1966 Precision?

[mrn1989]

So this popped up online at a shop I check out regularly.......are the square ends on the fretboard with the overhanging fret at the neck joint legit? It also has an Allen wrench truss today not a Philips style, could this be legit??
 

https://www.badlandsguitars.co.uk/used-gear/used-guitars/

[police squad]

doesn't look right to me. 

[GBH]

Possible truss rod replacement with new fingerboard.

[Sibob]

Definitely a new fingerboard, or at least an excellent job at extending the original, it’s squared off, so no way original at the heel.

Si

[GuyR]

It's a new fingerboard. It would have had a curved thin fingerboard and the whole of the truss rod would have originally been within the maple part of the neck. It appears to have a slab type fingerboard, which is 100% a replacement.

Still looks a nice bass though.

Edited May 9, 2020 by GuyR

[ead]

Here's my '66 for comparison.  Definitely not the same construction.

Edited May 10, 2020 by ead

[Hellzero]

Ok, here we go, apart from the refinish :

the truss rod has been changed (hex screw here),

the fretboard too and is ebony, when it was ordinary rosewood in 1966, the overhanging being the proof, and no clay dots,

the pots are contemporary Japanese ones as is the capacitor,

the ashtray is brand new.

The pickups, bridge and saddles are not photographed...

This is worth £1000 to £1500, not more, in this non original at all condition.

Avoid this !!!

Edited May 10, 2020 by Hellzero

[Steve Browning]

The neck/fingerboard worries me. The overhang of the fingerboard must mean it's longer but there are no additional frets. I am wondering what effect this has on the intonation as I reckon the frets higher up must be in the wrong place. 

[Burns-bass]

The people on this shop are good guys. I’d say this is a lack of information on their part rather than a wilful attempt to deceive.

[police squad]

6 minutes ago, Burns-bass said:

The people on this shop are good guys. I’d say this is a lack of information on their part rather than a wilful attempt to deceive.

agreed

[ead]

5 hours ago, Burns-bass said:

The people on this shop are good guys. I’d say this is a lack of information on their part rather than a wilful attempt to deceive.

Lack of info or lack of knowledge.  They may well be good guys, but this is/was potentially a high value instrument so it does seem to me to be a bit negligent to not have done some homework.

[gareth]

45 minutes ago, ead said:

Lack of info or lack of knowledge.  They may well be good guys, but this is/was potentially a high value instrument so it does seem to me to be a bit negligent to not have done some homework.

These are good guys from whom I have bought 

I think it’s just lack of information rather than bad intent

Anyway still having their contact details I messaged them this 

“

Hi 

You have a 66 p bass for sale 

Some of the guys on basschat are discussing it here

https://www.basschat.co.uk/topic/428655-1966-precision/

As the bass is not original it might be an idea to include some more photos including front body with pick guard off showing control cavity, pups and any extra routing for that third knob and photos of all the pots and wiring and more photos of neck which looks like it’s got a new truss rod and fingerboard

Best wishes”

[BadlandsGuitars]

Hi Guys, it looks like I have been judged, then hung drawn and quartered! The bass came into us a couple of days ago and I detailed the bass as we found it, it is a commission sale and the price is a guide from the owner. I think the comment about it being worth £1,000 is mildly humorous, I would love to buy 1966 Fenders for that kind of money too! At the end of the day it is a 54 year old instrument with a history, it is non original that has been made clear, we are not trying to con anyone or pass it off as something it isn't. It is a beautiful players instrument with great age and mojo, that cannot be faked, nor is a modern re-issue the same thing. We are a small family independent who are very upset at being judged blind, maybe some communication would have been a nicer way to discuss the instrument? As you know if you are looking for that holy grail, mint condition 1966 Fender to hang on the wall you will pay a premium, this is from the current blue book, the official price guide - 

1966

N/A

$6,000

$4,800

$3,900

This is broken down as year, price new (NA) Mint condition $6,000 then declining condition.

Here is a link to a very nice example - https://www.andybaxterbass.com/products/1966-fender-precision-bass-sunburst

So please can we keep things in context and not bad mouth the remaining independent shops as we are loosing music shops by the week, and as I said earlier i feel making contact and discussing sensibly is better than speculation.

Kind regards

Graham, Suzy and Ed

Badlands Guitars, Brighton

[Pow_22]

Agree on two points raised here:-

1) The site doesn't appear to be trying it on.  It is what it is - a players bass

2) Value - around £1500 is about right for a bass with so few original features despite its year.

On a side note, I like the Tom DeLonge sig 6 string they have on the website!

[Hellzero]

@BadlandsGuitars : How can you advertised as original a bass on which the fingerboard and truss rod have been changed for absolutely non period correct parts ?

And all I stated is correct. I wrote a mémoire about vintage instruments and know what I'm talking about as I've been helping people buying the right bass at the right price and also making expertise for insurance companies.

The link you mention comes from a place where they often forget to mention important details.

Somebody I know send them back a "vintage" bass after my expertise, because it wasn't what was described at all.

Here is the Blue Book quote (a highly regarded and well-known quoting that you are using too, but not taking the correct grade into account) for a 1966 Fender Precision Bass. Yours is, according to its condition, around 30% grade, so my quote is definitely correct :

Now, if you don't know how to accurately quote a vintage instrument, simply ask experts, but don't advertise it the way you do, or you'll lose all credibility.

This may seem harsh and direct, but I'm simply fed up by those ads, and especially when it comes from a store as your part of the job is to make sure what you're selling is what you're advertising.

And, when selling vintage instruments, you have to "dismantle" it to photograph each and every part attesting the authenticity. I know, it's a full time job.

Below is the Blue Book grading system explained :

 

[ead]

On 11/05/2020 at 13:58, BadlandsGuitars said:

Hi Guys, it looks like I have been judged, then hung drawn and quartered! The bass came into us a couple of days ago and I detailed the bass as we found it, it is a commission sale and the price is a guide from the owner. I think the comment about it being worth £1,000 is mildly humorous, I would love to buy 1966 Fenders for that kind of money too! At the end of the day it is a 54 year old instrument with a history, it is non original that has been made clear, we are not trying to con anyone or pass it off as something it isn't. It is a beautiful players instrument with great age and mojo, that cannot be faked, nor is a modern re-issue the same thing. We are a small family independent who are very upset at being judged blind, maybe some communication would have been a nicer way to discuss the instrument? As you know if you are looking for that holy grail, mint condition 1966 Fender to hang on the wall you will pay a premium, this is from the current blue book, the official price guide - 

1966

N/A

$6,000

$4,800

$3,900

This is broken down as year, price new (NA) Mint condition $6,000 then declining condition.

Here is a link to a very nice example - https://www.andybaxterbass.com/products/1966-fender-precision-bass-sunburst

So please can we keep things in context and not bad mouth the remaining independent shops as we are loosing music shops by the week, and as I said earlier i feel making contact and discussing sensibly is better than speculation.

Kind regards

Graham, Suzy and Ed

Badlands Guitars, Brighton

Thanks for taking the time to respond.  Whilst I would always buy from a local independent where possible (and indeed bought a bass from one a month or so back) I don't feel that you have been "hung, drawn and quartered" as the various points are all reasonable in respect of the bass itself.  Your advert still makes no mention of the fretboard / trussrod issue and describing it an original neck might possibly be misconstrued by some folks.

I bought my '66 P from the USA with some valuable support from a site member.  I received a pack of 84 pictures with close-up detail down to component level.  Whilst you would be considerably closer I doubt I could walk into your shop and ask you to dismantle the bass so I could see all the bits.

You would appear to have satisfied customers on here which is of course reassuring to forum members.  Commentary on the bass is just our opinion which you might consider or reject, but there are a lot of knowledgeable people on here who I would certainly turn too when my knowledge is lacking.

Edited May 13, 2020 by ead

[Steve Browning]

Ok. Three things (I have been thinking)

1. When did fretless necks first appear? The first showing by Fender was in the 1969 catalogue.

2. If it was a fretless, why do the side markers  coincide with the dots and not the frets (as they do on other Fender fretless basses).

3. A '72 without any kind of overhang.

No accusation of deliberately misleading here (despite this post) but I think these are relevant questions given the explanation for the neck work.