When Do You Think Your Band Will Start Gigging Again ?

[Bluewine]

1 hour ago, fretmeister said:

The venues, or more likely the companies that own the venues will cease trading.

However, if / when there is a vaccine or an effective treatment available then those venue buildings will still be there. They might need a bit of spit and polish, but they will be there. Nobody is going to start knocking them down. There's no benefit to that from either an economic or health point of view.

 

Until that time - get a good DAW and write the best music you can to be ready. What else have we got to do?

 

 

This is a time where most of you guys will have a little extra time for practicing.

Blue

[Bluewine]

2 minutes ago, peteb said:

Thanks Daryl - scary times - you look after yourself as well... 

Thanks Pete.

Regardless of what I'm doing or where I go, I never leave my small condo without wearing a mask and gloves.

Daryl

[Dan Dare]

6 hours ago, peteb said:

What a moronic attitude! I doubt that I would care to spend much time in your company at any time, but now I would literally avoid you like the plague.

Glad to hear that. Please wear a t shirt with your name on it, so I can make sure we don't bump into one another.

Sad to hear about your friend, but he had an underlying health condition. I acknowledged earlier in this earlier on this thread that those who are old, frail or who have health issues must be cautious, as should those who have contact with them. However,  forcing everyone to stay at home and trashing the economy, on which we all depend is a massive over-reaction. That has happened in large part due to the hysteria generated by the media et al. The government originally took a quite nuanced and sensible line, but once the screaming and shouting started, they were bounced into this ridiculous situation because they didn't want to be accused of not caring or doing enough.

Where do you think the money to pay for the NHS and all those public services on which we depend comes from? The tax take. If nobody is working, nobody is paying any tax and government coffers run dry quickly. And please don't say they can just print more money, because that's a short cut to hyper inflation. It's what happened in the dog days of the Weimar Republic and look what that led to.

At my age, I could easily say I'm all right, Jack and sit back. I'll be fine, with my pensions, house I've paid for, money in the bank, etc. However, I have a daughter and other relatives who are trying to make a living and who will struggle to get back on their feet when this is over and I also know many people who are not as fortunate as I am. 

I guess it's fortunate that the colour of this present government means they are more likely to be aware of the fact that we need a functioning economy and will look for ways to end this crazy situation.

[MacDaddy]

57 minutes ago, Bluewine said:

I can't put into words how much I miss playing with my band.

For those who follow my threads know where I stand on money. At this point if it's safe I'll play free of charge.

Blue

😵

@Lozz196 not playing a Precision, now @Bluewine offering to play for free? 😲

'Tis truly the End of Days! ☠️☠️☠️💀💀💀

[peteb]

26 minutes ago, Dan Dare said:

Glad to hear that. Please wear a t shirt with your name on it, so I can make sure we don't bump into one another.

Sad to hear about your friend, but he had an underlying health condition. I acknowledged earlier in this earlier on this thread that those who are old, frail or who have health issues must be cautious, as should those who have contact with them. However,  forcing everyone to stay at home and trashing the economy, on which we all depend is a massive over-reaction. That has happened in large part due to the hysteria generated by the media et al. The government originally took a quite nuanced and sensible line, but once the screaming and shouting started, they were bounced into this ridiculous situation because they didn't want to be accused of not caring or doing enough.

Where do you think the money to pay for the NHS and all those public services on which we depend comes from? The tax take. If nobody is working, nobody is paying any tax and government coffers run dry quickly. And please don't say they can just print more money, because that's a short cut to hyper inflation. It's what happened in the dog days of the Weimar Republic and look what that led to.

At my age, I could easily say I'm all right, Jack and sit back. I'll be fine, with my pensions, house I've paid for, money in the bank, etc. However, I have a daughter and other relatives who are trying to make a living and who will struggle to get back on their feet when this is over and I also know many people who are not as fortunate as I am. 

I guess it's fortunate that the colour of this present government means they are more likely to be aware of the fact that we need a functioning economy and will look for ways to end this crazy situation.

It’s nothing to do with politics, it’s about competence. Murdoch and a large section of the Tory party are already out for the PM’s blood over the way he has mishandled this crisis, hence the extraordinary article in the Sunday Times.

Ask yourself, out of the major economies, which country has handled the pandemic in the most effective way (hint: it’s Germany)? Who do you think is best placed to come out of the coming worldwide recession the strongest as a result?

[fretmeister]

2 minutes ago, peteb said:

It’s nothing to do with politics, it’s about competence. Murdoch and a large section of the Tory party are already out for the PM’s blood over the way he has mishandled this crisis, hence the extraordinary article in the Sunday Times.

Ask yourself, out of the major economies, which country has handled the pandemic in the most effective way (hint: it’s Germany)? Who do you think is best placed to come out of the coming worldwide recession the strongest as a result?

The benefits of having a scientist as leader, perhaps.

[Cuzzie]

51 minutes ago, Dan Dare said:

Glad to hear that. Please wear a t shirt with your name on it, so I can make sure we don't bump into one another.

Sad to hear about your friend, but he had an underlying health condition. I acknowledged earlier in this earlier on this thread that those who are old, frail or who have health issues must be cautious, as should those who have contact with them. However,  forcing everyone to stay at home and trashing the economy, on which we all depend is a massive over-reaction. That has happened in large part due to the hysteria generated by the media et al. The government originally took a quite nuanced and sensible line, but once the screaming and shouting started, they were bounced into this ridiculous situation because they didn't want to be accused of not caring or doing enough.

Where do you think the money to pay for the NHS and all those public services on which we depend comes from? The tax take. If nobody is working, nobody is paying any tax and government coffers run dry quickly. And please don't say they can just print more money, because that's a short cut to hyper inflation. It's what happened in the dog days of the Weimar Republic and look what that led to.

At my age, I could easily say I'm all right, Jack and sit back. I'll be fine, with my pensions, house I've paid for, money in the bank, etc. However, I have a daughter and other relatives who are trying to make a living and who will struggle to get back on their feet when this is over and I also know many people who are not as fortunate as I am. 

I guess it's fortunate that the colour of this present government means they are more likely to be aware of the fact that we need a functioning economy and will look for ways to end this crazy situation.

It’s not media bullying which is to blame, granted it plays a part, but there is science behind it, and a lot of unknown, so erring on the side of caution no matter how painful is reasonable. I don’t think anyone can argue with the rationale, if you don’t get it, you are likely to fare better and that if you do get it an need serious attention, availability or resources and personnel to deliver it is better.

Its a weird day when you look at a figure of only 449 dead in a day and think - oh that’s not bad......I bet if most of us got 450 to a gig we would think that’s a lot of people! (Bear in mind Monday always reports lower with weekend figures often spreading more than 24 hours)

@Dan DareWould be interesting to see if you have figures to corroborate your sentiments. Bear in mind if you say for example only 1% of the death toll is in the 20-40 years old bracket - that’s still 165 people in the U.K. that would not have ordinarily died in the span of a couple of months or 24.5 thousand worldwide.....

On a better note I loved the story about the 102 year old lady who survived Spanish Flu, and has just recently survived Covid - we need to find her secret

[ClassicVibes]

When there is no more Covid 19...

[stewblack]

BL put a date in our diary today, for August. So she's hopeful. 

[petebassist]

Hopin that by August, smaller scale outdoor festivals will be allowed and maybe smaller venues. All with a social distance-lite policy of course. You may say I'm a dreamer, but I'm not the only one...

There is a well known paradox about pandemics, that if you do the right thing, you minimize the impact and some people wonder why the measures were so draconian when the impact was minimal.

[mep]

6 hours ago, ubit said:

Quite possibly because most people can't gig because of the Corona virus mate

Perhaps I wasn't clear enough?  Obviously this thread is about gigs affected by coronovirus. There are a few posters who want to rant on about issues of just coronovirus and argue about that with others, and more have appeared since my initial request. There is another thread for that. So, to clarify, let's keep this thread about gigs affected by coronovirus.

Edit. I'm out of this thread now. The post below proves my point.

Edited April 20, 2020 by mep

[Dan Dare]

1 hour ago, Cuzzie said:

It’s not media bullying which is to blame, granted it plays a part, but there is science behind it, and a lot of unknown, so erring on the side of caution no matter how painful is reasonable. I don’t think anyone can argue with the rationale, if you don’t get it, you are likely to fare better and that if you do get it an need serious attention, availability or resources and personnel to deliver it is better.

Its a weird day when you look at a figure of only 449 dead in a day and think - oh that’s not bad......I bet if most of us got 450 to a gig we would think that’s a lot of people! (Bear in mind Monday always reports lower with weekend figures often spreading more than 24 hours)

@Dan DareWould be interesting to see if you have figures to corroborate your sentiments. Bear in mind if you say for example only 1% of the death toll is in the 20-40 years old bracket - that’s still 165 people in the U.K. that would not have ordinarily died in the span of a couple of months or 24.5 thousand worldwide.....

On a better note I loved the story about the 102 year old lady who survived Spanish Flu, and has just recently survived Covid - we need to find her secret

Have a look at https://www.gov.uk/government/statistics/weekly-all-cause-mortality-surveillance-2019-to-2020.

The problem is that figures are not being accurately or honestly reported. Post mortems are not being carried out on those suspected of being infected and many deaths are being attributed to it without proof. There is scant testing, so it is not known either how many have it or, more important, who has had it and recovered, meaning they have antibodies and are not a risk to others. Before anyone starts yelling about "super-spreaders" (another piece of media-invented tripe), stimulating your system to produce antibodies is the whole purpose of vaccination. Once you have them, you cannot contract something or pass it on to others. Are there protests about vaccinated people infecting others with polio, smallpox, TB, etc? Of course not.

More generally UK mortality numbers are currently approximately 600,000 in a year (all causes). That's around 1,640 per day, which puts the figure you cite into some kind of perspective. However, many of those infected by Covid have died with, but not from it (a bit like the fact that quite a few men have prostate cancer when they die, but it isn't the thing that kills them).

Much of the media has shamelessly chalked up virtually every death to the bug. At least the Beeb has been honest and has referred to people dying "with" it, but they're the exception. It's also unarguable that the vast majority of people who have died have been those who are old or frail or with an existing health issue.

I shan't repeat again what I said above about certain people - old, frail, existing health issue, etc - needing to be cautious. It's obvious. However, it would be sensible to test everyone - if you have had it and recovered, you will have antibodies and be immune, as is the case with each annual flu' virus, etc - to establish who needs to be protected, rather than bankrupting the country.

Then those who wish to return to work (of who I'm one. I'm retired from my main job, but still work) can do so and we can get back to paying our taxes and spending our money and try to save the economy before it goes over the edge.

Edited April 20, 2020 by Dan Dare

[Cuzzie]

1 hour ago, Dan Dare said:

Have a look at https://www.gov.uk/government/statistics/weekly-all-cause-mortality-surveillance-2019-to-2020.

The problem is that figures are not being accurately or honestly reported. Post mortems are not being carried out on those suspected of being infected and many deaths are being attributed to it without proof. There is scant testing, so it is not known either how many have it or, more important, who has had it and recovered, meaning they have antibodies and are not a risk to others. Before anyone starts yelling about "super-spreaders" (another piece of media-invented tripe), stimulating your system to produce antibodies is the whole purpose of vaccination. Once you have them, you cannot contract something or pass it on to others. Are there protests about vaccinated people infecting others with polio, smallpox, TB, etc? Of course not.

More generally UK mortality numbers are currently approximately 600,000 in a year (all causes). That's around 1,640 per day, which puts the figure you cite into some kind of perspective. However, many of those infected by Covid have died with, but not from it (a bit like the fact that quite a few men have prostate cancer when they die, but it isn't the thing that kills them).

Much of the media has shamelessly chalked up virtually every death to the bug. At least the Beeb has been honest and has referred to people dying "with" it, but they're the exception. It's also unarguable that the vast majority of people who have died have been those who are old or frail or with an existing health issue.

I shan't repeat again what I said above about certain people - old, frail, existing health issue, etc - needing to be cautious. It's obvious. However, it would be sensible to test everyone - if you have had it and recovered, you will have antibodies and be immune, as is the case with each annual flu' virus, etc - to establish who needs to be protected, rather than bankrupting the country.

Then those who wish to return to work (of who I'm one. I'm retired from my main job, but still work) can do so and we can get back to paying our taxes and spending our money and try to save the economy before it goes over the edge.

Mortality figures - thanks for those - it quite plainly points to an excess in some weeks, the overall trend will become apparent as it goes on, but when you have a City like New York considering mass burial sites as they cannot keep up with the deaths, alarm bells should ring......
 

Vaccines are not 100% effective, there is a failure rate, you can still contract the vaccinated disease, but it should be to a lesser or sub clinical state as your bodies defences recognise the pathogen and can act against it. It won’t be effective in all people, some people do better especially women and children in their immune response.

We do not yet know whether or not you can be re-infected with the virus having had it - work is ongoing on that.

If you have been infected and are ‘immune’ you can Still carry it and pass it on to other people who are not immune, if you do not carry on with social distancing, hand washing instructions etc.

Dying with or of Covid.........If you have contracted Covid get a pneumonia and multi organ failure to do with the ramp up of your inflammatory internal physiology to fight it, have you died of Covid, of pneumonia or of multi-organ failure? Yes prostate cancer can be a relatively indolent disease and you die with it, but comparing it to Covid is folly, it really is and they are nothing alike.

Again Polio, TB, Small pox - different diseases, it’s excellent we have a vaccine that worked to eradicate, and we have developed ones for HPV and cervical cancer.

Yes the frail should be protected, especially because the likelihood of recovery is lower for various reasons, but when something is abnormally and disproportionately affecting apparent normal people, or disproportionately affecting people with existing conditions for whatever reason, then it needs to be taken seriously, and if that takes an elongated period of time and difficult measures, it takes an elongated period of time and difficult measures and possible a cultural reboot.

Economy is also important, it’s a delicate balance between economy, welfare, livelihood and health. After the Plague for example it took Europe 200 years to get back to anything like it was.

The fallout for this will be big and not just related to Covid, but also the work that cannot be continued as this swamps a system. Some hospitals are unable to provide potentially curative cancer care because of this. Even if the patient never contracted Covid, but did not get their operation and sadly died, or did very badly, is this related to Covid? Of course it is, but of course some may not see it that way.

I don’t think by any stretch you wish people harm, and a difficult way of life suddenly imposed is hard to us and loved ones especially if you have not had direct contact with someone, or a situation to deal with this, it makes it more difficult to fathom. I unfortunately have, do and know people that deal with this around the country.

As it stands the view of hyperbole is contrary to what actually happens on the ground, hence why it’s difficult to fathom that view

Edited April 20, 2020 by Cuzzie

[MacDaddy]

And the gigs?

[Nicko]

As a pub covers band we didn't have a massive number of gigs booked this year, and the ones in September/October have IMHO a 50:50 chance of going ahead.

The singer has recently announced a relocation that will make getting together and gigging more difficult.  If gigging doesn't happen this year I think the band will be gone, even if the venues survive.  Strangely, I don't think I'll be that sad to see it go.  It's a band that has a good set list, performs well and is well received by the punters, but I just don't get the same joy out oi it as I have from other bands I've been in - and I don't think I'm alone in that.

[Rich]

8 hours ago, la bam said:

Pretty sure that local registrars have been banned from working until around september this year. So that rules out most Weddings until then.

I hope that doesn't slip... my son is due to get married in October. At this rate my next gig is likely to be his evening bash, IF they don't have to postpone.

[jimmyb625]

I saw our B/L yesterday, from a distance of 2m. We've been offered a festival for mid-August, which we're going to accept, but in reality we're expecting that it'll be cancelled. 

We're not expecting to be gigging this year.

[fretmeister]

17 hours ago, Dan Dare said:

Have a look at https://www.gov.uk/government/statistics/weekly-all-cause-mortality-surveillance-2019-to-2020.

The problem is that figures are not being accurately or honestly reported. Post mortems are not being carried out on those suspected of being infected and many deaths are being attributed to it without proof. There is scant testing, so it is not known either how many have it or, more important, who has had it and recovered, meaning they have antibodies and are not a risk to others. Before anyone starts yelling about "super-spreaders" (another piece of media-invented tripe), stimulating your system to produce antibodies is the whole purpose of vaccination. Once you have them, you cannot contract something or pass it on to others. Are there protests about vaccinated people infecting others with polio, smallpox, TB, etc? Of course not.

More generally UK mortality numbers are currently approximately 600,000 in a year (all causes). That's around 1,640 per day, which puts the figure you cite into some kind of perspective. However, many of those infected by Covid have died with, but not from it (a bit like the fact that quite a few men have prostate cancer when they die, but it isn't the thing that kills them).

Much of the media has shamelessly chalked up virtually every death to the bug. At least the Beeb has been honest and has referred to people dying "with" it, but they're the exception. It's also unarguable that the vast majority of people who have died have been those who are old or frail or with an existing health issue.

I shan't repeat again what I said above about certain people - old, frail, existing health issue, etc - needing to be cautious. It's obvious. However, it would be sensible to test everyone - if you have had it and recovered, you will have antibodies and be immune, as is the case with each annual flu' virus, etc - to establish who needs to be protected, rather than bankrupting the country.

Then those who wish to return to work (of who I'm one. I'm retired from my main job, but still work) can do so and we can get back to paying our taxes and spending our money and try to save the economy before it goes over the edge.

The Office of National Statistics have confirmed that the govt figures are wrong because thye exclude care home deaths and when they are included the deaths are 41% higher. (reported today on Sky news website)

 

There is increasing evidence that people can get it more than once and that the level of antibodies in those who have recovered are insufficient to provide protection. There is also no agreed and tested evidence that those with antibodies cannot spread. Cannot assume they are not spreaders as that would be a very dangerous assumption to make.

And today it's been announced that over 30 different strains of the virus have been identified, some far more dangerous than others. This further reduces the chance of finding an effective vaccine quickly, if at all. Herd immunity only comes in 2 ways - vaccination, or that the virus kills enough of those genetically at high risk BEFORE they reach breeding age so as to remove that weakness from the next generation's DNA structure. In other words, a genuine selection pressure.

[Dan Dare]

2 hours ago, fretmeister said:

The Office of National Statistics have confirmed that the govt figures are wrong because they exclude care home deaths and when they are included the deaths are 41% higher. (reported today on Sky news website).

There is increasing evidence that people can get it more than once and that the level of antibodies in those who have recovered are insufficient to provide protection. There is also no agreed and tested evidence that those with antibodies cannot spread. Cannot assume they are not spreaders as that would be a very dangerous assumption to make.

And today it's been announced that over 30 different strains of the virus have been identified, some far more dangerous than others. This further reduces the chance of finding an effective vaccine quickly, if at all. Herd immunity only comes in 2 ways - vaccination, or that the virus kills enough of those genetically at high risk BEFORE they reach breeding age so as to remove that weakness from the next generation's DNA structure. In other words, a genuine selection pressure.

Did you look at the link? Figures there are all deaths, not just those from C19. Immunity does not only come in two ways. You ignore the important fact that the majority of people have a well-functioning immune system, which will enable them to control and recover from infections, many without medical intervention. For example, Matt Hancock (Health Secretary) was infected and was over it quickly, whereas Johnson was more seriously ill. 

We give too much credit to vaccination these days. It may have helped eradicate and control disease, but is not the sole reason they are not the problem they once were. Better environment, diet, housing, better medical care, etc have all played an important part. I agree there is unlikely to be a vaccine for this. Decades of effort and enormous sums of money have been devoted to trying to find a cure for the common cold (another corona strain) without success. It's high time the talk of finding a vaccine stopped. It isn't going to happen

So what do we do? Do we destroy the economy or take a more nuanced line? If we wreck the world economy, the next step will most likely be war. As countries fight to rebuild themselves. It won't be long before desperation (and probably greed, too) makes that inevitable.  End result = goodbye planet Earth, or the people on it at any rate.

[nilebodgers]

44 minutes ago, Dan Dare said:

.... Decades of effort and enormous sums of money have been devoted to trying to find a cure for the common cold (another corona strain) without success. It's high time the talk of finding a vaccine stopped. It isn't going to happen

....

That is because there are at least 160 circulating strains of the common cold rhinovirus, targeting that with a single vaccine is a massively difficult task.

[fleabag]

Why has this now become a copy of the other  Covid thread ?

[Cuzzie]

29 minutes ago, fleabag said:

Why has this now become a copy of the other  Covid thread ?

Probably because the 2 are inextricably linked.

Covid becomes less of a problem, gigs may happen again in the remaining institutions - 2 cant be separated so it will fluctuate between Covid news and people saying bookings have been made/honoured/cancelled

[mcnach]

6 hours ago, fretmeister said:

annnounced that over 30 different strains of the virus have been identified, some far more dangerous than others. This further reduces the chance of finding an effective vaccine quickly, if at all. 

 

a strain is not defined by uniqueness on those proteins that are being targetted to make a vaccine from, most (all?) will share that protein with complete identity. That information is what we need before stating that it's a problem to create a vaccine.

These half-truths create fear unnecessarily

[ClassicVibes]

I have a tour booked for next week, actually.

We're giving Covid the middle finger and bringing rock n' roll to the people again.

We start off the tour in the living room before dates at the kitchen, bathroom, bedroom and to finish, the garden shed. 

[acidbass]

We’ve been told to prepare for no gigs until at least 2021. Large scale events in Ireland are resuming, as it stands, on 1 September, but this is likely to be pushed back to the start of next year.