cameltoe Posted February 22, 2009 Posted February 22, 2009 Hi, I bought a MIM P bass a few months ago and am very happy with it. It's the first fender bass i've owned, and even though I wasn't keen on a P bass for some reason or another, it just felt 'right' when i held it and played it. Anyway, as good as it is in rehersal (where i play about half my gigging volume) it loses a bit of it's punch at gigs. At rehersal, it thumps and punches along and really cuts through tonally as well, and once I lock in with the drummer it really drives the whole band. At gigs though, it doesn't quite have the same effect. It's not a volume issue, there's more than enough of that, it just seems to lose that bass 'punch', the almost rhythmic pound that drives along. And if I throw in a quick fill here and there, say on the G string for instance, it's even worse- the whole bass just drops away. You can hear the notes easily, it's not a volume issue, (I spent ages setting the pick up height and the strings seem to be of equal volume, and it's never been a problem at rehersal) it's just the rhythmic punch just drops away as soon as I hit the G string. I don't want to sacrifice the drive of the band for the sake of a quick bass riff, but it would be nice to have both. I want the bass to have that punch even at gig volume, and to keep that punch whenever I venture forward with a fill! The bass is bog-standard at the moment, although I have ordered a new wiring harness (how much difference it will have I don't know) but what I'm thinking, obviously, is pick up and bridge options. The gotoh 201 bridge seems a good bet for the bridge option. Having the top-loading strings is obviously costing me a bit of thump at higher volumes, and a higher mass bridge should help me out a bit. Pick ups is where i'm confused. I had thought about Quarter Pounders, but to be honest I never really got a clear description of what they would do to my sound, just vague descriptions like 'it'll make your P bass sound like a musicman' , but having heard they were a good all-rounder, and an improved version of the MIM pick up, i was leaning that way. Wizard pickups seem to have a lot of love on this forum though, and obviously the one that caught my eye was the 'Thumper'! As well as having that percussive thump, I also like clarity in the bottom end, being able to hear the notes I'm playing as much as I feel them. At rehersal my standard P bass pick up is [i]almost[/i] there, it loses it a touch on the G string, but nearly there. At gigs it's nowhere near enough. I like the tone of it though. You can always hear what I'm playing, as it cuts through the mix well, unlike some 'wooly' basses i have played in the past. Can anyone throw some suggestions my way? Quote
The Burpster Posted February 22, 2009 Posted February 22, 2009 Repairs and tech will throw loads of stuff your way I'm sure.... Go see....! Quote
Guest MoJo Posted February 22, 2009 Posted February 22, 2009 Despite what some folks would have you think, there really isn't that much difference between a standard pick-up and a Thumper. Almost a case of 'Emporers new clothes'. I had one from Andy and it's a great pick-up, plenty of output, a little harsh for my liking (same with the SD Quarter Pound pick-up). My main P-bass has an Artec P-bass pick up in it. Cost me less than £15. If you'd have heard it last night, I think you'd be reaching for your wallet. Classic P-bass growl and you could hear every note I played. Some of that is down to the dual band compressor on my Trace which really gives out a thump. Quote
cameltoe Posted February 22, 2009 Author Posted February 22, 2009 sorry if i posted this in the wrong section mods i'm new here. So there's not much difference from a standard MIM pickup to a Thumper? I've read different, but i've no idea for myself just yet. i'm hoping there is a pick up out there that will sort my needs! Quote
Mr. Foxen Posted February 22, 2009 Posted February 22, 2009 (edited) Maybe a heavier guage set of strings, especially on the G will help. They are the source of your sound. Do you know what you have at the moment? Heres a 1/4 Punder on a P in action: Looks like a standard bridge, not a badass at least. The hard picking and loose heavy strings probably helps. I have 1/4 pounders in my Mockingbird and they are more growly than thumpy, so there is more to it that just pup choice. Edited February 22, 2009 by Mr. Foxen Quote
cameltoe Posted February 22, 2009 Author Posted February 22, 2009 [quote name='Mr. Foxen' post='416933' date='Feb 22 2009, 09:04 PM']Maybe a heavier guage set of strings, especially on the G will help. They are the source of your sound. Do you know what you have at the moment? Heres a 1/4 Punder on a P in action: Looks like a standard bridge, not a badass at least. The hard picking and loose heavy strings probably helps. I have 1/4 pounders in my Mockingbird and they are more growly than thumpy, so there is more to it that just pup choice.[/quote] Dude that sounds like a wet fart. I don't need that at all. Does he have some effect on that? it sounds like when i play too loud through a 15watt squier amp. Yeah i know what strings i have on my bass! what do u take me for? D'addario nickels .45 .65 .80 .100 I realise there is more to it than pup choice, but it's a good place to start (along with the bridge). I've experimented with strings. Quote
Guest MoJo Posted February 23, 2009 Posted February 23, 2009 (edited) [quote name='cameltoe' post='416914' date='Feb 22 2009, 08:49 PM']sorry if i posted this in the wrong section mods i'm new here. So there's not much difference from a standard MIM pickup to a Thumper? I've read different[/quote] Not the kind of difference you'd expect from reading some of the posts on here. The difference is marginal, a brighter harsher tone with a bit more depth, not the fire breathing monster you'd expect. I also had a MIM Precision to which I fitted a Badass II and SD Quarter Pound pups [attachment=20917:The_Precision.jpg] ....and again the difference over the original was very marginal, especially for the financial outlay. By all means try them for yourself. Not a cheap mod but your bass can only benefit from the mod. You may be better advised to look at your amplification or a decent compressor. I used to run a Laney B1 (1500 watts) into a Marshall 4x10 but could never get that 'punch' that I was looking for. My 300 watt Trace Elliot 122H (2x10) Combo with it's dual band compressor wipes the floor with my old rig (ask Basswesty how my P-bass sounded through my rig last Saturday). Edited February 23, 2009 by bassman2790 Quote
Stewart Posted February 23, 2009 Posted February 23, 2009 [quote]Anyway, as good as it is in rehersal (where i play about half my gigging volume) it loses a bit of it's punch at gigs. At rehersal, it thumps and punches along and really cuts through tonally as well, and once I lock in with the drummer it really drives the whole band. At gigs though, it doesn't quite have the same effect. It's not a volume issue, there's more than enough of that, it just seems to lose that bass 'punch', the almost rhythmic pound that drives along. And if I throw in a quick fill here and there, say on the G string for instance, it's even worse- the whole bass just drops away. You can hear the notes easily, it's not a volume issue, (I spent ages setting the pick up height and the strings seem to be of equal volume, and it's never been a problem at rehersal) it's just the rhythmic punch just drops away as soon as I hit the G string. I don't want to sacrifice the drive of the band for the sake of a quick bass riff, but it would be nice to have both. I want the bass to have that punch even at gig volume, and to keep that punch whenever I venture forward with a fill![/quote] I suspect the problem is rig and/or room rather than bass... Is the problem the sound you're hearing on stage or the audience are hearing out front? Quote
cameltoe Posted February 23, 2009 Author Posted February 23, 2009 (edited) [quote name='Stewart' post='417206' date='Feb 23 2009, 10:13 AM']I suspect the problem is rig and/or room rather than bass... Is the problem the sound you're hearing on stage or the audience are hearing out front?[/quote] my rig has always been good to me.... vx3500 (ha35000 head & 4x10) although how good the compression is on it i'm not sure. Room wise, i've played in all sorts recently. Small venues tucked away in the corner right upto big halls on stage. I've not heard alot about wizard or any of their pickups, but people seem to like them on here. Reading their website it's a little unclear of the sound you can get from Thumpers/ Stealth jobbies. Would be good to get a clear description. I may email the guy. Edited February 23, 2009 by cameltoe Quote
Guest MoJo Posted February 23, 2009 Posted February 23, 2009 [quote name='cameltoe' post='417336' date='Feb 23 2009, 01:51 PM']I may email the guy.[/quote] You're better off phoning Andy. He's a very knowledgable, friendly guy. When I discovered that the Thumper was not the one for me, he happily had it back and wound me a Jazz bridge pick-up in return Quote
bassmachine2112 Posted February 23, 2009 Posted February 23, 2009 hiho,by the sound of it it seems to be that at rehearsal things are fine but at gigs it could well be that it is a case of guitarists turning up the volume and the bottom end on their amps are drowning you out-ie using the same frequencies. Are you all going through the PA ?.If so turn your back line down for personal monitoring only and let the PA and the sound man do the rest.if it sounds fine out the front then don,t worry,just enjoy the gig knowing that it sounds great out the front.take a line out the mixer and record your gig,that will put your mind at rest. Hope this helps. Quote
cameltoe Posted February 23, 2009 Author Posted February 23, 2009 I'll probably leave the pickup for a while, but I wouldn't mind changing the bridge... Having a top-loader instead of thru-body means i could improve things there. I had considered the Gotoh 201, but I have quite a low action. I play with a medium heavy hand, i would say, and I play with just about as low an action as I can get away with, I set it up myself and just made sure I could go as low as possible with no fret buzz all the way up the neck on all strings. What concerns me about the 201 though is hearing that people can't get a low enough action. I don't want to mess around and shim my neck, but I wouldn't mind a bit more weight on there for an improvement. Is this the case with all the aftermarket bridges or just the 201? I see they make the 203 as well, which seems to be heavier than the original MIM bridge, but not as heavy as the 201. But does this have height issues, and would it make a substantial enough of a difference in tone to bother? Quote
artisan Posted February 24, 2009 Posted February 24, 2009 i stuck a Gotoh 201 on my old MIM P bass & had no problem getting a pretty low action,no shims req' Quote
Telebass Posted February 24, 2009 Posted February 24, 2009 (edited) Personally, I've never found any difference with bridges; the standard bridge does the job well. As for top load / string-thru - if it's a MIM Precision, there's only top load unless you're thinking of drilling some big holes in your bass! If your P is string-thru, then it's not a MIM... Edit: Or are you meaning slot-load? Edited February 24, 2009 by Telebass Quote
cameltoe Posted February 25, 2009 Author Posted February 25, 2009 [quote name='Telebass' post='418470' date='Feb 24 2009, 03:33 PM']Personally, I've never found any difference with bridges; the standard bridge does the job well. As for top load / string-thru - if it's a MIM Precision, there's only top load unless you're thinking of drilling some big holes in your bass! If your P is string-thru, then it's not a MIM... Edit: Or are you meaning slot-load?[/quote] No, thats what I meant. By having a bass with top-loading strings (as opposed to an american string-thru) there is an option to maybe improve the tone by changing the bridge, whereas changing the bridge on an american it probably wouldn't make any difference Quote
neepheid Posted February 25, 2009 Posted February 25, 2009 [quote name='Telebass' post='418470' date='Feb 24 2009, 03:33 PM']Personally, I've never found any difference with bridges; the standard bridge does the job well.[/quote] You've never swapped a Gibson 3 point bridge for a Hipshot Supertone then Quote
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