dave_bass5 Posted July 31, 2023 Share Posted July 31, 2023 Just had a rehearsal with my new IE400 pro’s. Not sure what to make of them. They sound great, but I struggled to get a good seal. I took 4 different pairs of tips and i did finally settle on an old pair of those bulbous shapes Comply tips that didn’t really work with my MEE’s. They worked fine in the end but they are slightly larger than the IE100, and over £200 more expensive. I guess I’ll keep them. I’m sure I’ll get used to them. At no point did they feel like they were coming loose, which is the whole point of them. It’s just that the slightly inferior IE100 is a lot cheaper and also does the job. 1st world problems lol. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greg Edwards69 Posted August 1, 2023 Share Posted August 1, 2023 As posted on another thread, this might be helpful to some of you Just found this resource, that appears to be most helpful. He's also put a sub $100 video review together. https://crinacle.com/rankings/iems/ https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ks6PGwD6Cjo&ab_channel=crinacle On the strength of that, a set of Moondrop Aria IEMS appear to be the one to get. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Al Krow Posted August 1, 2023 Share Posted August 1, 2023 (edited) 1 hour ago, Greg Edwards69 said: As posted on another thread, this might be helpful to some of you Just found this resource, that appears to be most helpful. He's also put a sub $100 video review together. https://crinacle.com/rankings/iems/ https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ks6PGwD6Cjo&ab_channel=crinacle On the strength of that, a set of Moondrop Aria IEMS appear to be the one to get. Thanks for sharing that. Oooh, that's going to put the cat amongst the pigeons! He's not at all keen on the BC goto KZ ZS10s!! (at 12.33+) Interesting that he rates the single driver Moondrop Aria and Dunu Titan S much more highly that the 5 driver KZs and says that number of drivers does not necessarily equate to quality of sound, which goes against the received wisdom we may have bought into. If you get the Moondrops - please do let us know how they stack up against your KZs. Edited August 1, 2023 by Al Krow Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dave_bass5 Posted August 1, 2023 Share Posted August 1, 2023 33 minutes ago, Al Krow said: Thanks for sharing that. Oooh, that's going to put the cat amongst the pigeons! He's not at all keen on the BC goto KZ ZS10s!! (at 12.33+) Interesting that he rates the single driver Moondrop Aria and Dunu Titan S much more highly that the 5 driver KZs and says that number of drivers does not necessarily equate to quality of sound, which goes against the received wisdom we may have bought into. If you get the Moondrops - please do let us know how they stack up against your KZs. As someone who had (twice), and didn’t like the KZ I’m now using a single driver IEM and it sounds so much better. Even Dawn (who is using KZ 10’s) is getting a pair of the IE 100 pros, and our guitarist who was using (don’t laugh) wired ear buds he got with a phone has tested the KZ, MEE and the IE 100 pro, and guess what he is getting ? In fact the IE100 sounds better than my MEE’s which have 3 drivers in them. The IE range are very small and fit snugly in my flat ears. That in itself is worth the asking price. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greg Edwards69 Posted August 1, 2023 Share Posted August 1, 2023 Indeed. As someone mentioned on a reddit thread I saw earlier (I've really gone down a budge IEM rabbit hole): Zs10 pro was my first “audiophile” device and it was awesome at first, until i realized that “detail” does not mean “aggressive treble” I agree with that sentiment. I wondered why my ZS10's sounded harsh in the top end when we upgraded from our cheap, crappy G4M IEM. They are! I keep seeing the Moondrop Aria's popping up in various interweb threads, so they are definitely on my shopping list. Just need to find a good deal for them. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EBS_freak Posted August 1, 2023 Author Share Posted August 1, 2023 (edited) 6 hours ago, Al Krow said: Interesting that he rates the single driver Moondrop Aria and Dunu Titan S much more highly that the 5 driver KZs and says that number of drivers does not necessarily equate to quality of sound, which goes against the received wisdom we may have bought into. Just want to add some context to that (I mention it in the opening posts but appreciate theres a lot in there). Multidriver can give a better sound and generally gives more headroom. I say can give a better sound based on the following being true. * Drivers that are selected are specifically chosen to service the frequency ranges that are good at and work in harmony with the other drivers that are included in the multi-driver setup. This means that crossovers are pleasing to avoid and significant peaks or drop out... and most importantly, there are no phasing issues. A poor multidriver that suffers from poor crossovers, poor tuning or phase issues as well as the left and right sides not being matched all adds to the risk. This is why the big boy brands tend to succeed, as they have got very good at making multi-driver units that work... and in some cases, had drivers specifically manufactured to engineer their way to a better sounding IEM. I have seen more than my fair share or individual try and create their own IEMs... and if they do manage to make them, a lot of them may come in at a favourable price point... but sound stinky poo, don't match ear to ear - and plagued with phasing problems. A single driver generally can't deliver sub to the ultra highs that well... which is why multi drivers come into play. Think about your PA... there's not many PA tops that come without a dedicated high frequency driver! * Headroom is seriously important - if you are a bass player that likes bass, you'll find a lot of IEMs can't reproduce the lows without distorting. Remember when you listen to a CD etc, the music has been mastered - there are not the transients that you get from a typical aux bus. Multi driver units greatly reduce the risk of distortion as the drivers do not have to work as hard. Importantly, a single driver can be running into non perceivable distortion (in that you can't hear it) - but this will cause faster ear fatigue. Then you run the risk of cranking the volume it as your ears become more and more tired. You shouldn't read too much into the audiophiles and their reviews of IEMs for live use as their reference material and reviews doesn't always pan over to IEM use on stage. The ZS10 is a gateway IEM in my book - in the fact that it's proven to be more than OK in proving the concept of IEMs to people. If you were to use the in ears that you get free with your phone, I would wager most people who do so (and I have witnessed people do this) suggest that they have "tried IEMs" and they are rubbish. Are the KZ10s the best thing since sliced bread? Of course not - but they do prove the concept and personally, I'd still take a KS10 set up over a wedge monitor and a set of earplugs. If KS10s get people into the world of IEMs from which they can move on and find what really works for them, then job done. I also know that for the people that crave super amounts of low end (appreciate not everybody is in this camp) they will deliver. They will also not have broken the bank but proven the concept. Put it like this, they are better than a set of Shure 215s that fall more into the category of performance of those sets of IEMs you get with your phone. So yeah, my recommendation on the P2 and ZS10 still stands as I reckon it's enough (and it's proven time and time again on here), to get people convinced to go on the IEM journey. Even though some people on here have gone different routes, it's likely the ZS10 that got them sold in the first place. I haven't tried the Moondrops so they may be good but may fall down due to some of the things I've mentioned above in a live environment. Headroom in the lows without distortion would probably be my primary concern. But even that has variables - how loud do like your IEMs, how much bass - can you get a good seal to keep the volume down.... etc etc... Anyway, happy hunting for your perfect IEM (no matter what it is, or how many drivers it has!) Edited August 1, 2023 by EBS_freak 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Al Krow Posted August 1, 2023 Share Posted August 1, 2023 Cheers Russ - the ZS10s have absolutely been a gateway IEM and proved the concept to my band for relatively minimal outlay (we managed to pick up a pack of 4 for £100 for the full band from AliExpress). To that end they've certainly proved their value and done the job. 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EBS_freak Posted August 1, 2023 Author Share Posted August 1, 2023 25 quid a player. That's ridiculously good value in my book! There's literally nothing that springs to mind that I could recommend at that price point. That and a P2, what, 75 quid? Now find a wedge monitor that delivers anywhere near the same experience! (And will fit in your pocket!) 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greg Edwards69 Posted August 2, 2023 Share Posted August 2, 2023 Thanks the reply @EBS_freak. Yes, the ZS10 is still a great gateway IEM and I now better understand the benefits of multi-BA drivers for headroom in a live environment. However, as I mentioned several posts ago, I have the original non-pro versions. These are just BA drivers, not a hybrid design with a dynamic driver for better low-end. As such, I'm finding them a bit light in the low end and a bit aggressive/harsh at the high mid area. I was considering getting the ZS10 Pro X as an upgrade, but I kept seeing the Moondrop Aria pop up on reviews. Admittedly, it didn't occur to me at the time the difference between listening to recorded music and live music from an aux bus and the headroom issue. However, I already found an open box set at a good price on ebay before reading your reply and ordered them. But I'm quite hopeful. My bass always has compression on it, I don't drive my Xvive U4 receiver too hard, I use comply foam tips for better isolation, and the Aria's are rated at a seemingly impressive 122spl @1khz. Hey, if I don't like them, I can return/sell them/keep them as spares and get the ZS10 Pro X instead. It's not a lot of money to lose. That's the great thing about these inexpensive solutions, you can try a few before settling. And it's always handing to keep a few lying around for spares or quiet practice at home. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EBS_freak Posted August 2, 2023 Author Share Posted August 2, 2023 (edited) Absolutely, I have all sorts of cheapo IEMs that I just keep in the gig bag, mainly because nobody else in the band has the brains to carry a spare and will always look to me to magically come up with a solution. Being relatively cheap, its not a big drama and gives me the opportunity to see if there is anything that I particularly like for not a lot of money. (Not that any of them stay in my weird shape ears) The other thing about IEMs and particularly places like head-fi, it only takes one person of note to say something is good and all the sheep follow. Now, I know you probably think, well what about EBS and his ZS10 and UE6s mentions... I did say, "...they are a 5 driver per side hybrid setup that can be had for typically less than £40 and will slay most of the competition (perhaps I should quantify by adding in "in a similar price range"). Even a move from 215s to ZS10s will immediately show you the benefit of headroom, especially as a bass player. Whilst the ZS10 may not be the best sounding IEMs in isolation, on stage, they have bags of headroom and great low-end response, so for bass players especially, they are a much better investment than many of the commonly mentioned alternatives you see time and time again." (My underlying message here is that ZS10s are way better than 215s (and pretty much all the Shure offerings for that matter!) - which are commonly bought as a "quality" IEM because they are "Shure" and Shure know a thing or two about audio, right?) UE6s though, I do recommend based on the fact that they are a great unit, that sound great with the headroom most are craving for - and of all the shows I have done with CIEM company, they remain one of the faves - and no complaints! Edited August 2, 2023 by EBS_freak 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
warwickhunt Posted August 2, 2023 Share Posted August 2, 2023 Moondrop Aria - any owners/users can comment on the ergonomics of the fit? They look to be quite 'blocky' and I think one of my isolation issues with my present ZS10s is due to the bulk of them, which I think could be pulling or rotating them in my out ear. I totally appreciate that everyone's ear is different and that moulds are the absolute answer (I have custom moulded attenuated ear protection from pre IEM). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EBS_freak Posted August 2, 2023 Author Share Posted August 2, 2023 (edited) 9 minutes ago, warwickhunt said: I totally appreciate that everyone's ear is different and that moulds are the absolute answer Gaffa taped over your ears. Job done. You may think I'm joking... but it's been done on one of my gigs! Edited August 2, 2023 by EBS_freak 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dave_bass5 Posted August 2, 2023 Share Posted August 2, 2023 (edited) 33 minutes ago, warwickhunt said: Moondrop Aria - any owners/users can comment on the ergonomics of the fit? They look to be quite 'blocky' and I think one of my isolation issues with my present ZS10s is due to the bulk of them, which I think could be pulling or rotating them in my out ear. I totally appreciate that everyone's ear is different and that moulds are the absolute answer (I have custom moulded attenuated ear protection from pre IEM). Can’t comment on those, but as someone with flat ears and have always had issues with the right coming loose, I now have no issues with the IE100/400 pro. These are slim enough to actually hook in to my ear, which seems to be the key. I’ve commented about the sound above. Edited August 2, 2023 by dave_bass5 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jimmyb625 Posted August 2, 2023 Share Posted August 2, 2023 2 hours ago, EBS_freak said: Gaffa taped over your ears. Job done. You may think I'm joking... but it's been done on one of my gigs! Our guitarist/singist has to do this with his shure's, albeit with medical tape. My suggestion of staples wasn't taken up for some reason... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dave_bass5 Posted August 2, 2023 Share Posted August 2, 2023 37 minutes ago, jimmyb625 said: Our guitarist/singist has to do this with his shure's, albeit with medical tape. My suggestion of staples wasn't taken up for some reason... Does that tape work on mouths as well? I know a guitarist that insists on setting a mic up for BV’s, but really shouldn’t…😂😇 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigRedX Posted August 2, 2023 Share Posted August 2, 2023 41 minutes ago, dave_bass5 said: Does that tape work on mouths as well? I know a guitarist that insists on setting a mic up for BV’s, but really shouldn’t…😂😇 That's what the channel fader in the desk is for. Give him plenty of vocals in his IEMs and mute him FoH. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gazhowe Posted August 2, 2023 Share Posted August 2, 2023 I tried universal fit iem’s for the first time at a couple of gigs before my band went on hold due to losing our lead vocalist (hopefully now sorted). Whilst I wasn’t happy with my bass tone through the in ears in the limited time i used them I expect this will get better though time and experimenting. What was great was the noise reduction, which was the main reason for trying iems. Due my worsening hearing I’ve decided to go for custom fit and booked an appointment for later this month to try the UE6 and UE11 pros and possibly some JH11’s prior to ordering. I’ve discounted 64 audio due to less isolation offered than UE or JH. Does anyone have any views on comparisons between the above three models they could share please? Thanks in advance, Gaz Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SimBass Posted August 2, 2023 Share Posted August 2, 2023 When my Shure 425s broke about 6 months ago I went on my own 'exploration' of cheap IEM. Here are my 'reviews' from using as IEM (not recreational music listening). KZ ZS10 Pro X: (4BA+1DD) (£30 Aliexpress) A big improvement over my 425s but an 'intolerable to my ears' harshness at 8kHz. My wife loves them for vocals but I can't use them for long periods TINHIFI T3 Pro: (1DD) (£52 Aliexpress) Better and flatter than the ZS10 and the Shures but not quite the clarity of sound stage from the multi driver units. KZ AS16 Pro: (8BA) (£40 Aliexpress) These are my go to, all the clarity of the ZS10 but without the 'V shape' or '8kHz harsh' (only down side is they are big) - the fact that 'https://crinacle.com/rankings/iems/' gives these the same 'V-shape harshness' description as ZS10, is frankly bonkers (unless the 'Pro' really makes that much difference?) They are drastically different and are way flatter My conclusion KZ AS16 Pro are my go to and my recommendation, the only down side is thate are big and bulky and less comfy than Shures or T3 Pro. I love these and they have changed the way I do on stage monitoring TINHIFI T3 Pro are my permanant backup in my gig bag and I occasionally put them in if I know have a long day of IEM since they are just so comfy KZ ZS10 Pro: Personally I would pay the extra for something with less harshness (although I'm more sensitive to that than some since my wife loves these for singing) I'm really happy with the AS16 and now have no 'itch' for custom moulds, even though I know they may well be better I can't justify the enormous increase in cost over the £40 ones that I now love 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dave_bass5 Posted August 2, 2023 Share Posted August 2, 2023 47 minutes ago, BigRedX said: That's what the channel fader in the desk is for. Give him plenty of vocals in his IEMs and mute him FoH. It’s more the fact that him and the bass player share a wedge monitor, and he is putting the bass player off (plus drummer as it spills across the stage. I hid his mic once, but one of the others (without realising what I had done) found him a spare 🙄 Another blessing for IEM’s. I’m in my own world back there and it all sounds great. Before getting the XR18 I used to have my own desk feeding just my Keys and an ambient mic to my IEM. That was fine, but now i get enough spill from the other mics that I don’t even need that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
francisabear Posted August 4, 2023 Share Posted August 4, 2023 Hi all, hope you can help me and apologies if a similar query has been posted before. I purchased some Comply Professional Series tips for my ZS10s but they don't fit - a huge shame because I got a great seal due to the increased length of the bud Comply Professional series I then got some 500 series tips which do fit the ZS10s but the seal is nowhere near as solid because they are about half the length 500 series Can anyone recommend some long foam isolating tips? I've tried to search for some but most appear the standard length, and there are so many out there I would really appreciate some bass-related recommendations. I have hearing loss (especially at low frequencies) so a good seal is vital Thanks everyone Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dave_bass5 Posted August 4, 2023 Share Posted August 4, 2023 Have you tried the comfort series? I’ve just switched to these as they are fatter. I get a better seal without needing them too far in. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EBS_freak Posted August 4, 2023 Author Share Posted August 4, 2023 Do they not fit due them being too loose - or because the tip wont actually attach to the output tube? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
francisabear Posted August 4, 2023 Share Posted August 4, 2023 2 hours ago, EBS_freak said: Do they not fit due them being too loose - or because the tip wont actually attach to the output tube? The second one, try as I might the hole is too small and won’t fit around the ZS10 output tube - and as far as I know they don’t offer this product with any other type fitting Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EBS_freak Posted August 4, 2023 Author Share Posted August 4, 2023 Drill mod? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
markbunney Posted August 5, 2023 Share Posted August 5, 2023 Has anybody had any success using a Boss WL20L with a Behringer P2 as a DIY wireless set. I have tried today but can only get it to work in left ear. (Note the P2 works in both ears when using XLR so I know it’s not faulty) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.