Trussrod Replacement

[stewblack]

2 hours ago, BigRedX said:

I don't understand how neck bow can be fixed with a shim...

I bought it many moons ago and didn't understand a word he said. It is therefore possible I'm misquoting him.

Apologies if that was unclear.

[stewblack]

1 hour ago, BigRedX said:

A photo of the back showing where the neck joins would be useful.

OK, but it won't show a join of any sort it's all painted

 

[BigRedX]

1 hour ago, stewblack said:

OK, but it won't show a join of any sort it's all painted

 

But if the neck/thru body was starting to fold up at the pickup route then you would be able to see the centre section of the body coming away from the wings irrespective of whether it's been painted or not.

[Jabba_the_gut]

There are typically two types of truss rod; single action and double action. Depending on the type might determine whether the thread should rotate or not.

It might make a difference as to whether this could be solved without taking the fretboard off.

 I’ll try and find a couple of pictures to explain this and post them later.

Cheers

[stewblack]

[Bridgehouse]

This thread has brought back some baaaaaaaaad memories 

[stewblack]

2 minutes ago, Bridgehouse said:

This thread has brought back some baaaaaaaaad memories 

I was quite looking forward to it. Nothing to lose and all that. 

[prowla]

1 hour ago, stewblack said:

That looks good to me!

So, we're back to the bass being worth doing the truss rod.

[stewblack]

32 minutes ago, prowla said:

That looks good to me!

So, we're back to the bass being worth doing the truss rod.

So can I get the scalpel out then? 

[Jabba_the_gut]

A couple of random pictures from the web of typical truss rods. Apologies if I'm posting something that everyone already knows.

This is a single action truss rod

This type will only tighten to counteract the force created by the string tension. One end is fixed typically in the heel of the neck and the other has a nut and washer on it. As the rod is fixed it doesn't turn but tightening the nut applies tension.

This is a double action truss rod

This type has a fixed beam with a couple of threaded blocks on that are welded to the beam. The threads are opposite hands so when you turn the threaded rod it becomes longer or shorter than the fixed beam so bends and can apply pressure with the strings or against them.

I don't know what type of rod your bass has in it but the first impression would be a single acting rod with the nut and washer missing - I might well be wrong though!! Be interesting to see what others think.

Edited May 12, 2020 by Jabba_the_gut

[stewblack]

Single action. Thanks Jabba.

[Jabba_the_gut]

6 minutes ago, stewblack said:

Single action. Thanks Jabba.

If that is the case and if it looks like the diagram there might be a chance to remove some wood around the rod so there is enough to get a nut and washer on. 

If, if.....never tried it myself though!!!

[prowla]

 

[Jabba_the_gut]

That's a really handy tool but not cheap!! 

[stewblack]

55 minutes ago, Jabba_the_gut said:

If that is the case and if it looks like the diagram there might be a chance to remove some wood around the rod so there is enough to get a nut and washer on. 

If, if.....never tried it myself though!!!

I've already done this and it sheared the end off.

[stewblack]

Watched a ton of videos on this, thought I'd share just one I stumbled across. It's not hugely relevant in this particular case, but I feel the guy explains stuff lucidly and I wanted to make others aware of his channel.

 

[Andyjr1515]

I've taken a fretboard off a couple of times.  It takes care and patience but it's possible to do.  I should have some  photos somewhere.  I'll post something in the morning with some hints and tips

[prowla]

I guess one thing is to make sure you have the correct clamps and padding for when you glue it back together.

(Plus the right glue, I suppose!)

[BreadBin]

I have loads of clamps and a bottle of Titebond here 👍

[Andyjr1515]

OK @stewblack  Found the pics

First the standard disclaimer:  this is a risky process and so only do it if the bass has no high monetary value and if it is otherwise unplayable anyway

For taking the fretboard off, you need:

- A hot iron - household iron is fine.  If it's a steam iron then run it dry.  Hot setting

- Some kitchen roll

- A Stanley knife blade or other very thin sharp blade

- A thin steel platter of some kind.  Worst case a wide but thin steel rule, but a pie spatula or similar (very thin flexible steel) is better

 

This example below is a fretless board, but I've removed a fretted board in exactly the same way

 

1. Take the nut off and start at the nut end.  Get the iron hot and heat up the area of fretboard before the 1st fret.  Protect the fretboard with a sheet of kitchen roll or similar.  I use an old heat shrink iron but household iron is fine:

You need to get the wood very hot - hot enough for the glue underneath to soften

2.  Take your Stanley blade (the single edged razors here are even better.  Don't use two sided razor blades - you WILL cut yourself badly ) and ease it under as the glue softens.  If it doesn't enter the gap at all, then the glue is still hard.  Work on this until you are able to insert the blade across the whole width of the board at the nut end.  This bit can easily take half an hour.  If after half an hour there is still no way the blade is going in at all then either the iron isn't hot enough or the board has been (rare but not unknown) epoxied on.  In the former case, turn the iron on even higher if it will.  In the latter case, hang the bass back on the wall :

 

3.  Ease your steel platter/ruler into the gap (a couple of mm will do)and carry on heating that area, walking the platter forward a mm at a time.  Keep it flat at all times.  DO NOT lever it up at any stage - this will almost always snap the fretboard - especially a fretted board.  Again, nowadays I use a steel flexi sheet from my acoustic sides bending stuff, but first couple I did I used a metal ruler:

4.  Carry on,  mm by mm all the way up to the end.  When you are an inch or so from the end - and this might be an hour or so later! - don't get over enthusiastic and try and pull the last bit off - you WILL break the board.  Just carry on mm by mm until it is off

 

I'll cover getting it back on in a bit.  But you will need lots of decent screw clamps and some decent blocks of wood as clamping cauls and a bottle of Titebond.

[Reggaebass]

Would the fretboard inlays need to be protected so the heat doesn’t lift them, or would they be ok 

[Maude]

14 minutes ago, Reggaebass said:

Would the fretboard inlays need to be protected so the heat doesn’t lift them, or would they be ok 

That's a good point, and one I hadn't considered when I suggested all this madness to Stew 😆, he's got crushed pearl triangular inlays to worry about. I'm not sure what they are made of being a late seventies bass, but some kind of epoxy resin I'd guess. 

[Reggaebass]

37 minutes ago, Maude said:

but some kind of epoxy resin I'd guess. 

That’s what I was thinking, would the heat not melt them, maybe cut some heat protecting pads to go over them 

[stewblack]

Thank you everyone, especially @Andyjr1515without your post I would have snapped the fretboard within the first half an hour, if not sooner. 

[Andyjr1515]

1 hour ago, Maude said:

That's a good point, and one I hadn't considered when I suggested all this madness to Stew 😆, he's got crushed pearl triangular inlays to worry about. I'm not sure what they are made of being a late seventies bass, but some kind of epoxy resin I'd guess. 

 

55 minutes ago, Reggaebass said:

That’s what I was thinking, would the heat not melt them 

Good points and yes - it might.  As might the side binding, which will definitely be plastic, and also the varnish on the fretboard which may or may not be heat sensitive.  There's really no way of knowing.  The kitchen roll tempers a few of the hot spots and much of the heat will be transferred through the frets (and yes) but it's still going to get mighty hot.  

But as @stewblack says, he believes he has run out of options relating to recutting the thread (and I think he is probably right) and therefore the alternative is probably to hang it back on the wall.   

There is another way some folks do it - they plane off the fretboard and put a new one on...but that definitely WILL damage the inlays  

 

It boils down to my disclaimer that this is a risky process and to only do it if the bass has no high monetary value and if it is otherwise unplayable anyway.  And we haven't got to all the things you need to do and could go wrong gluing it back on yet!