PA for small venue (med. restaurant size)

[Bilbo]

I run a weekly Jazz gig called Jazz East at the Alex in Felixstowe (www.jazzeast.vpweb.co.uk). We need a PA for announcements, front line and singers (i.e. usually front line OR singers and not miking up the full band) and currently have a limited budget of around £500. I am not at all adverse to buying secondhand. Has anyone got any ideas for what we reasonably expect to get for that kind of money? 

[casapete]

Okay, I’ll start this. Look for a s/h Yamaha EMX512SC powered mixer amp. These are great - lightweight, reliable , 8 channels with good built in FX and can be had s/h for £250 or less if you’re lucky. Pair this with a pair of s/h speakers from a respected maker such as Yamaha, Alto, JBL etc which you should also be able to find for £200. This leaves £50 for a s/h pair of stands and some speaker leads and you’re done!

[warwickhunt]

My guitarist just picked up a used pair of 1x15 RCF active speakers, small Mackie desk with all cables and stands for £550.  A set of the smaller 12" RCFs with a similar desk should be easily achievable in your budget.  I wouldn't skimp on £50 - £100 and buy a generic brand of active speakers, go for Mackie/RCF or similar.  Sadly you get 'look-alikes' that quote massive spec but in fact the sound quality is poor and rarely lives up to the quoted outputs.  

Regarding desks - there are lots of good quality little mixers around and I'd opt for a 8 - 12 channel desk rather than a little 4 channel; 4 channels might sound like all you will need but you might want to put an electric piano, electro acoustic guitar or a couple of extra vocals through and nothing worse than struggling for channels.  Plus you tend to get a little more in the way of on-board effects and EQ on slightly bigger desks (which aren't physically that much bigger than a little desk).

[casapete]

If you want to go down the powered speaker route, then I can recommend the Alto TX215 active cabs. Brand new these are around £350 a pair, leaving £150 for a small s/h mixer and stands/leads.

[pete.young]

If you wanted new, you could try looking at the latest bluetooth-enabled Yamaha Stagepas.  https://www.gear4music.com/PA-DJ-and-Lighting/Yamaha-Stagepas-400BT-Portable-PA-System-with-Speaker-Stands/2JUD

Leaves a bit in the budget for spare cables, or maybe even a cheap mike such as an XM8500.

 

Edited December 6, 2019 by pete.young

[grandad]

It's a minefield but my advice comes from several years and many £s of running the PA for my previous weekend warrior band.

1st thing is how big, how much power do you need?

It sounds like a small/medium would be suitable.

2nd question is - active or passive speakers?

I've used both and sound-wise had good results from both. I prefer passive speakers as it means simpler cabling and all controls in 1 place.

For your stated use I would say something like the Stagepas 600i would be ideal.

[Bilbo]

Thanks, Pete. have you heard that kit in the flesh? It looks good and the youtube reviews seem ok. I basically need to mic up singers and horn players pretty much one at a time so I don't need a 3K rig with crossovers!

[Happy Jack]

Will this PA be used just once a week? Will it be left at the venue or taken away after each gig?

Depending on the answers, then ease of breakdown / transportation / storage becomes a significant factor.

 

[Bilbo]

I am looking at the Yamaha 400 and 600 which both have things going for them. Thanks, guys. This has been really helpful.

[Bilbo]

8 minutes ago, Happy Jack said:

Will this PA be used just once a week? Will it be left at the venue or taken away after each gig?

Depending on the answers, then ease of breakdown / transportation / storage becomes a significant factor.

 

It stays at the venue but is packed away and stored (i.e. not left set up).

[Dad3353]

I had my previous company invest in a Stage-Pass for their (rare...) 'do's' and assembly-hall speeches; an easy system to use, quality gear and flexible. I've retired since, but they're happy with it still.

[jacko]

37 minutes ago, grandad said:

I prefer passive speakers as it means simpler cabling and all controls in 1 place.

 

I'm not sure two additional power leads over complicates the cabling TBH. 

To the OP.

If you can find a pair of s/h mackie SRM 450s or Mackie thumps then pair them up with one of Behringers 1832FX mixers you'll have a set up that will handle most gigs. 

 

[yorks5stringer]

How about an HK Lucas?

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/HK-Audio-Lucas-Nano-305-FX-PA-System-Ex-Display/362790852755?hash=item5478051893:g:7hgAAOSwfwxdsuMt

 

This one without FX

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/HK-Audio-Lucas-Nano-302-Portable-PA-System-NEW/312834747744?hash=item48d6676d60:g:x~cAAOSwCexdwwTb

Edited December 6, 2019 by yorks5stringer

[stingrayPete1977]

The mistake I've made in the past is ending up with a mixture of the wrong stuff, by that I mean we could argue all day over passive or active speakers and there's no right or wrong in reality but I ended up with a perfectly good passive desk and passive speakers which is of no use to anyone without an amp.

Make a decision early on which way you want to go and stick to it, you might get a mixer from one place, speakers and stands from another, but you don't want to end up with a nice passive mixer only to find a great deal on a powered euro desk the next day or a pair of powered RCF speakers after you've bought the powered desk!

[paul_c2]

5 hours ago, Bilbo said:

I run a weekly Jazz gig called Jazz East at the Alex in Felixstowe (www.jazzeast.vpweb.co.uk). We need a PA for announcements, front line and singers (i.e. usually front line OR singers and not miking up the full band) and currently have a limited budget of around £500. I am not at all adverse to buying secondhand. Has anyone got any ideas for what we reasonably expect to get for that kind of money? 

Up until very recently, our requirements were pretty much the same as above. We were covering larger venues (150-200+) and had a big band behind the singer (which will give a good indication of the volume achieved).

You can combine the monitor + mixer in one, by choosing something like a Behringer B205. It has 3 inputs (2 XLR) so you can run 2 mics (singer and announcements if someone else does those). Then hook up a 12" active speaker. We used an Alto TX212 with no issues although you might choose a 15", or the TS312, or another brand. You don't say if mics are included in the £500 budget but even so, its got to be around £500 all in.

The B205 can go on a mic stand (and has adapters to screw into the standard fittings), so we dedicated one for that purpose - a straight with a solid/heavy base. Below is a pic of it in use (the cable hanging off it is an XLR to a DI box near bass and guitarist, in case an amp goes funny etc.

 

[Happy Jack]

You need something that will fold up small so as to be easily stored at the venue, but also well-protected against accidental damage when not in use and against random button-pressing and knob-twirling.

Try one of these: https://www.gear4music.com/PA-DJ-and-Lighting/JBL-EON208P-Mobile-PA-System/1GWG

 

[pete.young]

8 hours ago, Bilbo said:

Thanks, Pete. have you heard that kit in the flesh? It looks good and the youtube reviews seem ok. I basically need to mic up singers and horn players pretty much one at a time so I don't need a 3K rig with crossovers!

Not that exact rig, but the singer in our old band had the previous version and used it for solo 'karaoke style' gigs with a backing track and vocal mike. It was perfectly OK for that and lasted a couple of years before being replaced with a Bose L1 .

If you can stretch the budget to the 600 that's probably worthwhile, and Happy Jack's link might be worth a look.

Edited December 6, 2019 by pete.young