatever you want.
It's a central part of my more advanced teaching method, making "fun with metronomes" if you play with a good feel you will make a click sound great.

[jakenewmanbass]

So to answer the OP a metronome will do, it's what you do with it that counts.
Jake

[alexclaber]

[url="http://www.metronomeonline.com/"]http://www.metronomeonline.com/[/url]

Playing along with a drum machine can't quite do what playing with a metronome can - a metronome is a much purer form of time so it puts all the onus on you to make the music with it.

Alex

[KennysFord]

here's a free drum machine for windows.It's quite basic but good enough for starters.
[url="http://www.threechords.com/hammerhead/introduction.shtml"]link[/url]

Edited January 11, 2009 by kennyrodg

[The Funk]

[quote name='alexclaber' post='376702' date='Jan 11 2009, 12:17 PM']Playing along with a drum machine can't quite do what playing with a metronome can - a metronome is a much purer form of time so it puts all the onus on you to make the music with it.[/quote]

Agreed. Where you say "a metronome is a much purer form of time", I'd say "it's easy to keep time when you have a 'perfect' drum machine playing a groove for you - harder when it's just a series of unaccented clicks".

If you want to improve your time, play with a metronome. If you want to have something to noodle along to without the hassle of a drummer, use a drum machine (or sequence them on a computer - who actually uses a drum machine these days?).

Edited January 11, 2009 by The Funk

[drumbloke]

[quote name='jakesbass' post='376659' date='Jan 11 2009, 11:05 AM']So to answer the OP a metronome will do, it's what you do with it that counts.
Jake[/quote]

"...what you do with [b]it[/b] that counts." 'it' being the Metronome ?
Seconded.

Either. Having a drum machine with a varied mix of rhythms, Rock, Funk, Reggae Jazz and Latin must go someway to help your playing styles whilst also aiding your 'timing'. A metronome is good to practice playing Semi quavers and crothets against. (does this make sense ?)

[lowdown]

Of course if you splashed out on a drum machine or S/W equivalent.
You got the best of both worlds.
Drum machine or drum software can be set to do single beats or clix,
Accelerando or rituando, Loops, Grooves etc...
Metronome can only ...erm well ...
Do clicks... Nothing wrong with that though.

Garry

[Paul Cooke]

if you're doing it right, then you won't hear the clicks of the metronome anyway unless you leave the odd note out for space...

[Cantdosleepy]

Drum machine is better, for the reason lowdown described - you can set it up so it just plays closed hi-hats on every eighth or quarter note, turning it into a metronome.


[i]"Playing along with a drum machine can't quite do what playing with a metronome can - a metronome is a much purer form of time so it puts all the onus on you to make the music with it."
"it's easy to keep time when you have a 'perfect' drum machine playing a groove for you - harder when it's just a series of unaccented clicks."[/i]

I totally agree with both of these statements. But the great thing about a drum machine is that you can get it to produce unaccented clicks.

If you're practicing near a computer then you can get various types of both for free anyway - [url="http://www.metronomeonline.com/"]http://www.metronomeonline.com/[/url] and [url="http://www.threechords.com/hammerhead/introduction.shtml"]http://www.threechords.com/hammerhead/introduction.shtml[/url] will do the job right enough.

[Golchen]

A drum machine adds much more fun to the equation.

I just got one of those Roland RX practice amps. I love it, sounds great AND has a built in (limited) drum machine.

[cytania]

Alot the more sophisticated metronomes have full drum sounds as well as clicks. Really it depends how much you fancy programming your own drum patterns, although most drum machines have presets. What you do need is a good distinct kick drum sound (I've found drum loops can be too 'busy'). This really helps key you in to the downbeat at a subconscious level. If you practise to clicks or beeps you'll be drawn to the snare or hi-hats of a real drummer.

I bought a Roland RMP-5 which is a sort of hybrid device drummers use for practise. Nothing like it's 'score mode' where you get marked on how accurately you hit the pad (it does work with fingers, bass style). Very hard to get above 50/100 but if you're getting every bass kick then this is pretty good (alot of bass lines won't always truly cover the snare beat). Works for me.

[aceuggy]

Thanks everyone for your feedback. I'm thinking a drum machine is the way to go as most have a metronome facility built in, so best of both worlds. Another dumb question, can I play it through my bass amp, or would I need some other kind of amplification?

[Paul Cooke]

[quote name='aceuggy' post='377468' date='Jan 12 2009, 10:56 AM']Thanks everyone for your feedback. I'm thinking a drum machine is the way to go as most have a metronome facility built in, so best of both worlds. Another dumb question, can I play it through my bass amp, or would I need some other kind of amplification?[/quote]

I run my Alesis SR-16 drum machine or the output from my computer based drum machine (Hydrogen) through my practice amp using the CD input socket on my amp... If you don't have a CD input on your amp, then you'll need a mixer to mix your bass and the drum machine inputs with before your amp.

My Zoom B2.1U makes things slightly easier as the Zoom has a built-in Drum machine, although the patterns are limited and not editable

[simon1964]

[quote name='jakesbass' post='376655' date='Jan 11 2009, 11:04 AM']Not quite with you on that Steve, I take great pleasure in turning those clicks into a good sound, with the right consistency and feel you can make a metronome sound like it's swinging, grooving rocking.. whatever you want.
It's a central part of my more advanced teaching method, making "fun with metronomes" if you play with a good feel you will make a click sound great.[/quote]

I tend to agree with this. I think metronomes and drum machines actually perform slightly different roles.

A drum machine is great for practising feel, and locking in with a groove (a good real drummer is better mind!). A metronome is great for playing in a disciplined way, and for beginners especially, simply learning to count properly. You don't always learn that with a drum machine, which can sometimes hide some sloppiness (at least in my playing it can!)

[thepurpleblob]

Stupid question time....

What do you actually play while your metronome/drum machine is ticking away? Maybe it's because I'm one of those cover band types, but I always play along to some bit of music I'm learning. I honestly can't think what I'd do with a drum machine.

[Mottlefeeder]

[quote name='thepurpleblob' post='377524' date='Jan 12 2009, 11:50 AM']Stupid question time....

What do you actually play while your metronome/drum machine is ticking away? Maybe it's because I'm one of those cover band types, but I always play along to some bit of music I'm learning. I honestly can't think what I'd do with a drum machine.[/quote]
Two things spring to mind,

a) you can practice the core skills - scales and arpeggios, speed building exercises, etc, and use the beat to make sure you are being consistent.

if you are working from sheet music or tab, you start by working out what the notes are, and then you try and play the song. Using a beat for the second bit makes it easier, and as you improve your skills, you can do both steps at once.