Fender Precision tone control

[peteb]

I have noticed over past few months that when I fully open the tone control on my 57RI Precision, it sounds, well a bit scratchy and harsh. It's become especially apparent since I've been playing it through headphones a lot recently (I haven't been taking it out for gigs for a couple of years). 

Does anyone have any suggestions how I do something about this; be it maintenance or changing the pot or wiring or whatever?? 

[naxos10]

A bit of pot cleaning may not go amiss initially.

[hooky_lowdown]

Check the thread a few down from yours called "Scratchy pots", lots of advice and suggestions there.

[peteb]

Perhaps I haven't explained this well. The pot itself isn't scratchy when you turn it, it just sounds unduly harsh when wide open. 

However, I will give it a good clean with switch cleaner to see if that helps... 

[Cosmo Valdemar]

29 minutes ago, peteb said:

Perhaps I haven't explained this well. The pot itself isn't scratchy when you turn it, it just sounds unduly harsh when wide open. 

However, I will give it a good clean with switch cleaner to see if that helps... 

It's probably not the bass that's the issue. I've never been fond of playing bass through headphones as they do tend to emphasise the more unpleasant upper frequencies. Does it happen with other basses? Tell us more about your setup.

[peteb]

40 minutes ago, Cosmo Valdemar said:

It's probably not the bass that's the issue. I've never been fond of playing bass through headphones as they do tend to emphasise the more unpleasant upper frequencies. Does it happen with other basses? Tell us more about your setup.

It doesn't seem to be so apparent with other basses, certainly not with active ones. 

My home set up is a Phil Jones Double 4 and a reasonably decent pair of AKG headphones. It sounds fine with my active jazz and seems okay with my passive American std jazz. No one adversely commented on the P bass live, so perhaps I am getting overly picky when hearing it through the phones. 

I have looked at the Stellartone replacement tone pot, but wondered if there are any alternatives if I decide to do something to the bass?? 

Edited February 14, 2020 by peteb

[DarkHeart]

You haven`t recently changed strings have you?

[peteb]

2 minutes ago, DarkHeart said:

You haven`t recently changed strings have you?

I'm afraid the Precision is still wearing the same set of DRs that I put on it when I last gigged it two years ago. I do have a new set of strings ready to put on to see if that helps. 

[ead]

This is surely heresy; a P bass with the tone fully open

[hooky_lowdown]

3 hours ago, peteb said:

I'm afraid the Precision is still wearing the same set of DRs that I put on it when I last gigged it two years ago. I do have a new set of strings ready to put on to see if that helps. 

It could be the strings, if you lift and let the string snap against the fret board several times, do this for each string and it'll balance out the tone of each string.

Alternatively, if you decide to change strings DM me, as I'll take your old DRs off your hands. 😁

[Chiliwailer]

For me, the 57RI is usually a P that has more top end naturally, more so as opposed to a rosewood 62RI. Plus the Phil Jones is quite hifi so I suppose it shows it up more. 
 

I’d put some LaBella flats on, check it’s got a decent capacitor & pot and slightly back off the tone pot if need be.
 

Perhaps also check the pickup isn’t too high and the neck too straight? 

Edited February 16, 2020 by Chiliwailer

[gjones]

Alternatively, buy a new wiring loom from KiOgon here on Basschat.

It's solderless and will take you 10 mins to fit to your bass.   Here is his feedback   

 

[artisan]

+1 for a KiOgon loom.

Totally transformed my Vintera P bass & I'm sure it will he a big improvement on your P bass too.

[peteb]

I'm intrigued by the KiOgon loom.

Can anybody tell me exactly what difference it makes and how mush it costs, what are the advantages compared to a Stellartone pot, etc?? 

[Reggaebass]

Some info here if it’s any help 🙂

[Reggaebass]

I fitted one yesterday to one of my Ps , it really is a nice bit of kit and easy to fit .

[peteb]

2 minutes ago, Reggaebass said:

I fitted one yesterday to one of my Ps , it really is a nice bit of kit and easy to fit .

What difference does it actually make?

 

[Reggaebass]

Just now, peteb said:

What difference does it actually make?

 

My p was my go to bass for years so the pots were pretty worn and the jack was a bit hit and miss occasionally, after I fitted the new loom it sounds like a new bass, I also asked for a different cap to roll off the highs a bit, the sound is perfect.

[artisan]

22 hours ago, peteb said:

What difference does it actually make?

 

My Vintera P  sounded quite harsh,especially with the tone wide open as you describe your bass to be.

The new loom got rid of the harshness & gave my bass a much warmer,classier sound with added punch ,I am very impressed with it.

So easy to fit too & i am hopeless with electrickery 

Edited February 17, 2020 by artisan

[Sparky Mark]

I find that when playing my Precisions with the tone turned down for a few minutes before gradually increasing it to the sound I prefer I never get it to wide open.  I guess the electronics in yours is allowing a lot of top end through. This could be good depending on the rest of your signal chain; brightening up a dull sounding amp for instance. Why not just turn the tone control down until you get rid of the harshness? 

[frankzelf]

Try a different capacitor?

[nilebodgers]

..and don't pay snake oil prices for them e.g. https://cpc.farnell.com/vishay/2222-368-45473/capacitor-0-047uf-250v-5pk/dp/CA05369?st=vishay poly capacitor

[Guest]

On 16/02/2020 at 20:31, peteb said:

What difference does it actually make?

 

None.
The KiOgon wiring is exactly the same spec as the current standard wiring, with 250k audio taper pots and a 0.047uf (47nf) capacitor, so absolutely zero difference in reality. He also uses Bourns mini split shaft pots, which are of a decent quality, but aren't as good as the full sized solid shaft CTS pots that are in your bass as standard. Sorry to upset anyones beliefs, but that's the reality.
To address your issue directly,
P basses can sound a little harsh when the tone is wide open depending on the techniques you use to play, and more so when played out of a band setting as you seem to have found out. backing the tone off is the solution, but you do have capacitor options to roll the treble off at different frequency points! I believe the 57RI P bass uses a 0.1uf (100nf) capacitor, which rolls off treble and alot of mids too, giving a very dark sound when turned down. if you use a 0.047uf (47nf) cap, which is standard on most these days, you'll roll off the treble and some high mids, which is still quite dark sounding, but less so than your current cap! alternatively, a 0.022uf (22nf) cap will roll treble off leaving the high mids intact, which sounds brighter but removes the harsh high end, (used on many 70's Fender basses) which sounds like what you're after maybe!? some think it's honky sounding.
or you could go inbetween with a 0.033uf (33nf) cap! it's personal preference at the end of the day.
As for the stellar tone styler, total rip off if you ask me. I'd just buy the required cap that suits your needs, it costs peanuts and doesn't alter your bass! takes 2 mins to solder in, job done. And don't believe buying an expensive paper in oil cap to be better in sound or quality, its total oss tish.

[Chris Thompson]

On 14/02/2020 at 17:39, ead said:

This is surely heresy; a P bass with the tone fully open

Jameson famously let the 'funk', build up on his strings and fretboard. He's known to have set the tone control wide open but the 'funk' and old LaBella flats that he used and never changed, and the tube amps, undoubtedly contributed to his sound.