How to reduce ‘noise’ from your signal path?

[Toasted]

I believe so. I'll do some reading and come back to you.

Is the noisy pedal this "carbon" one?

[Dubs]

[quote name='Toasted' post='387310' date='Jan 21 2009, 11:19 AM']I believe so. I'll do some reading and come back to you.

Is the noisy pedal this "carbon" one? [/quote]

No. Unfortunately it’s the fuzzface that I got off you – it’s really puzzling me though cos it’s a true bypass but hisses like a mother f***er at the moment. I’ve not spent the time looking at it yet to troubleshoot…

The ‘Carbon’ has a really quiet circuit and also has a built in gate. I guess you could call the “drive” control the “wool” control :ph34r:

[Toasted]

Ooh, that's not good. It shouldn't be noisy, although I have some ideas about what might be making it noisy. If you take it out of your chain does the noise go away completely? What power supply are you using?

[Toasted]

[quote name='benwhiteuk' post='387321' date='Jan 21 2009, 11:26 AM']The ‘Carbon’ has a really quiet circuit and also has a built in gate. I guess you could call the “drive” control the “wool” control :ph34r:[/quote]

:ph34r::ph34r:

[Dubs]

[quote name='Toasted' post='387327' date='Jan 21 2009, 11:31 AM']Ooh, that's not good. It shouldn't be noisy, although I have some ideas about what might be making it noisy. If you take it out of your chain does the noise go away completely? What power supply are you using?[/quote]

Ok, so it turns out that it’s probably not the fuzzface (I've just tried a few different things) – yesterday I removed it from the chain and the hiss seemed to go away so I assumed it was that. Today it’s fine on its own and has a completely silent bypass, and within the chain it makes no difference; the hiss is there with or without it. I’ve removed each pedal one by one from the chain and the hiss isn’t coming from any one of them but just seems to be a consequence of linking the pedals together – as well as this, none of the pedals are producing a hiss when I’ve soloed them in a small chain going from my bass, into the pedal, and then straight into the amp. None of them make any sort of hiss when I do this.

The power supply I’m using is this - [url="http://www.effectpowersupplies.com/9v-dc-regulated-power-supply-with-integrated-6-way-daisy-chain-2-p.asp"]http://www.effectpowersupplies.com/9v-dc-r...y-chain-2-p.asp[/url] - and I’ve tried it in a few different sockets and doesn’t make a difference. The electrics in the house are good cos they were all changed about 8 or 10 years ago.

I’ve just tried a few other things and none of them worked, so now I’m completely f***ed if I can figure out what’s going on. :wacko:

Yours faithfully,

Confused in Portsmouth.

[Toasted]

Ok, plug all the pedals up into the chain you intend to use. Then, one at a time take out the power connector of each pedal and see if the hiss goes. Plug it back in and try the next.

There's a possibility that one pedal might be inducing noise into one of ther others. (Echo Parks are famous for this for example).

[umph]

do you have lots of bufferedbypass pedals?

[dannybuoy]

The ISP Decimator G-String is supposed to be better than the Boss NS-2 by the way, although it's also more expensive...

[url="http://www.isptechnologies.com/decimatorGpedal.htm"]http://www.isptechnologies.com/decimatorGpedal.htm[/url]

Edited January 21, 2009 by dannybuoy

[Dubs]

[quote name='Toasted' post='387361' date='Jan 21 2009, 12:03 PM']Ok, plug all the pedals up into the chain you intend to use. Then, one at a time take out the power connector of each pedal and see if the hiss goes. Plug it back in and try the next.

There's a possibility that one pedal might be inducing noise into one of ther others. (Echo Parks are famous for this for example).[/quote]

ahh man, I’ve just found the culprit – DigiTech Synth Wah. That little green bastard. It was exactly what you said. Looks like that’s the one that I’d have to put in the gated loop then, but only if the NS2 would allow the rest of the chain to effectively be bypassed.

Cheers for the help mate

[quote name='umph' post='387364' date='Jan 21 2009, 12:04 PM']do you have lots of bufferedbypass pedals?[/quote]

I think the Synth Wah has a buffered bypass doesn’t it? I guess this just highlights to me how advantageous true bypass really is.

[Toasted]

I'm not sure that a noise suppressor is the best answer for the reasons I posted in post #24. I wonder, what are you using the xBSW for?

There may be an alternative pedal without the noise issues.

Also, it's worth noting that I know of at least two other BC'ers (Higgie and Tayste) who have used xBSW's without noise on a daisy chain connection. There's always the possibility you have a "Friday afternoon special"

[Dubs]

[quote name='Toasted' post='387376' date='Jan 21 2009, 12:16 PM']Also, it's worth noting that I know of at least two other BC'ers (Higgie and Tayste) who have used xBSW's without noise on a daisy chain connection. There's always the possibility you have a "[b]Friday afternoon special[/b]" [/quote]

Damn. I'm sure my old one didn't hiss either. I just tried it on its own and it didn’t hiss. Maybe it’s something to do with the order the way the pedals are set up and the order that the daisy chain powers the pedals – maybe if I put it at the end of the chain it will be ok? I’ll try some things out later on, but I’ve got to shoot off for something now so I don’t have the time to investigate further. At least I’ve narrowed it down to 1 pedal and there are potential solutions…

[Toasted]

Keep us updated

[Toasted]

Infact, if you bought Umcoo's Virtual Battery from this thread:

[url="http://basschat.co.uk/index.php?showtopic=38768"]http://basschat.co.uk/index.php?showtopic=38768[/url]

That would solve your problem and you could keep your xBSW.

[Dubs]

[quote name='Toasted' post='387734' date='Jan 21 2009, 04:59 PM']Infact, if you bought Umcoo's Virtual Battery from this thread:

[url="http://basschat.co.uk/index.php?showtopic=38768"]http://basschat.co.uk/index.php?showtopic=38768[/url]

That would solve your problem and you could keep your xBSW.[/quote]

I might give that a go – when I’m using it with a 9V battery it’s fine, so I guess this would solve it and mean that I don’t have to fork out for an NS2. Cheers for the help mate. Nothing else seems to fix it.

[redzombie]

I find my NS-2 does a great job of eliminating noise, but it does alter my tone ever so slightly. By that, I mean I can only tell the difference if I listen very carefully or with a decent pair of high-quality headphones (even then the difference is still rather negligible).

I'm still gonna get myself one of those ISP Decimators though, as soon as I've got some more important stuff out of the way.

I should add though, that the real reason for me getting a noise suppressor is to eliminate feedback. When my dirt pedals are off, my rig's not too noisy.

Edited January 21, 2009 by redzombie

[Toasted]

Redzombie watch ebay for those ISP Decimators, they tend to go for faily low prices

[redzombie]

[quote name='Toasted' post='389348' date='Jan 23 2009, 10:11 AM']Redzombie watch ebay for those ISP Decimators, they tend to go for faily low prices [/quote]

Aye, good call, I'll save a search for it. If I can't get a cheapish one second hand, I might just order one from the States and hope customs doesn't sniff it out.

[rmorris]

[quote]I think the Synth Wah has a buffered bypass doesn’t it? I guess this just highlights to me how advantageous true bypass really is.[/quote]

Interesting and practical thread people.
But I have to say the whole 'true bypass' thing has become overblown - it all depends how the 'active bypass' is implemented and it can , at times, be a positive advantage in converting the signal into one with low impedance.
( allowing for the fact that some 'fuzz' fx depend on being fed from a high impedance pickup / source )

Essentially my take on it is :

hiss ( ie. white / pink noise ) = noise from the electronics - you have a noisy fx pedal / unit

hum / buzz : probably due to electrical configuration / ground loops / interference from mains / dimmer lights /crt

rfi pickup / demodulation : computer noise etc. ( try putting your guitar / bass pickups near your PC ) ; taxi firm pickup etc . ?

In a 'real time' ( ie. live environment ) any noise gate / NS2 etc. is bound to take the very front end off your signal as it must take a finite time to react.
Whether that's a problem or not will depend on your playing style of course.

On a practical note - it's often possible to reduce the hiss level by a simple low pass fliter on the amp / mixing desk / DAW as appropriate.
There' s essentially no signal from a bass above a few kHz. But filters with a higher 'nominal' -3dB frequency wil have amplitude and phase effects down into the bass guitar range so it pays to be critical.

[Dubs]

[quote name='rmorris' post='395082' date='Jan 30 2009, 12:04 AM']Interesting and practical thread people.
But I have to say the whole 'true bypass' thing has become overblown - it all depends how the 'active bypass' is implemented and it can , at times, be a positive advantage in converting the signal into one with low impedance.
( allowing for the fact that some 'fuzz' fx depend on being fed from a high impedance pickup / source )[/quote]

Good point. Can you give an example of a pedal with a good buffered active bypass?

[MananaMan]

If the pedal is quiet on its own and only plays up in the chain (and given that it is a Digitech X-Series, which are pretty power-hungry little blighters) I'd say it's most likely due to the power supply. Although its a good 1.3A supply, the transformer looks really small to me - more like a laptop transformer than anything. Its probably nothing, but if you don't have a spare you could try getting a switch mode supply that should be a little cleaner, or try two supplies, one for the BSW and one for the rest.

[rmorris]

[quote name='benwhiteuk' post='396242' date='Jan 31 2009, 04:47 PM']Good point. Can you give an example of a pedal with a good buffered active bypass?[/quote]

sorry - got distracted from this site for a while by credit crunching redundancy and stuff.
right , pedal with active bypass:
Well it depends on your criteria - are you talking specifically about distort pedals, Woolly Mammoth etc ?
If a pedal has a lowish input impedance then you may well need a true bypass to take it out of the equation completely.

But I do think that's getting off the point - the true bypass issue is really about 'tone sucking' , level and frequency response etc rather than noise problems I think.
I'm still unclear on what sort of noise tyou're getting and from what pedal - the Digitech ?
Like someone else says - I'd try changing or moving the power supply.
But I's probably go for a physically larger linear supply ( bigger transformer ) first rather than a switch mode supply.
The small transformer is likely to saturate more quickly and induce noise into cables maybe and screening can't help.
Moving it away from cables and pickups and any such noise should reduce a lot ( square law ? ) and so it's a good test.

Back to 'True Bypass' - this is worth a read if you haven't already:[url="http://www.petecornish.co.uk/case_against_true_bypass.html"]Pete Cornish catb[/url]