The IEM (in ear monitors) Bible thread

[Phil Starr]

10 hours ago, EBS_freak said:

the tiniest drop of superglue or maybe thread lock or something may be in order! (strong enough to stick - but able to be pulled off the iems when necessary! 

Hmmm, me, superglue and in-ears, what could go wrong

To be fair they are a good fit when new, I just needed to be careful and to change them regularly.

[bassmansam]

JH Audio get a lot of love over on Talkbass.

Also Alclairs seem to be very good bang for buck. 

Thoughts on JH7, Alclair tour triple / CVMK Compare to the Ultimate Ears UE6's? 🙂

[EBS_freak]

1 minute ago, bassmansam said:

JH Audio get a lot of love over on Talkbass.

Also Alclairs seem to be very good bang for buck. 

Thoughts on JH7, Alclair tour triple / CVMK Compare to the Ultimate Ears UE6's? 🙂

Id take the UE6 over the JH7 for bass. I’d take the JH11 over the UE6.

Can’t speak for Alclairs, never listened to any to judge. CMVK is good from a headroom point of views by the looks of things - but driver count without proper tuning can sound like and out of phase trashy sound. So until I heard one and tested it, that’s pretty much all I can say. They may be great, they may be not. And of course, what you like may not be what I like!

[bassmansam]

On 21/03/2021 at 17:31, EBS_freak said:

Id take the UE6 over the JH7 for bass. I’d take the JH11 over the UE6.

Can’t speak for Alclairs, never listened to any to judge. CMVK is good from a headroom point of views by the looks of things - but driver count without proper tuning can sound like and out of phase trashy sound. So until I heard one and tested it, that’s pretty much all I can say. They may be great, they may be not. And of course, what you like may not be what I like!

Cosmic Ears sound like a solid UK based company. Anyone have experience with them?

CE6B model in particular which are £600.

https://www.cosmicears.com/products/starburst/sb-ce6b/

• • FREQUENCY
    18Hz-18kHz
  • IMPEDANCE
    14 Ohms at 1kHz
  • SENSITIVITY
    1 mW @ 1 Khz = 123 dB SPL
  • ISOLATION
    -26 dB

• • DRIVERS
    6 balanced armatures per side
    2 – low, 2 – mid, 2 – high
  • CROSSOVER
    Cosmic Ears 3 way custom designed

[EBS_freak]

1 hour ago, bassmansam said:

Cosmic Ears sound like a solid UK based company. Anyone have experience with them?

CE6B model in particular which are £600.

https://www.cosmicears.com/products/starburst/sb-ce6b/

• • FREQUENCY
    18Hz-18kHz
  • IMPEDANCE
    14 Ohms at 1kHz
  • SENSITIVITY
    1 mW @ 1 Khz = 123 dB SPL
  • ISOLATION
    -26 dB

• • DRIVERS
    6 balanced armatures per side
    2 – low, 2 – mid, 2 – high
  • CROSSOVER
    Cosmic Ears 3 way custom designed

You fell for the VAT trap. They are £720.

Again, can't tell you anything about how they sound as I haven't heard them and you can't tell anything about how IEMs sound from the stats that you have posted. You get a lot of drivers for your money though! (And you would be in good company with Matt Goss (yup, I did spot his on the Bros documentary. I do the IEM spotting thing...))

I'd have to listen to them to comment on how good they are really - but looking at the frequency response graph, they've certainly been tuned with a sub bass freak in mind (although how big that kick is meaningless as there's no scale on the y axis). The only risk I would say its that they could give up definition in getting those big lows. Again, you would have to trial them. I call out the risks of adding drivers in the opening posts but I couldn't say either way if Cosmic are boss with their tuning, phasing and crossover design or not as Ive never had a pair in my ears.

[LiamPodmore]

On 23/03/2021 at 14:09, bassmansam said:

Cosmic Ears sound like a solid UK based company. Anyone have experience with them?

CE6B model in particular which are £600.

https://www.cosmicears.com/products/starburst/sb-ce6b/

• • FREQUENCY
    18Hz-18kHz
  • IMPEDANCE
    14 Ohms at 1kHz
  • SENSITIVITY
    1 mW @ 1 Khz = 123 dB SPL
  • ISOLATION
    -26 dB

• • DRIVERS
    6 balanced armatures per side
    2 – low, 2 – mid, 2 – high
  • CROSSOVER
    Cosmic Ears 3 way custom designed

Never used them myself but a couple of my mates have had CE6's for about 4-5 years now and never had any complaints whatsoever, and they're both audio engineers.

[dave_bass5]

Its taken me a while but ive finally decided i need to use IEM’s. Now I’m playing keys I don’t need the speaker behind me like i did with bass. I recently got a powered DBR12 for monitoring but even that is getting a bit drowned out by the band at rehearsals. Could be because I’m right on top of it though. The other factor is the PA is now in stereo at the studio, which means i want to start using it again as I’m not keen on mono. 

Ive been playing with my GF’s ZS10 Pros this morning, and while they sound good, the right ear still wont stay in. Ive ordered a 3 pack of the INAIRS to try and get a better fit before buying my own IEM’s. I was very tempted to get some Sure 215’s, as they seem like they might be a better fit, with them having less weight and smaller mass. I know they won’t sound the same so will give the ZS10’s a go first. 

Its funny though but I actually prefer the tone of the cheap ones she got from G4M with her SubZero system, as they sound more like headphones than the much clearer ZS10’s, which to me sound more like monitors. I know the ZS10’s will work better in a live environment  though, as they will need to be turned up less.

This is only for me so ill get a Behringer P2 and run it from the headphone out of my keyboard. As long as its in stereo I’m not fused about wireless for now. Just need to remember not to walk away from the keyboard without disconnecting first lol. 

Thanks again to Russ for all that helpful info. Will read it a few times over the next few days.

[EBS_freak]

@dave_bass5 - I need to catch up with your email, life has got all a bit nuts of late. Will fill you in. Anyway...

Behind keys, if you aren't moving anywhere, and you don't care about the visual aspect of it... and you have problem with fit, then maybe get something like a pair of closed back DT770 32 ohm. Will give you lots of low end response and nice amounts of isolation given the closed back build. Great for home use and travelling etc too - no sound leakage so you don't cheese off other people that may be in the same room as you. If you are looking at a Shure 215 setup with P2, then the Beyers with a P2 will offer so so so so much more. But again, it depends if you are OK with the look on stage. Personally, I think it's quite cool - and they certainly will give you more sound wise until you start dropping some serious wedge on IEMs.

 

[dave_bass5]

No problem re the PM.

I was thinking of using my M50x’s with a P2, or even my small Bose on ears, and i have no issues with that for rehearsals, but not sure about gigs. I had a pair of DT770’s last year but didnt get on with them. My ears were sweating too much, even with just home use. 

I dont want to block the band out as such, although i know i wont with anything i use anyway, but do want an easy way of take it them out and in. I love memory from tips, but they arent quite as convenient as silicon. I just want to hear myself better, and have a nicer tone than a monitor can get. The reason i was thinking IEM’s was really because we have some here already. Thought it might be a cheap way of getting used to them before i need to use them seriously, or go off the idea without spending money on it. It might also help convince the others to think about it. 

Then again…gigs? 😁

Edited April 27, 2021 by dave_bass5

[dave_bass5]

I ended up getting a Gear4music version of the P2. It costs £5 less and seems identical. I also got a set of INAIRS but i ordered the wrong size. The new ones arrived this morning. 

I first tried my Sen HD25’s with the P2 and i think these will be used rather than the AT M50x’s, as they have a bit more mid. Plenty of volume and I’m used to hearing these. 

Then i tried the ZS10 Pro’s….WOW!!!!. Totally different sound to headphones, but i feel they sound much closer to a PA. I’m definitely going to give these ago on Monday at rehearsals as well. There is a noticeable hiss, but thats to be expected as I’m feeding a headphone amp from a headphone amp and they are very open sounding. I cant hear it with my headphones but the band will cover ti up anyway.

My only reservations are that i might not hear the band talking if ive got them in (and they spend more time talking about why the songs fell apart than playing) and as they are foam tips its not quite as easy putting them back in, but a minor negative and at least they stay in. I’ll probably use headphones more for now.

The second worry is ill be cut off from hearing how i sound in the PA. At rehearsals that will be controllable as they point towards me, and i dotn really need to make too many adjustments as I’m used to this PA now, but at gigs ill be worried I’m too loud etc. I guess i have quite a bit of time to get used to that though. In fact ive not gigged on keys yet anyway (at least not in this decade) so its going to be a new experience all round. 

I can say I’m now onboard with IEM’s though. Ill have ot buy my own before we gig though. I wish there were smaller versions of these. My ears are very flat so these stick out quite a bit. I also need to get a decent cable. The one’s I’m using at the moment do have an upgraded cable, but its a bit stiff and I’d prefer more like a headphone cable. 

So thats two of us in the band, 3 more to go. 

[dave_bass5]

Quick question. In reference to my above comments about size, does anyone have any experience with the MEE M6-Pro? Ive just seen a review and it came out well stocked up against the KZ range. Loads of tips and two cables etc. 

[EBS_freak]

5 minutes ago, dave_bass5 said:

Quick question. In reference to my above comments about size, does anyone have any experience with the MEE M6-Pro? Ive just seen a review and it came out well stocked up against the KZ range. Loads of tips and two cables etc. 

Don't do it. You'll miss the headroom of the multi-driver ZS10. Headroom is king.

[dave_bass5]

1 hour ago, EBS_freak said:

Don't do it. You'll miss the headroom of the multi-driver ZS10. Headroom is king.

Yeah, sound wise there will be a step back, but I’m not looking for top notch sound, just something to blend in with what i hear in the room. 

Comfort is much more important for me, at least at this stage. The ZS10 just seem to hang out of my ear. Because my ears are quite flat the body doesnt touch the ear, so although the foam tips mean they wont fall, there is a slight pulling on them. Ive been wearing them since the last post and i just cant get used to them. 

Obviously at this stage custom is not an option.

[dave_bass5]

I went ahead and order the MEE M6-Pro anyway, had to see for myself. Ok so they dont sound as good as the ZS10’s, but they fit really well. I love the form factor and how easy they are to put in. The memory wire is a big help. I only used the medium tips that were on them, but they are pretty much prefect. They do come with memory foam but for rehearsals where ill be taking them out quite a bit i want to stick with the silicon if i can. 

But, i have also ordered a set of MX2-Pro’s, as they have two drivers. I’m hoping they will be as nice as the M6, but with a bit more body. 

I’m happy to keep the M6, and its not a bad sound overall, but i want to hear the MX2 first before deciding which to send back. Either way i feel ill stick with this form factor for now, especially with the memory wire cable. 

[dave_bass5]

Change of plan, just ordered the MX3 Pro and cancelled the MX2.

Ive spent more time with the M6 and quite  like them now. Foam tips make them even better and not too much trouble getting them in quickly. As it happens the INAIRS that i was about to send back fit them perfectly. 

The MX3’s have 3 drivers so should be a good middle ground. 

Edited May 2, 2021 by dave_bass5

[dave_bass5]

Today’s episode. M6 pro and MX2 Pro are going back. Very happy with the MX3 pro…….but ive got the MX4 arriving tomorrow. 

Best so far are the MX3. Very full and just right in the lows and mids, but could do with a bit more sparkle on top if possible.  The MX4 should be that, with its 4 drivers. 

I keep going back to the ZS10’s to compare, and can wear them ok, but I’m not sure i like how they sound. Very open sounding, but i fear if i have to turn them up with the band the top end is  a bit harsh and might hurt my ears. The MEE’s seem to be warmer sounding, not as heft in the low end, but i dont need that. 

[EBS_freak]

3 hours ago, dave_bass5 said:

Today’s episode. M6 pro and MX2 Pro are going back. Very happy with the MX3 pro…….but ive got the MX4 arriving tomorrow. 

Best so far are the MX3. Very full and just right in the lows and mids, but could do with a bit more sparkle on top if possible.  The MX4 should be that, with its 4 drivers. 

I keep going back to the ZS10’s to compare, and can wear them ok, but I’m not sure i like how they sound. Very open sounding, but i fear if i have to turn them up with the band the top end is  a bit harsh and might hurt my ears. The MEE’s seem to be warmer sounding, not as heft in the low end, but i dont need that. 

Now we are talking. I'm very interesting to see how you get on with those quads.

[dave_bass5]

15 hours ago, EBS_freak said:

Now we are talking. I'm very interesting to see how you get on with those quads.

Well this is interesting. 

So i now have the M6 Pro, MX2, 3 and 4 here lol.

M6 were the first and i was happy with them, but the sound seems a bit flat and quiet. I prefer a bit of colour to the sound. I could live with it, but I know there is something more suitable in the Mee range. 

The MX2 pro: 2 drivers. More body but a bit bass heavier than i want if possible. I can live with it if i had to. It seems ok for my Synth, but a bit too much for music. As ive not got these to do general music listening thats not a concern, but still a consideration. 

MX3 Pro: took me a while but ive got used to them. I did a mix last night which took me a couple of hours and it sounded good on them, and i had no issues using them. My guitarist  says it sounds good through his studio monitors. Ive also been learning songs playing along to Spotify and my synth. Cant say i ever thought about the sound, it was just good and i enjoyed it. Piano’s and Brass are my main concerns, and both sounded good. Piano’s have body, Brass is full but not brittle. To my ears a nice balance without sounding in coloured.

MX4: only arrived about 30mins ago but first impressions are not what i hoped. The sound is good, fairly flat with nothing standing out. But its a similar case to the M6, only slightly louder. When i got a Fearless F112 a while ago i felt a similar thing. Nice sound, technically better I guess, but lacks colour and character. I guess there is more body but not where i wanted it.

They are also noticeable quieter which is strange as the 4 is rated at 12ohms, the 3 is 24ohms and the 2 is 32ohms. 

I’m running the 4’s in at the moment, maybe things will sound better in a few hours, and ill use them for the rest of the day, but i have a feeling ill end up with the MX3. Plus they cost £40 more than the MX3.

Will give a final update on Tuesday, after tomorrow’s rehearsal. 

[dave_bass5]

Well i can say now, the winner is the MX3 Pro. Ive gone back and forth between the 3 and 4 tonight. Each sounds good in its own way. The 4 has a smoother high end, the 3 has a better low and low mid. At the end of the day the 3 just sounds more my thing. I also think it will cut through better in a live situation, it just seems to have more welly.

 

[Phil Starr]

8 hours ago, dave_bass5 said:

Well i can say now, the winner is the MX3 Pro. Ive gone back and forth between the 3 and 4 tonight. Each sounds good in its own way. The 4 has a smoother high end, the 3 has a better low and low mid. At the end of the day the 3 just sounds more my thing. I also think it will cut through better in a live situation, it just seems to have more welly.

 

Following this with interest. I've been using the ZS10's and I can't say I'm happy with them as IEM's. They have a real fun sound for everyday listening but the bass is just too much for me when monitoring and also lacking in detail, it's all a bit one note. For singing they really lack the mids I need and with the scooped sound I can't pick out the rest of the band how I'd like. On gigs so far (remember them) I've ended up swapping them out for my cheapo Sennheisers or just removing them altogether and going back to earplugs and a floor monitor. It looks to me like the response of the MX3's might be what I'm looking for.

It would be great to hear from you as to how you get on with them once you've had them a few weeks.

[dave_bass5]

Although the MX3’s are advertised for singers and guitars  because of the slightly pronounced mid range, i can say ive noticed this with my synths so far.

Ill post back tonight after the rehearsal. I dont sing but my singer said she wants to try them. She has ZS10’s for gigging but doesnt use them at rehearsal but she would like to.

Before going to bed last night i gave the MX4 one more try, and honestly either would work for me, but at £140 its just not worth it when the cheaper ones sound more my thing, even though technically inferior. The low end is a bit heavier but its not a sub low like the ZS10’s have, and a warmer top end which i hope will be better for my hearing i have to turn up load.

The bottom line for me though is fit, and this type of IEM seems to fit and feel more comfortable than the larger ZS10 type.

Edited May 4, 2021 by dave_bass5

[dave_bass5]

Didnt get to rehearse as our drummer decided to stay at work so we cancelled. 

On top of that we had the offer of a pub gig in Sept at our fav pub and had to turn that down because the Guitarist is thinking of going away that weekend. 

Next rehearsal if they can all be bothered to make an effort is the 13th. Will report back after that. 

Just venting 😎

 

[EBS_freak]

Enjoying about your experiences through the range.

One thing that I will throw into the discussion pool though, is that the sound of an IEM can be influences by a global EQ across the aux out. Now while I understand that it's nice to have an IEM sounding "right" without any processing, the option is of course there.

As for the band, well, I can't help you much on that one!  

[dave_bass5]

3 hours ago, EBS_freak said:

Enjoying about your experiences through the range.

One thing that I will throw into the discussion pool though, is that the sound of an IEM can be influences by a global EQ across the aux out. Now while I understand that it's nice to have an IEM sounding "right" without any processing, the option is of course there.

As for the band, well, I can't help you much on that one!  

Cheers. I’m just going Synth to ears at the moment, but i feel there will be more going in to the chain sooner rather than later. 

I’m going to try and get my drummer to start using them as well, he does backing vocals and although he can sing he is more often than not out of tune. Do they make any with thick rubber tubing attached? 😁

 

[Phil Starr]

@EBS_freak this might give you a wry smile. We've now got a sound engineer (which I've always been wanting) and just had a session to get things set up for when we get back gigging. 

Tried the ZS10's properly for the first time along with my Trantec wireless system, real revelation when you have time to set up the mix into the earphones. Our tech set them up at the desk with his own in-ears then passed me the Trantec to plug mine into with a rough mix already set.  A few tweaks and we were off and easily the best experience so far. They still lack mids a little so my vocals could have been better but everything else was all there. If I get that sound consistently ( and I cant see why not) I can live with them for a few months and then maybe look at an upgrade if I know I'm going to stick there. The remains of my hearing thanks you.