The IEM (in ear monitors) Bible thread

[RichardH]

3 hours ago, Jakester said:

If he likes spending money, the Yamaha EAD10 is an all in one mic/monitoring solution. 

I was going to mention that (but hesitated due to the cost). Our drummer has one, and it works surprisingly well. I multitrack record our gigs via the mixer, and the only drum monitoring we have is the EAD10. We also use the feed from it through the PA to add a bit of oomph to the overall sound. 

[Jakester]

1 hour ago, RichardH said:

I was going to mention that (but hesitated due to the cost). Our drummer has one, and it works surprisingly well. I multitrack record our gigs via the mixer, and the only drum monitoring we have is the EAD10. We also use the feed from it through the PA to add a bit of oomph to the overall sound. 

Yep, they’re great if you don’t already have a drum mic setup. If you have, they’re probably a better bet in the long term. 

[Chienmortbb]

Takes three mics, but the Glyn Johns method works well.

Works well live too.

Edited January 5, 2023 by Chienmortbb

[EBS_freak]

I used Recorderman and Glyn Johns for live use for a while... never convinced. And neither was the drummer.

[EBS_freak]

I shall tell you the secret of how to get anybody in your band onto IEMs.

 

Have a talkback mic.

 

FOMO soon kicks in when the rest of the band is laughing at what is being said over the talkback mic between numbers... and you're not.

[Chienmortbb]

18 hours ago, EBS_freak said:

I used Recorderman and Glyn Johns for live use for a while... never convinced. And neither was the drummer.

What do you use now?

[EBS_freak]

I mic the kit in its entirety. 

[Muppet]

This is a game changer. So easy to control my own mix, in stereo, even whilst playing. It's brilliant. Thanks to @EBS_freakfor the recommendation.

 

 

[RichardH]

19 hours ago, Jakester said:

Yep, they’re great if you don’t already have a drum mic setup. If you have, they’re probably a better bet in the long term. 

I do have drum mics, and have been thinking of adding a kick mic to get a better kick sound from the recordings, but the EAD10 is sooooooo easy - and on a small stage space, the lack of extra mic stands is a real boon as well! The recordings are only for us to listen back to for reference as to how terribly we played. Here's an example recording - I have to admit I don't spend ages tweaking the mix or anything, just set the levels roughly in Reaper for the whole set, then export one track at a time. As you'll hear, the drum sound isn't brilliant - but I don't think we have explored the EAD10's capabilities that much yet - but it certainly works for being able to hear.

[Jakester]

5 hours ago, RichardH said:

I do have drum mics, and have been thinking of adding a kick mic to get a better kick sound from the recordings, but the EAD10 is sooooooo easy - and on a small stage space, the lack of extra mic stands is a real boon as well! The recordings are only for us to listen back to for reference as to how terribly we played. Here's an example recording - I have to admit I don't spend ages tweaking the mix or anything, just set the levels roughly in Reaper for the whole set, then export one track at a time. As you'll hear, the drum sound isn't brilliant - but I don't think we have explored the EAD10's capabilities that much yet - but it certainly works for being able to hear.

 

Yep, they work well for monitoring, but essentially all they are is an XY configuration in the crotch position with a trigger for the bass drum. You could do the same with a Zoom recorder and a cheap piezo trigger - apart from all the clever processing in the EAD10 module. 

 

Good point about the stands, but I've got a great live sound with just a kick and single overhead mic. I generally mic two overheads, kick and snare and that does me fine. 

 

I think if someone is starting from scratch, the EAD10 might be a good option. If they already have mics, then essentially you're replicating what they already have. 

[WalMan]

I am thinking of getting back to IEM's after many years.  We used to have dedicated mixers on CAT5's to the digital stage box but it was a bit of a faff and more cables trailing.

 

Sound guy now has a wifi router connected to the stage box so it would be easy to have a fold back sub on the box and do any tweaks with Mixing Station or X-Air on my phone connected to the router.

 

EAD10 looks very interesting for the kit. I shall have to go back over this thread to find out more

[mrtcat]

Just had my UE6 pros reshelled by Robert at Lugs. Really pleased with the result. The isolation is better than when I first got the UE6s and they sound fat and detailed. 

[bassmansam]

6 hours ago, mrtcat said:

Just had my UE6 pros reshelled by Robert at Lugs. Really pleased with the result. The isolation is better than when I first got the UE6s and they sound fat and detailed. 

 

I also have the UE6. Was there an issue with yours that made you want to re shell them? 

[mrtcat]

2 hours ago, bassmansam said:

 

I also have the UE6. Was there an issue with yours that made you want to re shell them? 

Essentially the shape of my ears changed slightly and that meant the ue6s started to sound way worse because I wasn't getting a decent seal. I also absolutely hated the UE cable design, that was one of the most pi** poor pieces of design ever. The cable failed twice in 2 years and UE wanted £180 for a replacement which is criminal imo. The fit is now way better than when UE first produced them and the lugs cable and socket is infinitely better.

[dave_bass5]

I really need to look in to custom fits. Ive really struggling keeping my right ear in, even with foam tips.  Ive tried quite a few different types so far, and although most work, i find the seal isnt great after a song or two. 

 

[EBS_freak]

9 minutes ago, dave_bass5 said:

I really need to look in to custom fits. Ive really struggling keeping my right ear in, even with foam tips.  Ive tried quite a few different types so far, and although most work, i find the seal isnt great after a song or two. 

 

That's exactly I went to my first customs. My ears are just weird. Nothing but customs stay put.

[mrtcat]

8 minutes ago, dave_bass5 said:

I really need to look in to custom fits. Ive really struggling keeping my right ear in, even with foam tips.  Ive tried quite a few different types so far, and although most work, i find the seal isnt great after a song or two. 

 

It's a big step up in terms of isolation and comfort. 

[dave_bass5]

9 minutes ago, EBS_freak said:

That's exactly I went to my first customs. My ears are just weird. Nothing but customs stay put.

 

9 minutes ago, mrtcat said:

It's a big step up in terms of isolation and comfort. 

Yeah, looks like i have no real option. 

I know Mee do them for $150 (im using Mee IEM’s) but not sure if i have  go to them? I realise i need to get my ears scanned (Specravers do it) but it would speed things up if i could get them made over here. 

[EBS_freak]

Just had a look at the Mee. They are custom tips as opposed to custom shells. I can't really comment on the Mee as I have no experience - but I do know of peoples experiences with Shures with custom tips... and they aren't good - they tend to separate at inopportune moments. 

[dave_bass5]

1 hour ago, EBS_freak said:

Just had a look at the Mee. They are custom tips as opposed to custom shells. I can't really comment on the Mee as I have no experience - but I do know of peoples experiences with Shures with custom tips... and they aren't good - they tend to separate at inopportune moments. 

Hmm, id never thought of it like that. Now it makes sense that people get their IEM’s re shelled. I must admit im not too keen on having those large lumps sticking out of my ears. 

I think i need to re up on all this again and find some that take the custom shells. 

 

Thanks for  heads up. 

[mrtcat]

9 minutes ago, dave_bass5 said:

Hmm, id never thought of it like that. Now it makes sense that people get their IEM’s re shelled. I must admit im not too keen on having those large lumps sticking out of my ears. 

I think i need to re up on all this again and find some that take the custom shells. 

 

Thanks for  heads up. 

Proper custom fit iems aren't going to be cheap however you do it. Probably the most cost effective way in is to buy decent non custom in ear monitors (UE900s or similar) and have them reshelled by a company like lugs. You are unlikely to see any change from £500 but, personally, I'd rather spend that kind of money on in ears than on an amp and cab. 

 

If you could get some kz10s reshelled it may be a good value option because they use decent components. I wouldn't bother getting mee's reshelled. I had a pair and they were OK but definitely not the same quality as the kz10s.

Edited January 8, 2023 by mrtcat

[dave_bass5]

56 minutes ago, mrtcat said:

Proper custom fit iems aren't going to be cheap however you do it. Probably the most cost effective way in is to buy decent non custom in ear monitors (UE900s or similar) and have them reshelled by a company like lugs. You are unlikely to see any change from £500 but, personally, I'd rather spend that kind of money on in ears than on an amp and cab. 

 

If you could get some kz10s reshelled it may be a good value option because they use decent components. I wouldn't bother getting mee's reshelled. I had a pair and they were OK but definitely not the same quality as the kz10s.

Thanks, good info. I will look in to it. I guess £500 isnt out of the question if i end up with a good, reliable fit. 

 

i will disagree about the MEE’s vs KZ10 (and KZ10 Pro) though. My singer (and GF) has the KZ Pro, and i didn't like them when i tried them. I wanted to, but they just weren’t for me. They sounded a bit harsh and brash to my ear. Flat, and maybe more true, but cold and lifeless. I went through 4 versions of the MEE’s, inc the 4 driver version, and settled on the 3 driver version. Nice and warm, not neutral but much more pleasing to my ears. 

 

So i could get the MEE’s re shelled? I really like the sound of them, and while im sure (no pun intended) more money could get me better, it seems a waste of money to me as im already happy with the ones i have. Other than the fit. 

[jimmyb625]

A heads-up for anyone who struggles with using a separate instrument and wired IEM cable.

Design-a-cable have a version as well, but this is pretty cheap (£38 at the moment)

 

https://amzn.eu/d/adEflBz

 

Edited January 8, 2023 by jimmyb625
Link

[dave_bass5]

Talking of cable’s, i think it was this thread where we were talking about stereo using a jack to XLR cable in to a P2. Back then i couldn't get this to work. Last week i was over at a mates place and he uses a P2. There was no issue with stereo for him. I got a new P2 today and i also have stereo. Guess i had a bad unit.

[mrtcat]

15 minutes ago, dave_bass5 said:

Thanks, good info. I will look in to it. I guess £500 isnt out of the question if i end up with a good, reliable fit. 

 

i will disagree about the MEE’s vs KZ10 (and KZ10 Pro) though. My singer (and GF) has the KZ Pro, and i didn't like them when i tried them. I wanted to, but they just weren’t for me. They sounded a bit harsh and brash to my ear. Flat, and maybe more true, but cold and lifeless. I went through 4 versions of the MEE’s, inc the 4 driver version, and settled on the 3 driver version. Nice and warm, not neutral but much more pleasing to my ears. 

 

So i could get the MEE’s re shelled? I really like the sound of them, and while im sure (no pun intended) more money could get me better, it seems a waste of money to me as im already happy with the ones i have. Other than the fit. 

I think the thing to remember about having non custom iems reshelled is that the components don't necessarily dictate the sound. They may well limit the quality of sound and reliability but the person / persons doing the reshelling, if competent, will be able to tune the finished product so it gives a pleasing sound. KZ's use industry standard balanced armature drivers from Knowles (as used in many of the high end iems) whereas mee use Chinese parts. If I was spending £250 for the reshelling and £50 for ear impressions, I'd be reluctant to use cheaper Chinese parts in the finished product. 

 

My personal experience of KZ10 's is far from them being harsh or flat sounding. They have an inherently scooped sound with heaps of low end headroom due to the use of dual dynamic drivers. I'd liken them to the kind of "boom and sparkle" sound you get from the low midrange stereo offerings from Bose or B&W. I guess that's where sound becomes really subjective though.