NJE Posted February 26, 2009 Share Posted February 26, 2009 Just got the new issue of Bass Guitar Magazine and spotted in the Bass Merchant advert that they are now UK distributors for AC basses and stock should be arriving Feb!! I for one cant wait and am looking for things to sell (might be time for the Roscoe Beck V to hit the road) Anyway does anyone else know any more about this?? I am jumping around with excitement. Nath. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
henry norton Posted February 26, 2009 Share Posted February 26, 2009 Hmmmm, so what distinguishes these souped up Fender clones from all the others out there (including our very own, beloved Shuker of course)? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
budget bassist Posted February 26, 2009 Share Posted February 26, 2009 [quote name='henry norton' post='420246' date='Feb 26 2009, 05:43 PM']Hmmmm, so what distinguishes these souped up Fender clones from all the others out there (including our very own, beloved Shuker of course)?[/quote] +1, i checked out their site a while ago, and the prices seemed outrageous for what is basically a fender precision/jazz. I'd rather have an american fender, and that's something i never thought i'd say! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NJE Posted February 26, 2009 Author Share Posted February 26, 2009 [quote name='henry norton' post='420246' date='Feb 26 2009, 05:43 PM']Hmmmm, so what distinguishes these souped up Fender clones from all the others out there (including our very own, beloved Shuker of course)?[/quote] The way they are made to faithfully replicate older fenders, although there are probably a load of companies doing that as well. Personally I just love the look and design and overal aesthetic. Its shallow I know and I may play one and not like it but just the chance to play one is exciting. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kiwi Posted February 26, 2009 Share Posted February 26, 2009 The wood is aged for a long time, a bit like fodera. What this means in terms of sound is up to you. If course, you COULD buy an 80's Squier Jv and have pretty much the same thing with some upgraded hardware and pickups. But it wouldn't be an Avella and it probably wouldn't have the same attention to detail. BUT, if its old wood you're after there's plenty of it out there... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LukeFRC Posted February 26, 2009 Share Posted February 26, 2009 [quote name='Crazykiwi' post='420261' date='Feb 26 2009, 05:59 PM']The wood is aged for a long time, a bit like fodera. What this means in terms of sound is up to you. If course, you COULD buy an 80's Squier Jv and have pretty much the same thing with some upgraded hardware and pickups. But it wouldn't be an Avella and it probably wouldn't have the same attention to detail. BUT, if its old wood you're after there's plenty of it out there...[/quote] thats what I did! honestly whats the point? I couldn't make the prices bit open but I bet it was a good deal more than I spent on my JV. I have worked with wood a lot and honestly get what they are saying about using properly seasoned wood, but really on an electronic instrument does it make that much difference? The only massive difference in feel between my JV and these are real lacquer rather than poly, but thats not really going to change the world is it. It strikes me the ethos of production of these is quite differnt to Leo making planks with strings on in the 1950's... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nick Brown Posted February 26, 2009 Share Posted February 26, 2009 [quote name='Crazykiwi' post='420261' date='Feb 26 2009, 05:59 PM']The wood is aged for a long time, a bit like fodera. What this means in terms of sound is up to you. If course, you COULD buy an 80's Squier Jv and have pretty much the same thing with some upgraded hardware and pickups. But it wouldn't be an Avella and it probably wouldn't have the same attention to detail. BUT, if its old wood you're after there's plenty of it out there...[/quote] The woods that Jimmy uses are usually proper old woods as opposed to kiln dried "aged" woods. That and the attention to detail, some of the best fret work I've seen. His own proprietary pick ups wound in house and the preamp, again proprietary. All these things make these basses a little different to a lot of the J type basses around IMO. As with everything it really depends what you are looking for in a bass. There is at least one Alleva Coppolo in the UK already Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kiwi Posted February 26, 2009 Share Posted February 26, 2009 [quote name='LukeFRC' post='420273' date='Feb 26 2009, 06:12 PM']thats what I did! honestly whats the point? I couldn't make the prices bit open but I bet it was a good deal more than I spent on my JV. I have worked with wood a lot and honestly get what they are saying about using properly seasoned wood, but really on an electronic instrument does it make that much difference? The only massive difference in feel between my JV and these are real lacquer rather than poly, but thats not really going to change the world is it. It strikes me the ethos of production of these is quite differnt to Leo making planks with strings on in the 1950's...[/quote] Oh I think it does make some difference but its important to see through the smoke and mirrors. Anyone who thinks old wood is key to what they want should weigh up their options and make a choice. Its also possible to source (albeit rarely because its usually so bloody wormy) salvaged wood from architectural recycling yards and take it to a luthier such as Mr Shuker to have it made into a bass. Will that deliver The Sound? Hmmmmmm caveat emptor, silk purses and sow's ears etc. The best thing about old wood is that its been in a bass for a long time. The wood is used to string tension and the fingerboard can be shaped at each refret to take into account any variations in how the neck wood has seasoned. Being looked after and well maintained is what makes older basses so good - just like any car. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
birdy Posted February 26, 2009 Share Posted February 26, 2009 Once you get to a certain level its very subjective as what is good or better. The Alleva Coppolo that I tried was as good as any other bass I have played in terms of build quality and tone. I think that if you don't 'get' Celinders, Sadowsky's, Alembics etc then you may be mystified as to why anyone would pay ten times as much for one of these than a standard Fender but its a lot like cars. Some of the Allevas also have a pretty rare form of Brazilian Rosewood and that can add $1500 to the total cost due to its rarity. Whether that $1500 translates as value for money in terms of tone thats another question. Some people think it does. Steve Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LukeFRC Posted February 26, 2009 Share Posted February 26, 2009 [quote name='Crazykiwi' post='420287' date='Feb 26 2009, 06:22 PM']Oh I think it does make some difference but its important to see through the smoke and mirrors. Anyone who thinks old wood is key to what they want should weigh up their options and make a choice. Its also possible to source (albeit rarely because its usually so bloody wormy) salvaged wood from architectural recycling yards and take it to a luthier such as Mr Shuker to have it made into a bass. Will that deliver The Sound? Hmmmmmm caveat emptor, silk purses and sow's ears etc. The best thing about old wood is that its been in a bass for a long time. The wood is used to string tension and the fingerboard can be shaped at each refret to take into account any variations in how the neck wood has seasoned. Being looked after and well maintained is what makes older basses so good - just like any car.[/quote] recycle old tudor furniture as basses, anything prewar really will have been better seasoned.... double bass, violin, accoustic guitar yeah i can see its worth it but otherwise it baffels me. having said that I bet they are lovely things to play. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kiwi Posted February 27, 2009 Share Posted February 27, 2009 [quote name='LukeFRC' post='420520' date='Feb 26 2009, 11:53 PM']recycle old tudor furniture as basses, anything prewar really will have been better seasoned.... double bass, violin, accoustic guitar yeah i can see its worth it but otherwise it baffels me. having said that I bet they are lovely things to play.[/quote] Or 32,000 year old reclaimed cypress? Or 35,000 year old reclaimed swamp kauri that my parents have a complete dining room set made from? How old is old enough? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nick Brown Posted February 27, 2009 Share Posted February 27, 2009 [quote name='LukeFRC' post='420520' date='Feb 26 2009, 11:53 PM']recycle old tudor furniture as basses, anything prewar really will have been better seasoned.... double bass, violin, accoustic guitar yeah i can see its worth it but otherwise it baffels me. having said that I bet they are lovely things to play.[/quote] I'm sure I recall that Roger Sadowsky's view is that the acoustic performance of an electric instrument determines how well the instrument sounds when plugged in. There's a free to view documentary floating around somewhere where he mentions this idea and he seems to have a pretty good handle on what makes a bass sound good. I'm sure we've all had instruments that just seem to blossom and transmit vibration to the body with the lightest touch. I've never tested if these are the best sounding but I find that quality appealing, maybe it provides an enhanced feeling of contact with the instrument ? There again I don't think this quality is purely the domain of instruments using old woods, heck I had a Status Stealth that did the trick in spades, but I do think careful choice of woods can be pretty important in a timber instrument. The Alleva I have is probably the most "alive" instrument that I've personally owned and this translates into it's plugged in sound, so whatever Jimmy Coppolo's formula is I think it definitely works. As usual all IMO and YMMV. You are right they are wonderful to play Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
largo Posted February 27, 2009 Share Posted February 27, 2009 Think I'm missing something here... I can see the point of tonewoods having an effect on an acoustic instrument, guitar, violin, cello etc. However, don't these AC basses have active circuits? Isn't the sound pretty much dictated by the preamp circuit & the pickups than anything else. Both my custom basses I chose whatever I thought looked good in terms of woods, finishes etc. and chose the preamp/pickup combination that gave me the sound. Wish I'd known better ;0) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Toasted Posted February 27, 2009 Share Posted February 27, 2009 (edited) [quote name='budget bassist' post='420247' date='Feb 26 2009, 05:46 PM']+1, i checked out their site a while ago, and the prices seemed outrageous for what is basically a fender precision/jazz. I'd rather have an american fender, and that's something i never thought i'd say![/quote] To me, my Celinder and Sadowsky (£2500 each) are at least 3.125 times better than your American Fender (£800). I want to spend the money because I see the benefits that comes with spending more. I can understand that most people wouldn't want to do that, but I can and do Edited February 27, 2009 by Toasted Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nick Brown Posted February 27, 2009 Share Posted February 27, 2009 [quote name='largo' post='420812' date='Feb 27 2009, 12:37 PM']Think I'm missing something here... I can see the point of tonewoods having an effect on an acoustic instrument, guitar, violin, cello etc. However, don't these AC basses have active circuits? Isn't the sound pretty much dictated by the preamp circuit & the pickups than anything else. Both my custom basses I chose whatever I thought looked good in terms of woods, finishes etc. and chose the preamp/pickup combination that gave me the sound. Wish I'd known better ;0)[/quote] Well, yes they (AC) do have active preamps but they also have passive at the pull of a knob (ooerrrr). Are you saying that your choice of pickups and preamp are 100% responsible for the sound of your basses ?? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chris_b Posted February 27, 2009 Share Posted February 27, 2009 [quote name='largo' post='420812' date='Feb 27 2009, 12:37 PM']....I can see the point of tonewoods having an effect on an acoustic instrument, guitar, violin, cello etc. However, don't these AC basses have active circuits? Isn't the sound pretty much dictated by the preamp circuit & the pickups than anything else....[/quote] An electric bass is an acoustic instrument that has electrics added. The pickups magnify the sound of string vibrating but that sound is created by the rest of the instrument resonating and shaping the string vibration. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NJE Posted February 27, 2009 Author Share Posted February 27, 2009 Wow, a lot of debate going on here, wish i had not said anything now. I just think they are pretty and I love the headstock, oh and Paul Turner plays one so thats me convinced! but seriously each to their own, I think ist just nice that they have brought the basses over so that we at least get to try them out unlike Sadowosky NYC basses. Just a quick update for anyone who is interested, Darren at the bass merchant has very kindly PM'd me that there are two basses coming in to start, a 5 string jazz with racing stripe and a Grey burst 5 string P and that they will be about in the next couple of days. I for one cannot wait to play one. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kiwi Posted February 27, 2009 Share Posted February 27, 2009 [quote name='NJE' post='420997' date='Feb 27 2009, 03:21 PM']and Paul Turner plays one so thats me convinced![/quote] Yeah but you might also want to ask WHY is Paul Turner playing one? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LukeFRC Posted February 27, 2009 Share Posted February 27, 2009 [quote name='chris_b' post='420865' date='Feb 27 2009, 01:23 PM']An electric bass is an acoustic instrument that has electrics added. The pickups magnify the sound of string vibrating but that sound is created by the rest of the instrument resonating and shaping the string vibration.[/quote] but the shape of my acoustic guitar directly influences the sound response hence different shapes for different purposes, if i hacked the bottom horn off my electric bass guitar i doubt the sound would change that much. on acoustic instruments the sound is created by the strings vibrations being magnified and resonating within the body of the instrument. on an electric bass the sound is created by the metal string vibrating over an electronic pickup, what I think the rest of the bass does is colour that initial sound in one way or another. I think this is important, which is why I have some nice basses, but I don't think its the be all and end all. For instance if I had a gig at the royal albert hall on the bass then the difference between me playing a £300 P bass or a AC P bass would be fairly negligible [i]when compared[/i] to the differnce between a similar event at the same venue with a £300 violin and a £30,000 violin. Having said that I think they are probably amazing basses, I wonder if we look too much at the manufacturers price to judge basses by rather than just getting excited by basses from all price ranges. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chris_b Posted February 27, 2009 Share Posted February 27, 2009 [quote name='LukeFRC' post='421121' date='Feb 27 2009, 05:03 PM']....on acoustic instruments the sound is created by the strings vibrations being magnified and resonating within the body of the instrument. on an electric bass the sound is created by the metal string vibrating over an electronic pickup, what I think the rest of the bass does is colour that initial sound in one way or another....[/quote] The point is vibration isn't just "vibration"! The tone of the vibration is very important, unless you play punk or metal! A solid bodied instrument is not going to resonate as a hollow bodied instrument would, but the better the resonance in the instrument the better the tone of the vibration in the string, so the pickup starts with a better tone to work with. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nick Brown Posted February 27, 2009 Share Posted February 27, 2009 [quote name='Crazykiwi' post='421022' date='Feb 27 2009, 03:39 PM']Yeah but you might also want to ask WHY is Paul Turner playing one? [/quote] Because he bought them ?? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Russ Posted March 1, 2009 Share Posted March 1, 2009 Played one in NYC last year. Unimpressed. Just another super-J, to my ears, with an ugly, blobby headstock. Nicely made, quite nice neck and didn't sound bad, but the Sadowsky Metro I tried the same day sounded and played much better and was half the price. And I've played Sei Jazzes, GBs, Moons, Celinders and Bacchuses (Bacchi?) that do the super-J thing better than both of them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kiwi Posted March 1, 2009 Share Posted March 1, 2009 [quote name='Nick Brown' post='421197' date='Feb 27 2009, 06:19 PM']Because he bought them ?? [/quote] You'd think so but the world of endorsements is a murky one... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ped Posted March 1, 2009 Share Posted March 1, 2009 [quote name='Crazykiwi' post='422184' date='Mar 1 2009, 06:46 AM']You'd think so but the world of endorsements is a murky one...[/quote] Yeah, someone gave me one after all! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nick Brown Posted March 1, 2009 Share Posted March 1, 2009 [quote name='Crazykiwi' post='422184' date='Mar 1 2009, 06:46 AM']You'd think so but the world of endorsements is a murky one...[/quote] Not murky at all in this case. There's a thread on Talkbass where it's made known he bought his Alleva's and as far as I'm aware that's how it works for everyone of Jimmy's customers. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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