Playing in Church.

[Richard R]

Definitely a positive result, now the journey begins.

I have asked some of our team to pray for your church. "A church in East London ", based on your profile location. I'll update them.

 

[Nice Guy Rich]

Last night was the first time I've rehearsed since I had the crisis meeting with my Pastor, regarding me almost quitting the Worship Team.

 

We had to rehearse last night as the keyboard player and the drummer couldn't do Friday, the drummer unfortunately is a repeat offender, late for EVERY rehearsal and late for EVERY service, he's been pulled up numerous times and so I was keen to see what he did last night.  Rehearsal is 8-10pm and at 8:50pm the drummer still hadn't turned up, I messaged him and he replied that he had forgotten, he eventually arrived at 9:15pm, which left us only 45 minutes to run through all the songs with drums.  The worst part is that this Sunday is a baptism service, clearly the drummer doesn't give a flying f**k about this and thinks his time is more important than everyone else's.

 

He did try to apologise afterwards but I wasn't in the mood for his excuses, I did ask him if he ever gets bored of saying "sorry I'm late" every time he walks into a room and I made it clear that I wasn't happy.  I wouldn't mind if he had been asked to anything special, all he had to do was turn up on the night that he asked for and, play drums.

 

Nothing ever changes and words are weak, I genuinely think it's time for action....watch this space.

 

[dmc79]

@Nice Guy Rich Sorry to hear that. It’s bad enough if this happens occasionally, but to happen repeatedly shows a total lack of respect for everyone else in the team. If this was a job, he’d have been sacked a long time ago, yet because he’s a volunteer thinks it’s ok to mess people about. As much as I guess you like to have a full band, I’d rather not have a drummer than one who takes the pee like this guy. Time for action surely? 
 

 

[LukeFRC]

1 hour ago, Nice Guy Rich said:

Last night was the first time I've rehearsed since I had the crisis meeting with my Pastor, regarding me almost quitting the Worship Team.

 

We had to rehearse last night as the keyboard player and the drummer couldn't do Friday, the drummer unfortunately is a repeat offender, late for EVERY rehearsal and late for EVERY service, he's been pulled up numerous times and so I was keen to see what he did last night.  Rehearsal is 8-10pm and at 8:50pm the drummer still hadn't turned up, I messaged him and he replied that he had forgotten, he eventually arrived at 9:15pm, which left us only 45 minutes to run through all the songs with drums.  The worst part is that this Sunday is a baptism service, clearly the drummer doesn't give a flying f**k about this and thinks his time is more important than everyone else's.

 

He did try to apologise afterwards but I wasn't in the mood for his excuses, I did ask him if he ever gets bored of saying "sorry I'm late" every time he walks into a room and I made it clear that I wasn't happy.  I wouldn't mind if he had been asked to anything special, all he had to do was turn up on the night that he asked for and, play drums.

 

Nothing ever changes and words are weak, I genuinely think it's time for action....watch this space.

 

Just go without drums. 

And perspective - separate your annoyance of a person being awful at time keeping from the technical desire to have good music and play with musicians.
Also , and generally, how do you communicate? - for important and less group stuff I've found I do what I would at work and email an meeting invites so with times etc - that way it can go directly in their diary on their phone

 

[Nice Guy Rich]

17 minutes ago, LukeFRC said:

how do you communicate?

 

 

Communcation is not the problem;

 

• The Worship Team rota is sent out to everyone, telling them when they are playing, months in advance.
• Last Sunday, I personally messaged every single person playing this week, I sent the songs, the day that we are rehearsing and the time that we are starting.
• A message is sent out on Mondays telling everybody, the list of who's playing the following Sunday and what time and date we are rehearsing.

The problem is people being lazy and self-centred.

 

 

[Rich]

2 hours ago, Nice Guy Rich said:

Last night was the first time I've rehearsed since I had the crisis meeting with my Pastor, regarding me almost quitting the Worship Team.

 

We had to rehearse last night as the keyboard player and the drummer couldn't do Friday, the drummer unfortunately is a repeat offender, late for EVERY rehearsal and late for EVERY service, he's been pulled up numerous times and so I was keen to see what he did last night.  Rehearsal is 8-10pm and at 8:50pm the drummer still hadn't turned up, I messaged him and he replied that he had forgotten, he eventually arrived at 9:15pm, which left us only 45 minutes to run through all the songs with drums.  The worst part is that this Sunday is a baptism service, clearly the drummer doesn't give a flying f**k about this and thinks his time is more important than everyone else's.

 

He did try to apologise afterwards but I wasn't in the mood for his excuses, I did ask him if he ever gets bored of saying "sorry I'm late" every time he walks into a room and I made it clear that I wasn't happy.  I wouldn't mind if he had been asked to anything special, all he had to do was turn up on the night that he asked for and, play drums.

 

Nothing ever changes and words are weak, I genuinely think it's time for action....watch this space.

 

 

Bin him. Enough is enough. It's a baptism, a tremendously important day in those parents' lives, and he couldn't give a sh!t. Get rid, and tell him exactly why.

[Richard R]

Of course now he has turned up to the practice,  he will want to play at the service. Not a lot you can do about that, other than hope the service goes well for the baptism.

 

Next time don't chase him, complete the practice without him and on the Sunday politely say that as he wasn't there all the arrangements have been done without drums. And then take him off the rota, at least for any service you're at.

 

 

[Nice Guy Rich]

I just messaged my Pastor asking that after this Sunday, the Worship Team rota be amended as I refuse to play with the drummer, and his brother, any more.

 

The drummer and his brother are actually both talented musicians (they both play bass, drums and keys) but, they are both always late and they are a liability.  

 

I refuse to watch my dedication and hard work for the Worship Team being eroded and undermined by their constant self-centred disregard to punctuality.

 

Let the fun commence.

[xgsjx]

Edited November 17, 2023 by xgsjx

[oldslapper]

Reminds me of this. My church musician experience has been that often the most naturally gifted are the laziest and believe fanning the flame of their gift involves totally ignoring any semblance of work. 
Doesn't help that they are often lauded by the congregation as gifted or “anointed’ thus reinforcing the negligence. If anyone said that to me I’d always reply “the more I practice and more attentive I am to my responsibilities with my “gift”, the more gifted I seem to be” 😂😂 funny that. 

[Ralf1e]

On 17/10/2023 at 19:56, Richard R said:

Has anyone else come across or used this browser add-in?

https://transpose.video/

 

It does pitch-shifting on YT video in real time. Which could be incredibly useful as our worship leaders never play the song in the same key as the one used in their example link. Not used it in anger yet, but I wish I'd had it last week

Desktop Chrome or Edge only, and seems OK on the privacy front.

Just added it to the browser but not tried it yet. If it works as you say I am going to spend alot of time with this.

Thanks for sharing.

Wanted something like this for years

[bass_dinger]

On 17/11/2023 at 11:46, Richard R said:

 

Next time don't chase him, complete the practice without him and on the Sunday politely say that as he wasn't there all the arrangements have been done without drums. And then take him off the rota, at least for any service you're at.

This, above, is how I would do it. It means that he has removed himself from the group. 

 

On 17/11/2023 at 13:08, Nice Guy Rich said:

I just messaged my Pastor asking that after this Sunday, the Worship Team rota be amended as I refuse to play with the drummer, and his brother, any more

Whereas this makes you the appear to be the problem (of course, you are not, but the leaders might focus on your stated refusal to play with others).

 

Let them not turn up - and then, when you are asked why you have no drummer, you can say that he did not arrive on the day.  Then, your leader can deal with the miscreant stick-swinger himself. 

[Nice Guy Rich]

Just got home from the baptism service, it was lovely and, the drummer actually turned up on time (not that he had any other choice).  I didn’t speak to him, I blanked him.

 

My Pastor still hasn’t replied or even acknowledged my message, I reckon he’ll just ignore it and hope it’ll go away…..not a chance, I don’t make empty threats.

[LukeFRC]

43 minutes ago, Nice Guy Rich said:

Just got home from the baptism service, it was lovely and, the drummer actually turned up on time (not that he had any other choice).  I didn’t speak to him, I blanked him.

 

My Pastor still hasn’t replied or even acknowledged my message, I reckon he’ll just ignore it and hope it’ll go away…..not a chance, I don’t make empty threats.

Threats and blanking people is not a good place to be. Volunteering to play Music isn’t that important.

 

If I were your pastor I would possibly start with the planks before looking at the drummer’s timekeeping specks. 

[Nice Guy Rich]

@LukeFRC It’s not just volunteering to play music, it’s answering a calling to serve the Lord, it’s supplying the music to help people connect with God and it should be an honour.  I take my worship seriously and I refuse to sit back and watch anybody detract from it.

[Dad3353]

59 minutes ago, Nice Guy Rich said:

@LukeFRC It’s not just volunteering to play music, it’s answering a calling to serve the congregation, it’s supplying the music to help people connect with other like-minded folk, and it should be an honour.  I take my worship seriously and I refuse to sit back and watch anybody detract from it.

 

Fixed. 

[Nice Guy Rich]

The Lord spoke to me yesterday and touched my heart.

 

I took back what I said about refusing to play with the brothers but, this doesn’t mean that I’m agreeing to turn a blind eye, if they continue turning up late etc, I will pull them up.

 

I want what’s best for our church and whilst we must forgive others and be more like the Good Shepherd etc, I will not accept tardiness and, we must help guide those that need guidance, not from a position of superiority but because we want to make our church better.

 

I care about the church and I want to help solve problems, not be a problem.

 

I truly believe that being in the worship team and, being a worship leader is my calling and I take it very seriously.  God gave me my talents and to use them to praise him is an honour.

[Grahambythesea]

If the band was asked to play at a Service which was to be attended by someone who was respected by the drummer, he would probably turn up on time. So playing before the King of the Universe in His honour ought to be the highest calling. 
If your drummer is that casual about turning up, it may indicate that he’s not very committed to his faith.

[bass_dinger]

On Sunday, a new keyboard player was added to the rota. All was well, although for one song, she did not change key midway through a song ( the chords were not given  - instead, the band had to work out the new chords in their head on the fly). She played in the original key, while the rest of the band played in the new key.  Nobody noticed (apart from me, and the former worship leader).

 

In other news, the set up has been changed, and each musician now has a behringer P16 mixer, to add to the PC screen with chord charts, and a small monitor. 

 

So, this is the difference between equipping the band (we did not train the keyboard player), and buying equipment for the band (new kit, better kit).

 

Happily, I really did not mind about the wrong notes - I am learning not to mind.

 

[GoodShowSir]

12 hours ago, bass_dinger said:

 

In other news, the set up has been changed, and each musician now has a behringer P16 mixer, to add to the PC screen with chord charts, and a small monitor.

 

 Nice! I don't know what I would do without my personal mixer these days, so spoiled   But nice about the PC screen and chord charts! That would be amazing.

 

 

[Nice Guy Rich]

I had a meeting with my Church Elders on Thursday and I felt that I was being demonised and, the overwhelming message being sent to me was to not rock the boat, to not try to change anything as it is what it is and that nobody’s going to change.

 

I thought things through on Friday and in the evening I decided to step down from the role of Worship Leader.

 

I’ll still be in the worship team, but only playing bass, playing guitar and providing backing vocals.

 

No longer do I have to worry about other people turning up late, not turning up at all, not learning the songs, not reading people’s messages and not replying to messages because it’s not my problem.  I’ll just be a hired hand and care as much as everyone else does.

[bass_dinger]

2 minutes ago, Nice Guy Rich said:

 

 

I thought things through on Friday and in the evening I decided to step down from the role of Worship Leader.

 

....

  I’ll just be a hired hand and care as much as everyone else does.

 

For your own sanity, you have made the right decision. Well done. It will also show the leaders what happens when you are not pulling it together. 

 

As for people not changing, they certainly won't if the leaders enable this sort of bad behaviour.

 

We had the same issue in our church  - the assumption that the quality of the music was down to luck. Sometimes good, other times bland and a struggle. Lockdown saw the need to form a smaller core band, and after a few months of that better playing, the leaders did not want to go back to the old team. They got used to excellence.

 

It can happen, but you may find that you need to join a band or another church, to satisfy your expectation of more commitment. 

[Nice Guy Rich]

@bass_dinger After banging my head against a brick wall and getting nowhere for ages, why is it that as soon as I stepped down, people started messaging me asking what my ideas were to help improve the Worship Team?  My reply was to simply reminded them that it wasn't my problem any more as I'm no longer a Worship Leader.

 

To quote the Vicomte de Valmont....

[Rich]

Typical... So often the way, nobody's interested until you finally say "ah sod ya then", and it's only when you're walking away that they bother asking for your input. If I had a tenner etc. 

[Richard R]

@Nice Guy Rich

If people are asking how things can improve, then maybe your actions have "stirred up some dust."

 

You can reply "not my problem", or maybe "I've been trying to make suggestions for ages and not got anywhere.  If you're serious,  then let's look at this in early February and pray about it in the meantime".

If people are still saying in January that they want to change things, then maybe they will.

 

 

Edited November 27, 2023 by Richard R
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