Playing in Church.

[SimonK]

...tis a mystery... same drummer but only keys plus vocals this week (so not guitar) which certainly gave me more space in the mix. I have a Genzler Magellan preamp pedal that I bought specifically as it has two curve (EQ) presets that you can toggle between, meaning I can sweep them relatively quickly to find what works (perfect for the zero set up time at church). Three weeks ago "Curve A" at 3/4 sounded great, this morning "Curve B" at 3/4 which is a whole different profile seemed to work, along with cutting around 250Hz on my graphic EQ. But no rhyme or reason!

 

CURVE A (Blue): Provides a variable pre-shaped curve that boosts lows and highs while simultaneously cutting mids. The slopes are fairly gentle which keep the tone shaping very musical. This curve covers a wide range of sounds from flat to classic to modern depending on the position of the independent CURVE A control.

 

CURVE B (Amber): Provides a variable pre-shaped curve with attenuated high-mids and highs, a low-mid bump, and a slight roll-off of the lowest bass frequencies. Again, the slopes are fairly gentle which keep the tone shaping very musical. This curve is intended to provide sounds in the range of vintage amps and vintage cabinets that do not have tweeters. An independent CURVE B control is provided for this filter.

[LukeFRC]

8 minutes ago, SimonK said:

...tis a mystery... same drummer but only keys plus vocals this week (so not guitar) which certainly gave me more space in the mix. I have a Genzler Magellan preamp pedal that I bought specifically as it has two curve (EQ) presets that you can toggle between, meaning I can sweep them relatively quickly to find what works (perfect for the zero set up time at church). Three weeks ago "Curve A" at 3/4 sounded great, this morning "Curve B" at 3/4 which is a whole different profile seemed to work, along with cutting around 250Hz on my graphic EQ. But no rhyme or reason!

 

CURVE A (Blue): Provides a variable pre-shaped curve that boosts lows and highs while simultaneously cutting mids. The slopes are fairly gentle which keep the tone shaping very musical. This curve covers a wide range of sounds from flat to classic to modern depending on the position of the independent CURVE A control.

 

CURVE B (Amber): Provides a variable pre-shaped curve with attenuated high-mids and highs, a low-mid bump, and a slight roll-off of the lowest bass frequencies. Again, the slopes are fairly gentle which keep the tone shaping very musical. This curve is intended to provide sounds in the range of vintage amps and vintage cabinets that do not have tweeters. An independent CURVE B control is provided for this filter.

You took a guitar out the mix- with it the scooped sound gave the guitar space about where a typical dreadnaught resonates , without it you wanted low mids and put the high mids and highs to help the keys ? 

[LukeFRC]

I mean that would be my guess! If I were running sound I would eq the keys differently depending on if they were the lead instrument or if there was a  guitar too

[SimonK]

26 minutes ago, LukeFRC said:

I mean that would be my guess! If I were running sound I would eq the keys differently depending on if they were the lead instrument or if there was a  guitar too

 

Yes not a bad thought - so the bass needs to be a bit more scooped with an acoustic guitar in the mix whereas a low-mid boost works better when it doesn't clash with the guitar - but quite a big change achieved entirely due to EQ which makes me wonder why we spend so much on different amps etc. when the EQ makes the biggest difference - although I suppose that's why everyone has started raving about IEM and ampless setups.

[Owen]

Perception is such a weird thing. Work has just invested in a new studio. I plugged the new Sandberg P into the new Neve 1073 into the new ATC SCM45As. The sound I had been searching for for years was there and the search was over. 2 weeks later I spent 2 hours tracking 3 different basses through 5 different premaps (and learning the studio routing). Was the Sanberg/Neve/ATC combo still THE ONE? Nope, just another flavour of nice. Everything always changes. 

Edited November 18 by Owen
because of the spelling, always because of the spelling. Proof reading is SO tedious. But I never learn.

[LukeFRC]

12 hours ago, SimonK said:

 

Yes not a bad thought - so the bass needs to be a bit more scooped with an acoustic guitar in the mix whereas a low-mid boost works better when it doesn't clash with the guitar - but quite a big change achieved entirely due to EQ which makes me wonder why we spend so much on different amps etc. when the EQ makes the biggest difference - although I suppose that's why everyone has started raving about IEM and ampless setups.

IEM and ampless setups is all about reducing stage noise and letting the FOH do the work without needing to fight against a backline/foldback reflections. 

Why do we spend so much on different amp? well with a IEM setup you end up doing the same with preamp/di! What EQ, what compression, how it sounds .... 

[Rosie C]

I usually play bass guitar at church (of course), but on a whim this morning I took my guitar-bodied-mandolin instead. I arrived at church to find the band leader was absent due to the floods and I was the only musician with an instrument. 4th Sunday is an informal service anyway and we sit in a circle, so a guitar worked OK. We cut the hymns down to two. O Worship the King started off badly - I think people are used to the piano playing the melody, but also I've not done this before and was 'leading' rather than 'accompanying'. It settled down by verse 3, and the final hymn, Majesty, Worship his Majesty went quite well. 

[Owen]

We started one song in D but the leader sang the first verse in G. By the time I had worked out what his vocal key was, he was moving back towards D.  It was intense!

[Bobo_08]

15 minutes ago, Owen said:

We started one song in D but the leader sang the first verse in G. By the time I had worked out what his vocal key was, he was moving back towards D.  It was intense!

 

Woah... I get stressed when the keys come through Saturday night and sometimes Sunday morning, but key changes on the fly 🙈

 

If I was a better playing it wouldn't bother me so much I guess.. but right now it does give me anxiety. Lol

Edited November 24 by Bobo_08

[Owen]

The whole congregation got anxiety. But not as much as the bloke playing in one key and singing in another. On a musical level it was quite impressive, but in the moment, not quite so impressive.

[LukeFRC]

28 minutes ago, Owen said:

The whole congregation got anxiety. But not as much as the bloke playing in one key and singing in another. On a musical level it was quite impressive, but in the moment, not quite so impressive.

You know the round bit on the end of a fender headstock - was designed to safely poke folk doing similar without the risk of serious injury. Sometime in the early 80s one regular singer had the bruises but not the musical ability to get into the right key, Leo had had enough and the point of a G&L headstock was invented 

[bass_dinger]

34 minutes ago, Owen said:

The whole congregation got anxiety. But not as much as the bloke playing in one key and singing in another. On a musical level it was quite impressive, but in the moment, not quite so impressive.

What a talent! Akin to patting one's head with a mallet, and rubbing one's tummy with sandpaper - difficult to do, and painful to watch.

[SimonK]

4 hours ago, Owen said:

We started one song in D but the leader sang the first verse in G. By the time I had worked out what his vocal key was, he was moving back towards D.  It was intense!

 

But did you train wreck? There's nothing like that moment when everything grinds to a halt and everyone looks at each other...

[Owen]

I was sitting there waiting to train wreck. But he drove on through. 

[Nice Guy Rich]

Got to love car crash worship 😂, one Sunday in my old church, one of the Worship Leaders decided to start playing and singing completely the wrong song and she had the nerve to look at the rest of us like we were sh*t on her shoe .  I don’t miss her one bit (she was the main reason I left that church).

[SimonK]

55 minutes ago, Nice Guy Rich said:

Got to love car crash worship 😂, one Sunday in my old church, one of the Worship Leaders decided to start playing and singing completely the wrong song and she had the nerve to look at the rest of us like we were sh*t on her shoe .  I don’t miss her one bit (she was the main reason I left that church).

 

Sounds like time for a car/train crash competition - anyone remember Phatfish's "There is a day"? We did this during the signing of the register at someone's wedding. Bloody keyboardist pressed the transpose button and both he and the singer started in the wrong key. I was playing electric so when I came in with the first chord it was the wrong key and the song crashed. Keyboardist smirks, presses the transpose, and starts again saying a bit too loudly - lets change key for Simon grrr.....

[Nice Guy Rich]

I can enjoy the car crash / train wrecks now.  I was one of the Worship Leaders in my last church but, now that I've joined a new church, I'm only down as a bass player, guitarist and singer.

 

I can honestly say that I don't miss being a Worship Leader one bit 😁.

[Richard R]

One of our worship leaders is known for starting the song with the capo in the wrong place, maybe three times a year or so, which always gets a laugh from the band and the congregation.
Apart from that he's a superb singer, great guitarist, very good drummer, writes songs AND is thoroughly decent bloke.

 

[SimonK]

15 hours ago, Richard R said:

One of our worship leaders is known for starting the song with the capo in the wrong place, maybe three times a year or so, which always gets a laugh from the band and the congregation.
Apart from that he's a superb singer, great guitarist, very good drummer, writes songs AND is thoroughly decent bloke.

 

 

I generally note which fret the worship leader puts their capo on and hiss it at them prior to the start of the song...

[LeftyP]

I don't normally receive or expect compliments for playing in the church band but this morning I received one!  A very attractive young lady, who has been coming to our church over the last few weeks, came and told me how much she enjoyed my bass playing.  I thanked her but said that no-one really notices the bass but she was insistent that I had done a good job.  She was in the early to mid 20s and was working at a local veterinary practise.  This 74 year old grandad now feels very encouraged! 

[GoodShowSir]

Were you rocking a slap bass solo at some point during the service?😁

 

aww that’s very nice. I seem to only get complements when I play the kids songs, only time I feel it’s ok to have a little bit of fun! 

edit - sorry to add, I have only ever got that one compliment 🤣 not every time. 

Edited December 1 by GoodShowSir

[Richard R]

 I wasn't playing today but we had two fabulous services. Sometimes the congregation just want to SING and it's all the band can do to hold on for the ride! 

 

[SuperSeagull]

Quick non-bass related question - what presentation software are your churches using? ProPresenter, Song Pro - anything else? Particularly interested in how they work with a non technically minded operator please.

[pn_day]

We recently moved to the WorshipTools suite - Presenter, Planning & Charts. Much simpler to use and seems more stable than ProPresenter, and doesn't require our volunteers to read a manual if something goes wrong...

https://www.worshiptools.com/en-us

 

 

[Nice Guy Rich]

For my church’s Contemporary Carol service in a couple of weeks, we have been asked to wear black, gold and red, I found this on Amazon….I’m tempted 😂 .

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