Barefaced Big Baby 800W RMS: How?!

[Muzz]

Any other manufacturers do it?

[dave_bass5]

21 minutes ago, Muzz said:

Any other manufacturers do it?

I would have thought, but I’m no expert, that anyone selling on line has to, other than custom made gear. 

Edited March 1, 2020 by dave_bass5

[pete.young]

14 hours ago, dave_bass5 said:

And that’s why we can buy on line and return the item  to most online shops. BF have to work within the distance selling regulations, they just make a ‘feature’ of it. 

Distance Selling Regulations were withdrawn in June 2014, to be replaced by the Consumer Contracts regulations. These give you  from the time you place the order unitl 14 days after your order is delivered to cancel the order. It seems to me that, providing Barefaced are efficient at turning around the order, under their one trial offer you are likely to have the cabs to try for a longer period than the statutory minimum, so it's not surprising to see them making a feature of it. In Barefaced's case, the offer also applies to cabs purchased direct from the factory, which you don't get from anything bought in a shop.

I don't know of any other vendors or shops who exceed the statutory requirements in this way. Happy to be corrected.

Disclaimer: I don't own and have never owned any Barefaced equipment, and can't be under any circumstances be described as a fanboy.

[dave_bass5]

Fair enough, as i said, i could be wrong. I do know a few shops offer 30 day money back guarantee (Thomanns/G4M/Andertons/GAK spring to mind) so i buy from those places.

i wasn't really knocking BF, just pointing out that trying in a band environment for 30 days is also possible from other companies, albeit if not ordered direct. Not sure how many of us order direct from the manufactures these days unless its high end, more bespoke gear.

[dave_bass5]

Im a bit confused over what this means

'If you have not been in touch before ordering, we will ask you a few questions to make sure it's the right cab for you. If you choose to buy a cab which we state is not the best fit for you, then the trial period is no longer applicable and cabs cannot be returned (unless faulty).'

'Should you find your purchase unsatisfactory in any way you have the right to return your cab within the first month, undamaged, for a full refund of both your purchase price and the outbound postage and packing charge. Please retain all the original packaging and do your best when repacking to ensure the cab will survive the return journey - if the cab is damaged due to inadequate protection you will be liable'

I get the first bit, although its a bit restringing IMO, but doesn't the second cancel it out? Does the first mean that it doesn't matter (within reason) what the condition of the cab is in?

 

Edited March 1, 2020 by dave_bass5

[Cuzzie]

Nope

What Alex does is talk to you about needs, sound, set up etc.

If he says you need a Big Twin and you say, your wrong the One10 will fill my local pub on its own and it doesn’t, the trial does not count.

If he recommends the big twin and that doesn’t do that job, it’s in the return/trial period thing 

[dave_bass5]

9 minutes ago, Cuzzie said:

Nope

What Alex does is talk to you about needs, sound, set up etc.

If he says you need a Big Twin and you say, your wrong the One10 will fill my local pub on its own and it doesn’t, the trial does not count.

If he recommends the big twin and that doesn’t do that job, it’s in the return/trial period thing 

Ah, so the first is the stipulation and the second is the process if you dont like it, based on the first. I was reading them as separate things. 

Edited March 1, 2020 by dave_bass5

[itu]

I asked this text a page or two ago, but I decided to write it down myself. The language may not be correct, but try to understand the meaning, please.

 

To produce loud sound, the player needs the instrument and cables, as well as
1) a pre amplifier,
2) a power amplifier and
3) a speaker cabinet with elements (here: cabinet).
 
The amount of sound that comes out from the package depends on
1) the ability of the preamp to drive the power amp;
2) The ability of the power amp to drive the cabinet; and
3) the cabinet's ability to convert electricity into sound.
 
The played signal is converted in the preamp (eq, levels, etc.) to a suitable / desired signal for the power amp. An important thing in the power amp is the ability to apply power to different loads (the cabinet impedance among few other parameters). Many people look after a low-impedance cabinet (4 or even 2 ohms) to gain more of those famous watts. But very little load (read: impedance) is usually difficult for the amplifier and the amplifier may not be capable of pushing those desired watts to the amp. Usually a hard load equals more amperes which means more heat.
 
If the "fit" between the amplifier and the cabinet is good, the next thing that affects the loudness is the cabinet efficiency or sensitivity. A reading of 101 dB / 1 W / 1 m on the side of the cabinet means, that the cabinet is capable of producing 101 decibels to the distance of one meter from 1 W coming from the power amp. Thus, 2 W gives 104 dB, and 4 W produces 107 dB, etc.

If the sensitivity is low, say 89 dB / 1 W / 1 m, then only 89 dB will be heard with 1 W. The difference between these two cabinets is 12 dB with the same watt!
 
The 12 dB difference gives perspective when looking at the power requirements of the two cabinets outputting the same loudness.
- version 101 dB / 1 W / 1 m will produce 101 dB.
- the same amplifier pushes the latter cabinet:
 
89 dB / 1 W
92 dB / 2 W
95 dB / 4 W
98 dB / 8 W
101 dB / 16 W
 
that is, a modest 16x power. If the power amp pushes its full 500 W, the less sensitive box will produce 116 dB. A more sensitive cabinet gives 12 dB more, or 128 dB. That's the difference you will certainly hear even further away!
 
Watt is a good thing for a bass player, but it doesn't tell you much about the loudness. Sensitivity and the "fit" of the amplifier and the cabinet are very important. Because of their comparable importance, manufacturers prefer to blur things down to poor watts. You probably noticed that nobody was interested in impedance, while calculating loudness in the previous chapter... the matching was presumed as perfect.

And let's be careful out there: watts or sensitivity tell us nothing about the sound quality.

Edited March 4, 2020 by itu
funny sentences

[itu]

Earlier I wrote something like 31.5 Hz / 1 kW. Probably someone noticed that the numbers are only faintly related to loudness, so yes, it was a bad joke.

[Dan Dare]

On 29/02/2020 at 14:03, Bill Fitzmaurice said:

A bigger box doesn't add to the power capacity. If anything it lowers it, as excursion is more in a larger box, not less. What a larger box does give is higher sensitivity and/or lower extension, which lessens the power required for a given output in the low end. It's the classic case of Hoffman's Iron Law at work. If you're a bass player and you don't know what that is,  you should. You deal with it every time you plug in.

This is exactly what I've found. Since becoming a PJB user, I've acquired a couple of 4B and a couple of C4 cabs. Same drivers - 4 (ceramic, not Neo) 5" units - in each, but the 4Bs, which are quite a bit larger, definitely have more warmth/low end and produce more sound at a given volume setting. I prefer them at low to medium levels, but you can't push them as hard as the C4s.

[itu]

volume - lowest reproducible freq - sensitivity

You change one, and one or two others will change, too. Like with photography: ISO - aperture - time.