Stingray5 Posted February 20, 2020 Share Posted February 20, 2020 22 minutes ago, peteb said: I always quite liked Steely Dan. Not a massive fan, so I wouldn’t know the albums – more a greatest hits kinda guy! I have been following this thread with some bemusement – the British disease written large on Basschat. While I appreciate not everybody will like SD, I am surprised at how many ‘musicians’ so actively dislike them. It’s not just them though, consider the following common opinions on BC about a few big artists from this (and many other threads): Steely Dan – jazz harmonies and flavours combined with funk beats and a rock feel, combined in well crafted, accessible songs with razor sharp lyrics and stellar musicianship. BASSCHAT – ‘what do people see in the them, beige, how can anyone like this stuff?’ Jaco – a genuine virtuoso who revolutionised bass playing and transcended his chosen instrument in a similar way to a select few others (Hendrix, Coltraine, etc). Widely regarded by the general music community as one of the best and most influential musicians of his era. BASSCHAT – ‘he’s overrated / crap and if you disagree, you’re a deluded fanboy’… Foo Fighters – in an age of overly manufactured pop and contrived rock (and for that matter rap) acts, probably the last of the great classic rock bands. Massively popular with passion, a bit of charisma, decent playing and a set of incredibly accessible hit songs that reference grunge, Led Zeppelin, punk rock, heavy stuff and Tom Petty all in a recognisable style of their own. BASSCHAT – ‘there is nothing about them that appeals at all’. I should say that I only have a SD greatest hits album, the first Jaco solo album and the missus has the FF greatest hits in the house, none of which get played regularly. So given that I’m not exactly the biggest fan and I appreciate that everyone has their own taste, but jeez why are so many people on here so down on what is pretty solid music?? Totally! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Len_derby Posted February 20, 2020 Share Posted February 20, 2020 Steady on @peteb, people will be doubting your Britishness.....😂 Although, Australians I've met through work seem even worse. They call it the Tall Poppy Syndrome. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ezbass Posted February 20, 2020 Share Posted February 20, 2020 I'm not sure it's a British or Basschat thing, I think it's a first world thing, or even, perhaps, a human thing. I like SD, always have, if you don't, that's OK, there's plenty of other stuff for you to like and I promise I won't berate you for having different tastes, or say your tastes are flawed - it's art. I'm no fan of The Beatles or The Rolling Stones, never have been. However, I often get folks telling me I'm wrong, merely because of the size of the artist's celebrity and their impact. Get a grip, I don't like them particularly, it's fine, no one died because of my opinion and I'm OK with being in the minority for my age group. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul S Posted February 20, 2020 Share Posted February 20, 2020 2 hours ago, Len_derby said: Steady on @peteb, people will be doubting your Britishness.....😂 Although, Australians I've met through work seem even worse. They call it the Tall Poppy Syndrome. Tall Poppy Syndrome - not heard that before. Gotta love Australian 'cut to the quick' attitude. As an aside, there is a species of Eucalyptus tree, called Gum trees in Australia, that has bark that looks like a small child had got a crayon and scribbled all over it. They call it the Scribbly Gum. What a great name! No way would a pompous European or American botanist ever do such a thing. 😂 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bigguy2017 Posted February 20, 2020 Share Posted February 20, 2020 On 18/02/2020 at 18:43, AndyTravis said: Aha, well yes...I’m led to believe Aja speaks highly of all those naysayers... I got the news that this thread is Home at last... Home at Last - great groove... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AndyTravis Posted February 20, 2020 Share Posted February 20, 2020 I’m trying to get into John Martyn on someone’s recommendations. it’s not for me. See, everyone raves about different things. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ezbass Posted February 20, 2020 Share Posted February 20, 2020 28 minutes ago, AndyTravis said: I’m trying to get into John Martyn on someone’s recommendations. it’s not for me. See, everyone raves about different things. Likewise. I wanted to enjoy his work so I could listen to some Danny Thompson, but beyond a few tracks, it isn’t really for me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AndyTravis Posted February 20, 2020 Share Posted February 20, 2020 1 minute ago, ezbass said: Likewise. I wanted to enjoy his work so I could listen to some Danny Thompson, but beyond a few tracks, it isn’t really for me. I said to my friend that if I’d been under the same amount of influence as the artist...I might get it more. In fairness, I let Solid Air run and then Spotify did that thing of suggesting other artists in a playlist - lots of Joni Mitchell and Nick Drake...listened to some, skipped some. Then the Unthanks came on with Brighouse and Rastrick Colliery Band - that was enjoyable. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rich Posted February 20, 2020 Share Posted February 20, 2020 13 hours ago, peteb said: BASSCHAT – ‘there is nothing about them that appeals at all’. Personal opinion of this type is fine as I see it (see It's A Good Job We All Like Different Stuff for details ). It's when it is presented along the lines of "I don't like {insert name of artist}, therefore he/she/they are CRAP and that is a FACT" that the problem starts. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ezbass Posted February 20, 2020 Share Posted February 20, 2020 10 minutes ago, AndyTravis said: I said to my friend that if I’d been under the same amount of influence as the artist...I might get it more. When it comes to folk type music, I’m a Richard Thompson fan (have been for years - Rumour & Sigh, fabulous album, IMO of course 😂). Great song writing and a really different approach to guitar soloing when playing the electric beast. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AndyTravis Posted February 20, 2020 Share Posted February 20, 2020 2 minutes ago, ezbass said: When it comes to folk type music, I’m a Richard Thompson fan (have been for years - Rumour & Sigh, fabulous album, IMO of course 😂). Great song writing and a really different approach to guitar soloing when playing the electric beast. Yeah Richard Thompson has been on my radar for a while - love his playing, and great presence on stage. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
peteb Posted February 20, 2020 Share Posted February 20, 2020 19 minutes ago, Rich said: Personal opinion of this type is fine as I see it (see It's A Good Job We All Like Different Stuff for details ). It's when it is presented along the lines of "I don't like {insert name of artist}, therefore he/she/they are CRAP and that is a FACT" that the problem starts. The trouble is that is exactly how it is presented in many cases 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leonard Smalls Posted February 20, 2020 Share Posted February 20, 2020 For me, the best thing about Steely Dan is the name Otherwise, I find they veer wildly through all sorts of musical genres, from Elevator through to Dinner Jazz then all the way into Full On Cheese. Just to annoy they'll follow all that with a minute of sublime groove, then it's back to ElevatorDinnerCheese topped off with that annoying voice. So while they play very well indeed, and what they play is perfectly executed, I just wish they'd played something with a little more edge (not The Edge, obvs), perhaps with cojones of at least quadruple the size they normally display! 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ricky 4000 Posted February 20, 2020 Share Posted February 20, 2020 58 minutes ago, peteb said: The trouble is that is exactly how it is presented in many cases Is that really a problem to you? 😬 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JellyKnees Posted February 20, 2020 Share Posted February 20, 2020 (edited) I've never been to a dinner party in my life (although I have occasionally shared the odd bag of chips with a close friend) and I think it's a fabulous album. I love the counterpoint between ultra sardonic wit and exceptionally high quality cheese. The whole thing is like some kind of highfalutin' (now there's a Steely Dan word!) self referential joke. Kind of like what the exceptionally clever Stuart Lee does with his comedy. If you don't 'get it', then you have only my pity and ultimately, my scorn. Edited February 21, 2020 by JellyKnees Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rich Posted February 20, 2020 Share Posted February 20, 2020 28 minutes ago, Ricky 4000 said: Is that really a problem to you? 😬 I can't speak for peteb but it bloody is for me. It gets under my skin when people suggest that those who happen to like a certain band are obviously some sort of know-nothing philistines. When they present their opinion as indisputable fact, this is how it is because I say so and that's that. Some people seem to have no grasp whatsoever of the phrase "in my opinion". 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
peteb Posted February 20, 2020 Share Posted February 20, 2020 9 minutes ago, Rich said: I can't speak for peteb but it bloody is for me. It gets under my skin when people suggest that those who happen to like a certain band are obviously some sort of know-nothing philistines. When they present their opinion as indisputable fact, this is how it is because I say so and that's that. Some people seem to have no grasp whatsoever of the phrase "in my opinion". To be fair, its a pretty low grade problem in the scheme of things, but yes, I totally agree Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KevB Posted February 20, 2020 Share Posted February 20, 2020 It's Ok folks, Ive realised the problem. He's been listening to this version 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ricky 4000 Posted February 20, 2020 Share Posted February 20, 2020 31 minutes ago, Rich said: I can't speak for peteb but it bloody is for me. It gets under my skin when people suggest that those who happen to like a certain band are obviously some sort of know-nothing philistines. When they present their opinion as indisputable fact, this is how it is because I say so and that's that. Some people seem to have no grasp whatsoever of the phrase "in my opinion". Oh, that's ignorant! Is it @Teebs that you're talking about, Rich? If so, then I absolutely agree with you. 😗 20 minutes ago, peteb said: To be fair, its a pretty low grade problem in the scheme of things, but yes, I totally agree Aye, I suppose there's a lot to be said for 'live and let live'. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Teebs Posted February 20, 2020 Share Posted February 20, 2020 3 minutes ago, Ricky 4000 said: Is it @Teebs that you're talking about, Rich? If so, then I absolutely agree with you. You dreadful suck-up you! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leonard Smalls Posted February 20, 2020 Share Posted February 20, 2020 2 hours ago, JellyKnees said: Kind of like what the exceptionally clever Stuart Lee does with his comedy. If you don't 'get it', then you have only my pity and ultimately, my scorn. Now I love Stewart (!) Lee, and would strongly dispute that what he does with comedy is anything like what old Soapy Dan did with muzak! Mr. Lee is edgy, pushed boundaries and is very clever. SD are most certainly not edgy, they didn't push any boundaries at all, and while they were obviously quite clever I feel they weren't quite as clever as they thought they were After all, they're not exactly Ornette Coleman. Or Miles Davis, or Coltrane, or anyone else who moved music on in leaps and bounds. They created their own sound, to be fair, and they're pretty instantly recognisable (though that's largely down to Fagin's {nails-on-a-blackboard} voice), but it was only ever just nice. And you'd never say Stewart Lee was nice. Michael Mcintyre, maybe! Still, each to their own; it's not like they're Little Mix at least!!! 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JellyKnees Posted February 20, 2020 Share Posted February 20, 2020 11 minutes ago, Leonard Smalls said: Now I love Stewart (!) Lee, and would strongly dispute that what he does with comedy is anything like what old Soapy Dan did with muzak! Mr. Lee is edgy, pushed boundaries and is very clever. SD are most certainly not edgy, they didn't push any boundaries at all, and while they were obviously quite clever I feel they weren't quite as clever as they thought they were After all, they're not exactly Ornette Coleman. Or Miles Davis, or Coltrane, or anyone else who moved music on in leaps and bounds. They created their own sound, to be fair, and they're pretty instantly recognisable (though that's largely down to Fagin's {nails-on-a-blackboard} voice), but it was only ever just nice. And you'd never say Stewart Lee was nice. Michael Mcintyre, maybe! Still, each to their own; it's not like they're Little Mix at least!!! Nice? Have you listened to some of the lyrics? Sheesh... 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leonard Smalls Posted February 20, 2020 Share Posted February 20, 2020 2 minutes ago, JellyKnees said: Sheesh I never listen to lyrics! Or at least rarely... I'm a bass player who plays too many notes, I haven't got time for singists as well, especially ones who sound quite so annoying as Herr Fagin! Like I said, the best thing about them for me is their name... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ricky 4000 Posted February 20, 2020 Share Posted February 20, 2020 What's wrong with Little Mix now, for Gawd's sake?? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
songofthewind Posted February 20, 2020 Share Posted February 20, 2020 Try reading Elegant Hipsters, Fagen’s autobiography. He is painfully honest about his character and his world view, and his defence, which was to adopt a cynical and ironic distancing style. I feel the songs capture and express this very well. To my mind, he found a match in Walter Becker, and between them they confected the Dan sound from their deep affection for American music, which arises from colossally dysfunctional American culture. For me there is a very powerful effect created by this queasy juxtaposition of The Great American Songbook and existential dread. He articulates all of this better than I can in his book, which is well worth a read. 5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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