The IEM (in ear monitors) Bible thread

[police squad]

so the impressions thing

I read on here that you should bite on something when having the impression done, to ensure a good seal.

 

I spoke to a hearing specialist recently and he said if you're a singer you shouldn't do the bite thing during the mould

But if you dont sing, then do the bite.

 

any thoughts?

[glassmoon]

5 minutes ago, Phil Starr said:

At Snugs HQ, it’s not too far for me. 

Nice - A tad for from me, but I will check in with The Hearing Hub, several branches in Essex (on the Snugs website  )

[glassmoon]

1 minute ago, police squad said:

so the impressions thing

I read on here that you should bite on something when having the impression done, to ensure a good seal.

 

I spoke to a hearing specialist recently and he said if you're a singer you shouldn't do the bite thing during the mould

But if you dont sing, then do the bite.

 

any thoughts?

Back in my old life in South Africa, I had several impressions done, by 4 different companies, and not once was I asked if I sang or not, neither was I required to bite down on anything.  But it does raise an interesting question on how the mouth's actions potential can affect the fit... when I smile on stage, I notice that I need to adjust my fit (hence me wanting new tips too I think) as they shift... and for bassists, shifts mean less bass and more noise bleed.

 

I shall have to do a little Yahoo'ing... oh wait, it's 2024... let me use that new one, Google LOL (sorry, crap day at work, so a little laugh is needed)

[MichaelDean]

51 minutes ago, police squad said:

so the impressions thing

I read on here that you should bite on something when having the impression done, to ensure a good seal.

 

I spoke to a hearing specialist recently and he said if you're a singer you shouldn't do the bite thing during the mould

But if you dont sing, then do the bite.

 

any thoughts?

Caveat: This is just my experience and it might be ear shape dependent.

 

I had some ACS earplugs made while I was at uni for a discount. I didn't have a bite block and the resulting moulds didn't seal properly. Everytime I opened my mouth, it broke any seal I managed to get. Infuriating but I didn't do anything about it and just guessed they weren't that good.

 

A couple of years later, I tried making my own custom tips for IEMs with two part setting silicone*. I had better results when I kept my mouth open duing the setting.

 

This year, I've had ACS earplugs made and used a bite block and they're great.

 

 

*The steps were:

• Take some from each pot and mix them up - I think one pack did two sets because you're sticking the IEM in there
• Jam it in your ear as deep as you can
• Stick in the IEM
• Let it set
• Remove the whole thing
• Let it fully cure, I usually waited 24 hours
• Attempt to drill a hole from the exit of the IEM to your ear canal (I just held a 2/3mm drill bit in my hands)

Not always 100% successful, but when they were, it was delightful. I was properly isolated from everything. Each pair lasted about 6 months of daily use.

[EBS_freak]

Bite block every time.

 

Only folks that shouldn’t use a bite block are audiophiles who want to just sit still in a chair and get lost in the music or whatever they do.

[glassmoon]

Therefore bass players are gimps!

[MartinB]

I'm looking at options for a single cable with the unbalanced mono bass signal going one way, and a stereo or balanced-mono signal coming the other way and into a headphone amp (Behringer P2 or similar).

The pre-made options seem quite spendy:
- Ernie Ball Instrument And Headphone Cable ~£60

- Designable Combo Cable for IEM Systems ~£80

Plus they need an additional patch cable to connect to the headphone amp.

 

Could the same thing be achieved more affordably by using a dual TRS cable? e.g. this for ~£15

 

The second core (Ring) on the connection from the bass would be unused; if this was going to cause an issue (e.g. with an active bass that uses a stereo socket for switching), it ought to be simple enough rewire those plugs to join Ring and Sleeve.

Does this seem viable, or am I missing something? Possibly something to do with shielding and grounding?

[Mottlefeeder]

I've been using stereo microphone cable to do this for several years - it works well for active basses with electronics to drive the signal through the cable, but passive basses may have some loss of high frequency contect due to the cable capacitance. 

David

[MichaelDean]

@MartinB if you can solder: take the ends off the mono and stereo cables, feed them through some braided sleeving, solder the ends back on, bit of black insulation tape to make the ends look neat. Bosh. 

 

https://amzn.eu/d/d9vF3Qu

[EBS_freak]

16 hours ago, MichaelDean said:

bit of black insulation tape to make the ends look neat.

Glue lined heatshrink.

[EBS_freak]

The links are all in the opening posts - but admittedly, this one was out of date.

 

If you are handy with soldering, heres the cable you need - https://www.sommercable.com/en-gb/Instrument-Cable-TRICONE-SYMASYM-1-x-2-x-0-14-mm2-PVC-11.3-x-11.3-mm-black/301-1101#neonCfg=pulength::pu100

[MartinB]

2 hours ago, EBS_freak said:

The links are all in the opening posts - but admittedly, this one was out of date.

 

If you are handy with soldering, heres the cable you need - https://www.sommercable.com/en-gb/Instrument-Cable-TRICONE-SYMASYM-1-x-2-x-0-14-mm2-PVC-11.3-x-11.3-mm-black/301-1101#neonCfg=pulength::pu100

Yep, I saw that - thanks! That's what the made-up Designacable one uses. I'm wondering whether there's a middle ground between this premium option, and lashing together separate mono and stereo cables.

[EBS_freak]

3 hours ago, MartinB said:

Yep, I saw that - thanks! That's what the made-up Designacable one uses. I'm wondering whether there's a middle ground between this premium option, and lashing together separate mono and stereo cables.

It’s worth doing properly as two cables lashed together each with the protective rubber sheath on tend to get overly heavy and not very flexible very quickly.

[Mottlefeeder]

As a compromise, Studiospares did a figure-8 stereo microphone cable - two balanced cables joined together. Haven't found it yet on the G4M site...

David

[Greg Edwards69]

Our drummer uses a small mixer for his IEM feed that sits on a shelf clamped to his hi-hat stand so his can quickly adjust the level without fumbling with a belt pack.  He forgot to bring it Saturday night. 

 

Behringer P2 to the rescue!

 

Seriously, any band that used IEM should have at least a couple of these or similar in a gig bag as a backup.

Edited December 9 by Greg Edwards69

[Woodinblack]

21 minutes ago, Greg Edwards69 said:

Behringer P2 to the rescue!

 

Seriously, any band that used IEM should have at least a couple of these or similar in a gig bag as a backup.

 

I always keep on with me - they are small, it doesn't hurt and you never know.

[dave_bass5]

The only reason i got the passive version is to keep with me, just in case. I’m not sure how long the battery will last in the P2 if it’s not used for a year to so. Not having to worry about a battery seems like a better option for me. 

[EBS_freak]

9 hours ago, Mottlefeeder said:

As a compromise, Studiospares did a figure-8 stereo microphone cable - two balanced cables joined together. Haven't found it yet on the G4M site...

David

You want shielded for an unbalanced instrument cable.

[MartinB]

The figure-8 cable I was looking at (https://custom-lynx.co.uk/product/2sj-2sj-_-rean/) says the following:
 

Quote

Figure 8 Audio Cable
• Flexible, Noiseless, Oxygen Free Cable
• Copper Screen 38 x 0.10mm per conductor
• Copper Spiral Shielding
• 8.2mm O.D (4.1mm O.D per side)
• Flexible PVC Jacket
• 24 AWG

Think I'll just get one and see what's what, since I've got a use for it elsewhere if this idea doesn't pan out. My Aliexpress "P2" should be here this afternoon - will give it a test to see if it really does have a limiter or not.

[Woodinblack]

58 minutes ago, dave_bass5 said:

The only reason i got the passive version is to keep with me, just in case. I’m not sure how long the battery will last in the P2 if it’s not used for a year to so. Not having to worry about a battery seems like a better option for me. 

 

Makes sense, but I have rechargables in all these things and I just routinely rotate through them, there are the wireless microphone, guitar sender and IEM that get changed at every gig, a USB power bank and the batteries in various things such as the P2, cable tester, foot pedals etc that get changed every month or so.

[glassmoon]

My P2 is attached to my mic stand (see the picture) and then via a. Mini jack extension lead. So easy to use. So clear. So inexpensive 

[dave_bass5]

13 minutes ago, Woodinblack said:

 

Makes sense, but I have rechargables in all these things and I just routinely rotate through them, there are the wireless microphone, guitar sender and IEM that get changed at every gig, a USB power bank and the batteries in various things such as the P2, cable tester, foot pedals etc that get changed every month or so.

Yeah, i use rechargeable’s all the time, and the Eneloops don’t tend to go flat when not used, but as it’s something i don’t really think about it’s something i don’t need to think about. 

[Mottlefeeder]

3 hours ago, EBS_freak said:

You want shielded for an unbalanced instrument cable.

That one was two shielded balanced pair cables with a common figure-8 sheath - presumably someone still makes it.

David

[Phil Starr]

Just back from having impressions taken by Michelle at Snugs HQ. My lord it is hard to find, I thought we were rural. No phone signal either so it's hard to ring in. Michelle evenmtually hd to come out onto the road and flag me down on the way past.

 

Anyway its a very simple procedure, a foam block is pushed into your ears and a two part resin injected which takes 3or 4 minutes to set. I sing a little so was asked to use a bite block, I think all it was doing was keeping my mouth open and still. The resin/gel sets with no heat, no real force is needed, not a suggestion of discomfort thoughout. it was all really a non event. 10 mins later I was saying goodbye. I get the moulds next year as Snugs are closed for Christmas

 

I'm looking forward to trying these, the amount of sound that was blocked once the gloop was injected was impressive, probably years since I've been somewhere tht quiet, it promises well for the in-ears when I get the new moulds. I also discovered that I have particularly narrow ear canals but also rather high, like a letter box on it's side I guess, no wonder I couldn't get round plugs to seal.

 

I let you all know when I get the final moulds back next year.

Edited 21 hours ago by Phil Starr

[MartinB]

I've got both the Behringer P2 and the Aliexpress version now. The Behringer claims

Quote

Integrated current limit protects your ears and headphone

but both units will turn up to unholy volumes with no suggestion of any kind of limiting. I saw a post elsewhere suggesting that this is really more about protecting the amplifier from being damaged by short circuited headphones than protecting the user's hearing.

So a no-score draw there. The battery access, belt clip and mono-stereo are definitely better on the Aliexpress job, though to be fair Behringer "inherited" their design from Fischer so it's not strictly their fault 😆. Weights are very similar. Behringer is slightly smaller in cross-section. The locking input on both applies only to XLR cables - a TRS will pull right out of there.