Death of the big cab?

[Muzz]

I had a 1515L for years, and loved it - not much bigger or heavier than the 1212L, so if you see one of those, give it a go. Like all the small angled Schroeder cabs, they're a bit boxy and honky on their own, but in a band setting they're as good as anything I've used before or since...

[dave_bass5]

2 hours ago, bassbiscuits said:

You're right - it's about 24 kg but it is awesome. I've got my eyes peeled for another 1210L or 1212L but they're surprisingly scarce. 

I'd still take a 1212L over my Fealress F112 if i was playing a big room with no PA support. That cab  could easily fill a room with punchy bass. 

[bassbiscuits]

28 minutes ago, dave_bass5 said:

I'd still take a 1212L over my Fealress F112 if i was playing a big room with no PA support. That cab  could easily fill a room with punchy bass. 

Cool. I just need to find a good one near me and I'll be happy. 

[guyl]

19 hours ago, Muzz said:

I think this discussion is pretty much a replica of the one about vinyl: there's an old-school anachronism of a setup that is a lot of work and doesn't make an awful lot of sense, but some people can hear a difference or just want to stick with it anyway...

And maybe, like vinyl, big cabs will come back into fashion once we all sold ours... 

[guyl]

On 21/11/2019 at 15:58, chris_b said:

This is the good part. A bunch of speakers in a box has worked for decades, but sound quality in the new lighter cabs improves because these cabs are designed properly.

This doesn't just apply to bass gear. There has been a revolution in all gigging gear - affordable IEMs, user friendly desks, PA speakers etc. 20+ years ago the pressure was on a bassist to turn up to a gig with a rig that would make a decent, venue-filling noise on it's own. Now there is every chance that the PA will be able to do it for you - or at least support your puny 1x10. 

[grandad]

46 lbs/21 kg was the heaviest I used to lug around - Ampeg B115E. My Peavey head was 28 lbs/13 kg.

I couldn't imagine coping with more than that then let alone now. I can't/don't want to carry anything more than about 30 lbs nowadays so the new lightweight gear is a real bonus.

I usually play my Mustang, (7 lbs-ish). TC BH250 at 4 lbs into a BF One10 at 16lbs. I'm so grateful.

I've lightened up on the PA kit now with an EMX2 into a pair of CBR10s. Makes gigging so much easier.

The heaviest bit of kit is the cable case but I use what's called a rolling pilot's case so even that's not too bad. Same for the music when there's a 100+ scores in folders.

Edited November 23, 2019 by grandad
Grammar

[Stub Mandrel]

On 22/11/2019 at 08:36, dmccombe7 said:

When you're younger its easier and how a rig looks on stage plays an important part. Now that i'm older and wiser its purely down to how it sounds.

Sod that.

I'm old and foolish and hoping to play a couple of festivals next summer. If so it will be trace 4x10 combo on top of Peavey 1x15 on one side and Laney head with 2 2x12s on the other. And a tweeter box.

The ideal rig doesn't just sound good, it scares people.

 

[dmccombe7]

55 minutes ago, Stub Mandrel said:

Sod that.

I'm old and foolish and hoping to play a couple of festivals next summer. If so it will be trace 4x10 combo on top of Peavey 1x15 on one side and Laney head with 2 2x12s on the other. And a tweeter box.

The ideal rig doesn't just sound good, it scares people.

 

Now you're talking. Now that's a rig and a half and a wee bit extra just in case its required.

I might push the boat out and get the matching Mesa Powerhouse 115 cab and give me the full 600W from the Mpulse head.

Dave

 

[chris_b]

10 hours ago, grandad said:

The heaviest bit of kit is the cable case . . . . . .

A few years ago I weighed everything. The cabs were 21lbs each, the amp 6lbs and my accessories/stand case was 45lbs! The only thing I regularly used from that case was my extension lead. Everything else was there "just in case". It's been in the shed ever since.

[tauzero]

3 hours ago, Stub Mandrel said:

Sod that.

I'm old and foolish and hoping to play a couple of festivals next summer. If so it will be trace 4x10 combo on top of Peavey 1x15 on one side and Laney head with 2 2x12s on the other. And a tweeter box.

The ideal rig doesn't just sound good, it scares people.

Will the stage be reinforced for the purpose?

[BigRedX]

On 22/11/2019 at 15:55, Stofferson said:

Sheffield 02 Main stage, Birmingham 02 main stage, Sophie Stage at Bloodstock this year.

Totally agree man but these types of gigs are not based on us as a band alone so quick change overs, no roadies and not our own engineer, I cant rely on the monitor mix, now don't get me wrong, 99/100 is awesome, but i do like to hear it behind me just in case, Camden Underworld would be awesome, although not yet played it, got Electric Ballroom next year though. 

 

Edit, Still getting used to these big stages, so I dont disagree with you good sir, we're just in a not position financially to get rid of the rigs, nor have the sound check and tech team to ensure smooth sound for us and out front 🙂 The road is hard and full of many lessons

Played Electrowerx in Islington last night. Second on the bill of 4 bands all with massively different line-ups (we were by far the most conventional and that's saying something). Reasonably big stage although by the time it came for us to set up there wasn't much room left. These days I have an FRFR cab for on-stage monitoring, but decided that trying to find somewhere for it on stage and then having to move it for the opening band was going to be too m much hassle. So I simply gave the PA engineer a DI feed from my Helix and asked for some bass in the wedge in front of me. Had half a song soundcheck to get the mix right and we were done. Absolutely no problems. That's the second gig I've done recently where I haven't bothered with any dedicated speakers for my bass on stage and both myself and the rest of the band have had no problem hearing it. I'm seriously considering not taking the FRFR to any of the larger gigs any more. It's one less thing to go in the van and on stage, and cuts down my stage set-up time by about 50%.

[chris_b]

I gigged yesterday afternoon with no amp. Just a DI and a monitor. A good sound guy and a couple of adjustments and we were fine all day.

[Lozz196]

At the gig I did last night the soundman was old-school, miked the cabs up, no DI-big. So if there hadn’t been a cab.....

[dmccombe7]

2 hours ago, BigRedX said:

Played Electrowerx in Islington last night. Second on the bill of 4 bands all with massively different line-ups (we were by far the most conventional and that's saying something). Reasonably big stage although by the time it came for us to set up there wasn't much room left. These days I have an FRFR cab for on-stage monitoring, but decided that trying to find somewhere for it on stage and then having to move it for the opening band was going to be too m much hassle. So I simply gave the PA engineer a DI feed from my Helix and asked for some bass in the wedge in front of me. Had half a song soundcheck to get the mix right and we were done. Absolutely no problems. That's the second gig I've done recently where I haven't bothered with any dedicated speakers for my bass on stage and both myself and the rest of the band have had no problem hearing it. I'm seriously considering not taking the FRFR to any of the larger gigs any more. It's one less thing to go in the van and on stage, and cuts down my stage set-up time by about 50%.

I gigged in 80's/90's without a bass rig. 3 piece band DI'd and thru monitors. Loved my tone and had no trouble hearing it. Our drums were Simmonds kit so everything could be turned down thru PA.

These days we sometimes just take a vocal PA.

Dave

[BaggyMan]

Funny I started this thread as the proud owner for a 1*8 cab, two 2*10's and 2*12.....and yesterday swapped a guitar for a....4*10.    Did a gig on Friday with a 250w 15" combo and it couldn't hack it.  Played with the same band tonight, using a darkglass head and the 'new' 4*10...world of difference..lovely.   Whilst my back is still good it gets the gig..

 

[chris_b]

6 hours ago, Lozz196 said:

At the gig I did last night the soundman was old-school, miked the cabs up, no DI-big. So if there hadn’t been a cab.....

. . . . . . I guess he'd have got the DI out of the case? With your band I guess there would be a pretty hefty adjustment to the totally different stage sound. My gig was an old style Chicago blues band, so pretty easy to get to grips with the differences.

I went cab-less because the gig was in Portobello Road (and on a Saturday afternoon!) and there was no chance of parking the car within a mile of the gig.

[Lozz196]

Well I do get all my eq from my Para Driver which is a DI pedal so FOH would have been ok but the monitoring wouldn’t have coped, ok for vox but nothing else.

[BigRedX]

IMO the feasibility of not using a rig on stage is all down to how good the PA and monitoring is. 

I can think of only a couple of gigs I've played in the last 3 years where having a bass rig has been essential for hearing the bass guitar on-stage and FoH.

[rushbo]

I loved the sound of my old Peavey TNT combo, but after lumping it up and down the long, narrow stairs at The Bartons Arms in Brum, I came to the conclusion that I was too old (and weedy) for those shenanigans. After a year or two of unsettled panic-buying of unsuitable gear (please don't talk to me about Ashdown combos...) I settled on my delightful Genz Benz Contour Combo. It's a comfortable, one handed carry and is loud enough for pub/club gigs with no PA support. It sounds great too - very simple EQ setup and is rock-solid reliable. 

A recent change of band means I'm playing small theatres/art centres etc now and my backline is becoming less important, but I'm reticent to go down the "monitors only" route. I still like to hear most of my bass noise coming from my amp, as does the drummer in the band. No-one in the band is using in ears (apart from our saxophonist) so it's nice to have a decent sound level on stage, which is well balanced and not too loud. I find that the sound coming from my combo is more "me" than the sound which comes out of the monitor. "Go figure", as the young people say. I love going to gigs and seeing huge bass rigs (even if they are just for show), but I'm also incredibly glad that I don't need to move them around.

Would I go back to my old, back-breaking Peavey? No.  I've now got the power and the sound, but with about half the weight. And I guess that's the point. 

 

[mattbass6]

On 21/11/2019 at 14:19, LewisK1975 said:

I think for the weekend warriors - Yes the big bass cab is pretty much dead.

Touring bands (who still use backline) with roadies, will still use SVT810's.  I think it's fair to say though, that a lot of the modern touring big bands aren't using backline at all.

So I guess, Yes, the big bass cab is on the way out...

That's why you can get a used SVT810 for under £500 these days.  Nobody really wants them.

This ⬆️ I'm in a Prog band, as well as a Metal band, and the difference in rig setups is brilliant. I rehearsed with the Metal band on Sunday and ran a Darkglass M900 through an SVT810 cab. It was pure bliss. It was so loud, clear and simply awe inspiring. The reality is though, it is so impractical. Unless you have a full road crew and storage facility, these cabs are of no use to man nor beast, which is such a shame. Anyway, I totally agree with Lewis, the IEM route is the way things are going, and I will be for my Progressive band even though we have our heavy moments. If that goes well, I'll take it over to the Metal band as well. I will always crave a huge rig though, nothing like it when that air is being pushed 😎

[jazzyvee]

i switched from  mesa powerhouse 4x10 to a Barefaced Big Twin II and a mesa powerhouse 2x10 to  Big Baby II. Although i thing the boogie cabs have a great sound, the BF cabs bring me closer to the hifi sound im looking for. At one time in the past i toyed with the idea of a PH1000 but the weight and practicalities of getting it into my car persuaded me to think otherwise. for me going lightweight without losing power and quality was a win win.  Actually i hardly ever use the big rigs at the venues we gig at because, apart from maybe a couple of gigs, they alway sound like they have been thrashed and it's impossible to get a clean sound. Exceptions were markbass 8x10 and a brand new ampeg 8x10 rig

 

[pbasspecial]

Think I might be in the minority as I've recently upsized my rig.

Gone from an Ampeg PF50t valve amp through a barefaced super compact (1x12) to an Ashdown ABM 500 through a barefaced Super Twin (2x12). Works for me!

[dmccombe7]

5 minutes ago, pbasspecial said:

Think I might be in the minority as I've recently upsized my rig.

Gone from an Ampeg PF50t valve amp through a barefaced super compact (1x12) to an Ashdown ABM 500 through a barefaced Super Twin (2x12). Works for me!

Me too.

From Markbass 1x12 combo and ext cab to my Mesa Mpulse 600 and Mesa PH212 cab. Both heavy but still manageable at the moment. If finances agree i still quite fancy the Mesa Subway lightweight gear WD800 with 210 & 115 cabs but at over £3k its gonna be a stretch.

Dave

[dave_bass5]

On 22/11/2019 at 14:24, stewblack said:

My 8x10 rocked back onto wheels handle on the top, very easy to move. I drove it about in a trailer. Trailer was low enough and centre of gravity just right that I could lean the cab back and it would gracefully tilt and lie flat then I slid it in. The trailer was backed into a lock up. Job done. Handling was actually very easy.

But if the venue had stairs...

Ive always lived in flats, and not high enough to have lifts, so your photos would apply to me for any gig or rehearsal. 

[Al Krow]

On 22/11/2019 at 15:35, Lozz196 said:

On stage monitoring is fine if for one you like bass coming from the monitors (I don’t...

^^ This. I've not thus far heard an on stage monitor come close to the sound of a quality bass cab.

But IMO it doesn't need to be a big cab for decent on-stage monitoring. A quality 1x12 or 2x10 works just fine for this and will also cover smaller (e.g. pub) gigs, too, without PA support provided you've got sufficient headroom with your amp, which for me is 300W+.

A high-end 112 that will handle up to 600W and weighs just 23 lbs or less? No problems sir / madam, it probably won't make you look as good as @Ted Theodore Logan, III assisted by his very capable salesman, but @Paul S has one in the FS going for a very reasonable price, right now, which I suspect won't be hanging about too long!