What have you got against slap bass?

[spectoremg]

1 hour ago, dmccombe7 said:

I usually like what this guy does but this for me does nothing. There are moments where its good but generally "slap and pop as many notes as i can and as fast as i can"

This is just an example and certainly not the worst i've heard. All i could find at short notice to show what i was talking about.

From a technical point i guess he's good at what he's trying to do but just not for me. 

 

We've got one Mark King thanks 😒

[Barking Spiders]

Correct me if I'm wrong but I take it for most BCers who aren't fond of slap, Mark King is something approaching the anti-christ of slap bass?🤨

Edited May 16, 2020 by Barking Spiders

[AndyTravis]

I’ve met WP - really lovely bloke.

He’s done really well out of it all - and in Poland seems to do some really lovely soul/funk shows...

He does love to knock a good shed together though 😂

[EMG456]

2 hours ago, AndyTravis said:

It’s alright, it’s been denounced by the band as just “alright”.

Better than yesterday’s idea I sent them 1 met with “I don’t get it”.

Which itself was better than I got when suggesting a change to the part on a session I had been called in to replacing a fairly well known player who shall remain anonymous but had refused to change his strings - "Have you... completely lost your mind?"

[Barking Spiders]

3 hours ago, dmccombe7 said:

I usually like what this guy does but this for me does nothing. There are moments where its good but generally "slap and pop as many notes as i can and as fast as i can"

This is just an example and certainly not the worst i've heard. All i could find at short notice to show what i was talking about.

From a technical point i guess he's good at what he's trying to do but just not for me. 

 

Yep, even as a lover of slap I have to agree with you. This is technically impressive but is essentially musical onanism. 

[Stub Mandrel]

I sometimes think that there's an element of envy in the hatred of 'slap shredders'.

It is true that many YT/music store slappers couldn't hold down a groove if it was beaten into them with a cricket bat.

But slap played well by a good player is great.

It's all about serving the song.

I'm not a very good slap player, in particular I'm not very good at the fast, damped, percussive-only bits. I can play faster fingerstyle... My level just about copes with Can't Stop.

Sometimes just dropping in a couple of 'pops' works well, or a brief passage. For me the key is making sure that other than practising, i stay within my limits.

 

[Bassfinger]

On 15/05/2020 at 07:22, ubit said:

Slap played badly sounds rubbish. Slap played well sounds...

Like well played rubbish?

[AndyTravis]

2 hours ago, Barking Spiders said:

Correct me if I'm wrong but I take it for most BCers who aren't fond of slap, Mark King is something approaching the anti-christ of slap bass?🤨

What I like (love) about MK is the level of skill in other areas which Are completely ignored.

And then he throws a filing cabinet down the stairs and makes me feel 12 again - Giddy, silly and excited to play bass.

And then people slag him off and I chuckle along...all the meantime wanting to engage in a futile row ending in “yeah, but you’re a numpty so ner!”

[dmccombe7]

Altho not a Mark King fan i've heard him play some very melodic slap bass and his traditional finger style is pretty impressive too.

On the other hand i've heard him just play a lot of fast slap with no real meaning to it. That to me is just showing off for the sake of it. MK does some amazing things during a song. When he wanders off into ME, ME, ME solo stuff i get bored with him.

Sadly he can show off far better than i could ever dream off. 

No matter what any bass player does it needs to have feel and groove or its just random hits. 

Dave

[Woodinblack]

19 minutes ago, Stub Mandrel said:

I sometimes think that there's an element of envy in the hatred of 'slap shredders'.

I don't. I think that is one of tropes that people drag out to justify why other people don't like things that maybe they do.

It is perfectly possible to dislike a thing while still appreciating the skill required in performing the thing. Like recurring things, Jaco, Joe satriani, jazz, etc.. in a lot of cases skills that I would kill for doing something I wouldn't want to do.

There is a lot of slap that is very skilled (although I would say not the majority), doesn't mean you have to hate the skill to hate the sound.

[Al Krow]

On 15/05/2020 at 07:22, ubit said:

Slap played badly sounds rubbish. Slap played well sounds great.

48 minutes ago, Bassfinger said:

Slap played badly sounds rubbish. Slap played well sounds...

Like well played rubbish?

Nope, I think ubit got it exactly right.

Slagging off slap is a bit like slagging off punk or jazz or heavy metal or classical or whatever, just 'cos it's not your particular cup of tea.

Fair enough, it's not your cup of tea. Move on.  

Edited May 16, 2020 by Al Krow

[Cuzzie]

4 hours ago, dmccombe7 said:

Whereas i kinda like this one ok. 

Not 100% sure why i like this and not others.

I find this more entertaining.

 

That’s because he is letting the notes breathe more, does some finger style and is wearing wonderfully short shorts

[dmccombe7]

Personally i'm not slagging of Slap in general. I am not a fan of some versions or types of slap. 

I like it in moderation is probably a better description of my taste.

Like jazz or even lead guitarists there are those that think playing lots of fast notes no matter what style you play is a sign of competence. Its not for me if it doesn't have a catch, a tune, a melody to keep me interested.

Dave 

 

[Stub Mandrel]

28 minutes ago, dmccombe7 said:

On the other hand i've heard him just play a lot of fast slap with no real meaning to it. That to me is just showing off for the sake of it. MK does some amazing things during a song. When he wanders off into ME, ME, ME solo stuff i get bored with him.

Yes but he's giving his punters what they want; if they didn't want the pyrotechnics and extended solos I'm sure he'd drop them.

It's a bit like going to see EVH, if he didn't do two handed tapping you'd feel cheated. And if you don't want it, you probably wouldn't go...

[Al Krow]

1 hour ago, dmccombe7 said:

Personally i'm not slagging of Slap in general. I am not a fan of some versions or types of slap. I like it in moderation is probably a better description of my taste.

Like jazz or even lead guitarists there are those that think playing lots of fast notes no matter what style you play is a sign of competence. Its not for me if it doesn't have a catch, a tune, a melody to keep me interested.

Dave 

Dave that's very fair, however bass is part of the rhythm section as well as being a melody instrument. For me, slap is essentially a development of the percussive element of bass as a rhythm instrument. In fact Larry Graham, who is credited with inventing the style when they didn't have a drummer in the band, said that he developed "thumpin'" to make up for the absent kick drum and "pluckin'" to take the place of the missing snare (see clip starting at around 1.17).

Leaving space for the rest of the band to breathe has been mentioned as key to a great slap groove. Absolutely.

 

[dmccombe7]

1 hour ago, Stub Mandrel said:

Yes but he's giving his punters what they want; if they didn't want the pyrotechnics and extended solos I'm sure he'd drop them.

It's a bit like going to see EVH, if he didn't do two handed tapping you'd feel cheated. And if you don't want it, you probably wouldn't go...

EVH plays melodic solos tho.  I know what you are saying. I've been to see bands i like and the solos are pretty boring and not impresive to me but i still go to see the band.

Bit like many drum solos. Only drummers will appreciate it unles its entertaining like Neil Peart.

I enjoy hearing some slap just not overdone but then again i'm not a big fan of any bass solos within a band scenario.

Dave

[dmccombe7]

34 minutes ago, Al Krow said:

 

Leaving space for the rest of the band to breathe has been mentioned as key to a great slap groove. Absolutely.

 

There's the important part and exactly the point i was trying to make

Edited May 16, 2020 by dmccombe7

[Barking Spiders]

I don't think the worst excesses of slapping are to be found on albums but among the ranks of  full-time You Tube merchants. Seem to be  loads of plankspankers of both the 4 and 6 string variety that spend most of their playing time thrapping their strings in front of a laptop in their bedrooms etc rather than making.. erm.. proper music. I see nowt excessive in Mark King's lines in Level 42.  They all drive the songs and all have melodic edges that stick in the memory.

[Cuzzie]

Not sure it’s entirely correct to say Larry Graham invented the style.

Its roots are laid in orchestral music technique Bartok Pizz where the strong payer essentially does the ‘pop’ by plucking the string and allowing it to snap back. I think the first recorded ‘slap’ was a guy called Steve Brown.

Gypsy Jazz uses a slap technique and has done for some time.

Turn of the 20th century Guys like Bill Johnson and Pops Foster are using it.

This is of course all on upright DB.

Move to Electric bass - yes LG is probably the first, then guys like Stanley Clarke adapt it, Bootsy etc. And it comes to today where it is ubiquitous on You tube and guitar shows everywhere

[funkypenguin]

I've nothing against slap, my first bass hero was Mark King  I don't really slap much anymore these days but its a lot of fun to work on from time to time and there are some bassists doing incredible things using slap (Alain Caron and Henrik Linder are two that spring immediately to mind). What I do hate is the Clutterbucks of the bass world slapping incessantly throughout the duration of a trade show about a thousand DB louder the anyone else around them. The last bass show I went to was the last bass day in Manchester and my ears were bleeding after being around the trade stands.

[Burns-bass]

5 hours ago, Barking Spiders said:

Yep, even as a lover of slap I have to agree with you. This is technically impressive but is essentially musical onanism. 

It looks like he’s at a bass show or something so he’s being paid to show off like that. It’s about generating a crowd for the stand (which he does really well!).

[Doctor J]

Eddie Van Halen is an accomplished and tasteful guitarist, an innovator like Larry Graham. The problem is not the innovator nor the technique, but those who follow and think more=better... 

Tap isn’t the problem, it’s tappers.

 

And slap isn’t the problem either, it’s slappers (the other kind 😁)

[AndyTravis]

15 minutes ago, Doctor J said:

Eddie Van Halen is an accomplished and tasteful guitarist, an innovator like Larry Graham. The problem is not the innovator nor the technique, but those who follow and think more=better... 

Tap isn’t the problem, it’s tappers.

 

And slap isn’t the problem either, it’s slappers (the other kind 😁)

Nail➡️Head

[StickyDBRmf]

Not logged on for a week, and there's NINE PAGES OF SLAP. Haha. And I had to read it all so my opinion would be INFORMED. Notice how I CAPITALIZE to EMPHASIZE. And being a chef (bass playing didn't pay the bills) I appreciate scalpy & the vinegar analogy and R.Jinman "watching popcorn in a microwave". But, THAT'S IT! It's the FIRST kernel that POPS and the waiting the 3 seconds for the LAST kernel to POP that gets me going. My culinary analogy is it's like black pepper. A little wakes it up, too early in the recipe (and too much) and it's acrid. I learned it (70's) I used it, I don't any more (more of a refined tapping/pinging of the strings when harmonic or percussive emphasis is desired)...but I play the Stick more often. So when I pick up a bass, weird techniques pop out. And when I DO a pop. Or a slap. Everyone smiles. I don't know it's like balloon animals

[spectoremg]

One of my favourite bass albums is Travelling Without Moving by Jamiroqui with Stuart Zender. Mostly finger style but his slapping is subtle and tasteful.