Short Scale v Long Scale

[gypsyjazzer]

Is there a notable difference in tone between a short scale 30" and a long scale 34" electric bass guitar--that is if both had the same strings / same amp settings / same pickups? (I expect the woods used would have a bearing on this.)

Would the short scale have perhaps a more 'fatter / rounded' tone?

Solid body v semi-hollow body make a difference?

 

[hooky_lowdown]

30" will have more low end due to the strings having less tension. 34" should have better articulation due to better mids.

Woods used have very little affect on tone, strings have the biggest impact on your sound, followed by pickups, then playing technique.

Hollow bodied basses will also give a deeper sound than solid bodied due to greater resonance.

So a 30" hollow bodied bass will have a heavy low-end, especially if it have heavy guage strings as well.

The type of strings (including guage) will have the greatest affect on one's tone!

[shoulderpet]

1 hour ago, gypsyjazzer said:

Would the short scale have perhaps a more 'fatter / rounded' tone?

Yes precisely that -all other things being equal, slightly less treble and upper mids although this can be countered with string choice, as @hooky_lowdown mentioned type of strings will have the biggest impact.

This from an article on short vs long scale basses explains it well:

each note played on bass (or any instrument, for that matter) includes a series of harmonics that are predictable ratios of that note. The volumes of these harmonics give an instrument its unique tone, or timbre. When the string length changes, the character of those harmonics (and their volumes) change. 

This is easily demonstrated on any stringed instrument. For instance, play an E on the 12th fret of the low E string. Then, play the same note on the 7th fret of the A string. While the pitches are the same, the timbre is different. The E played on the 12th fret of the low E string is darker than the E played on the A string, which is due to the shorter length of string resonating in that position. So, because of their reduced scale length, short-scale basses are inherently darker and, arguably, richer in tone than long-scale basses.

 

Quote

Solid body v semi-hollow body make a difference?

 

Yes semi hollow will be warmer and woodier sounding 

Edited May 5, 2020 by shoulderpet

[gypsyjazzer]

Thanks guys for your info, much appreciated. As I play double bass I am looking to buy a fretless short scale BG---to get as close to the DB sound as possible---so will be looking for a short scale hollow body BG.

Does anybody know who makes the deepest (width) hollow body short scale BG? The bigger the depth of the body the deeper the sound of a BG?

Those of you who play a 5 string bass how often do you use the 5th string (B?) Worth having?

Edited May 5, 2020 by gypsyjazzer
Added more info.

[ezbass]

2 minutes ago, gypsyjazzer said:

Thanks guys for your info, much appreciated. As I play double bass I am looking to buy a fretless short scale BG---to get as close to the DB sound as possible-

You want a Rob Allen Mouse. There is one for sale in the community:

 

[hooky_lowdown]

What's your budget for your bass, as the Rob Allen is mighty expensive?

To get the sound you want you need flatwound strings, La Bella or Thomastik (or even tapewounds), then roll off the tone.

The deeper body - deeper sound isn't necessarily the case. I have a solid bodied precision bass with flatwounds and it sounds very much like an upright bass with the tone rolled all the way down, and my amp settings with a low end bias.

Edited May 5, 2020 by hooky_lowdown

[jrixn1]

I found I got "the most upright sound" from a fretted Precision with flats and a foam mute.  I guess you could use fretless (vs fretted), but I'm not convinced it's a major factor.

The Rob Allen clips I've heard have a lot of "mwah", which isn't really what an upright sounds like.  Perhaps I'm listening to the wrong clips - can anyone link to a good example?

[Sambrook]

La Bella White nylon tape wounds with a piezo bridge, on a semi hollow body = superb DB-like tone. Real girth and texture to the notes... 

[gypsyjazzer]

My budget? Not sure--nothing expensive---buying on the second hand market.

[TheRev]

There's a fretless, semi-hollow,  piezo equipped Ibanez in the for sale forum at the moment. If you put a set of nylon wounds on there and stuffed some foam under the strings at the bridge, I think you'll get as close to a DB sound as you're likley to get from a bass guitar.

Its also very competitivey priced.

[Sambrook]

I second the above post. If its an Aerosilk piezo, you'll be laughing--they're excellent 

[therealting]

There’s also the Godin A4 / A5, or a Hofner violin. 

[cytania]

Watch Bart Soeters YouTube video. He plays a variety of basses that give a jazz sound.

The problem with old school basses like Hofners is they are muddy and thuddy. With a modern bass you can contrive through EQ, mutes and foam to get an old school thump but you can’t take a semi and give it clarity and definition.
 

Shortscale tends to make the D and G strings ‘pop’ a bit more. On typical Fenders the G is often a bit weak with deadspots. The Precision E is clanky and percussive. It sort of suffers the ’odd one out’ syndrome that alot of 5 strings have with their B string. Modern basses with compound necks try to balance the strings more but some would say they lack the character of a P.

[bassbiscuits]

I wouldn't say short scales have more low end - the opposite is true in my experience (using a Fender Mustang and a Fender P).

The Mustang feels more midrangy and aggressive, but the P wins in terms of overall poke and bigger bottom end. There's more of it, so the sound is slightly fuller.

It's not drastically different, but its noticeable. They both sound cool tho.

 

[ClassicVibes]

Short scales are just has likely to neck dive. You wouldn't think so but it's true. 

 

EDIT BEFORE THE HATE - This does not mean all short scales neck dive!

Edited May 6, 2020 by ClassicVibes

[Frank Blank]

21 hours ago, TheRev said:

There's a fretless, semi-hollow,  piezo equipped Ibanez in the for sale forum at the moment. If you put a set of nylon wounds on there and stuffed some foam under the strings at the bridge, I think you'll get as close to a DB sound as you're likely to get from a bass guitar.

Its also very competitively priced.

I'd agree wholeheartedly with this, if you can't stretch to a Rob Allen this is going to be a good bet.

[itu]

For a thick body and short scale, try a Bajo sexto.

[therealting]

4 hours ago, ClassicVibes said:

Short scales are just has likely to neck dive. You wouldn't think so but it's true. 

 

EDIT BEFORE THE HATE - This does not mean all short scales neck dive!

It really depends on the body shape, mainly if it has long horns or which fret they reach. 

[martthebass]

On ‎06‎/‎05‎/‎2020 at 16:41, therealting said:

It really depends on the body shape, mainly if it has long horns or which fret they reach. 

Sometimes.  I've got two Mustangs, a JMJ which has some neck dive and a Mikey Way which has no neck dive at all. 

[shoulderpet]

58 minutes ago, martthebass said:

Sometimes.  I've got two Mustangs, a JMJ which has some neck dive and a Mikey Way which has no neck dive at all. 

I had a Mikey Way a while ago, really regret getting rid of that bass, sounded fantastic

[therealting]

2 hours ago, martthebass said:

Sometimes.  I've got two Mustangs, a JMJ which has some neck dive and a Mikey Way which has no neck dive at all. 

Ah, and body / neck / tuner weight of course!

[kristo]

If you don’t mind the frets I’ve got some nice upright sounds from Epiphone Archtop basses with floating pickups. Short scale, thick bodied and comfortable to play sitting or standing. I have two, and my backup is for sale on the forum. The other one is a gigging bass and a keeper. 
 

 

Edited May 8, 2020 by kristo

[scrumpymike]

On 06/05/2020 at 11:38, bassbiscuits said:

I wouldn't say short scales have more low end - the opposite is true in my experience (using a Fender Mustang and a Fender P).

 

I would say punch is what you get more of from the extra scale length but the s-s sounds in the lower register are 'thicker'.  Hope you can relate to that - it's all very subjective as, as already pointed out, highly influenced by string choice in terms of gauge and construction.

[scrumpymike]

On 06/05/2020 at 16:41, therealting said:

It really depends on the body shape, mainly if it has long horns or which fret they reach. 

Spot on!  Generally, any s-s bass with the top strap button no higher than F12 balances well.

[scrumpymike]

On 05/05/2020 at 09:06, gypsyjazzer said:

Thanks guys for your info, much appreciated. As I play double bass I am looking to buy a fretless short scale BG---to get as close to the DB sound as possible---so will be looking for a short scale hollow body BG.

Does anybody know who makes the deepest (width) hollow body short scale BG? The bigger the depth of the body the deeper the sound of a BG?

Those of you who play a 5 string bass how often do you use the 5th string (B?) Worth having?

The 'Standard' (i.e. deeper-bodied) version of the Gillett Contour meets those criteria better than anything else I've played but you'd be lucky to pick up a used one for £1500.  It's an electro-acoustic combining a 31.75" scale length with through-body stringing.  Should also declare a personal interest as I did some marketing work for Michael G a while back.