American Professional Prices Compared to Player

[thegummy]

The American Professional models are clearly better than the equivalent Player model and has a lot of little things making it better.

But the price difference is just mind blowing, it's like three times the price. It's not that I'm against paying that much for a bass, it's just that it's so much extra money when the products are so similar at core.

Is there anyone who finds the extra money reasonable for the extras you get and could fill me in on what I'm overlooking?

Obviously there is the fact that American labour is more expensive than Mexican but, as that doesn't benefit the buyer any, I'm wondering how much of the extra money is due to that.

[Burns-bass]

Personally, I found the Player series to be great basses but everything is better on the US models. All hardware on the US models is spot on, the pickups are fantastic, finish is better and it’s lighter too. Oh, and it comes with a superb moulded case too.

Player series basses are amazing and the equivalent of an older US standard but the new US basses are of a whole different order. 

Music shops open now. Go and give one a go!

[Dov65]

Just picked up a new to me Flea at the weekend, it's the dearest Fender i've ever played and it is flawless. The neck has some birds eye running through it and the finish is superb (satin inca silver) a G&G case with strap locks, cerificate and the allen keys presented in a Fender bag gives it the finishing touch. 

[Lozz196]

The Professionals are better, but not sure if nearly £1000 better. You can get better tuners/replacement pickups/bridge for £300 - at that point the only thing you can’t do is graphite rods in the neck. I’d buy a Professional used, but not new.

[Eldon Tyrell]

5 hours ago, Burns-bass said:

Music shops open now. Go and give one a go!

I agree. You have to check them out in a store, side by side and then go for one or the other. Only then you will know whether or not the US model is worth the extra money for you. For me personally, the feel of the neck is the most important criterion. It either feels right or it does not. In the past, I bought basses and told myself that I would get used to the neck but that did not happen and I sold these basses (including a 2018 Professional P bass that has a 63 neck, which I did not like). All the other things (tuners, bridge, pickups) can be replaced easier than the neck. 

[Burns-bass]

52 minutes ago, Lozz196 said:

The Professionals are better, but not sure if nearly £1000 better. You can get better tuners/replacement pickups/bridge for £300 - at that point the only thing you can’t do is graphite rods in the neck. I’d buy a Professional used, but not new.

My US professional bass was about £900 more expensive than the Player Series bass I bought (both new) and I'm confident at saying it's the best Fender bass I've played in years, if not ever. 

Obviously, it's personal preference, but I've had them all, pre-CBS, 60s ones, 70s ones, 80s ones and up to the present day and this thing is exquisitely made. Plus the case is great too. 

I bought a FSR run model, which apparently is a limited run model at a knock down price, and perhaps the standard ones aren't as good (I can't compare). 

I've used it for gigs and recordings, and it's just beautiful. But if you want a perfectly perfect bas, then the Player Series is ideal I'm sure. I should say I bought these all from shops where I played them through different amps, so was able to choose what I consider a good one. I'm certain there are dodgy ones out there, like all production instruments.

[gjones]

I played the Mex Deluxe Precision and really liked it. I ended up buying the USA Elite Precision at £1,000 more (I was flush at the time and had never owned a USA bass before). It's a lovely bass but not really any better than the Mex version. Both are great and incredibly versatile.

[thegummy]

On 24/06/2020 at 07:34, Burns-bass said:

Oh, and it comes with a superb moulded case too.

Seeing the case as an added bonus is one way to look at it.

I see it more as a shame that the Am Pro model only comes as a bundle with the case; i.e. they will have added the cost of the case in to the total price and, as I already have a very good gig bag and a very good hard case, would be paying that extra for something I don't want.

[thegummy]

On 24/06/2020 at 13:06, Lozz196 said:

The Professionals are better, but not sure if nearly £1000 better. You can get better tuners/replacement pickups/bridge for £300 - at that point the only thing you can’t do is graphite rods in the neck. I’d buy a Professional used, but not new.

Aye that is one of the main things that jumped out at me on the specs - something that can't just be bought separately and added in.

On the other hand though, while on paper it is definitely an improvement versus not having the graphite rode, but with most basses not having them and there not really being any problems - as far as I'm aware all the sought-after vintage basses don't have this - I wonder if it's almost a redundant upgrade fixing a problem that isn't really a problem?

Maybe I'm mistaken about its purpose, is it to stop the neck bowing as much with temperature and time etc.?

[thegummy]

On 24/06/2020 at 13:32, Eldon Tyrell said:

I agree. You have to check them out in a store, side by side and then go for one or the other. Only then you will know whether or not the US model is worth the extra money for you. For me personally, the feel of the neck is the most important criterion. It either feels right or it does not. In the past, I bought basses and told myself that I would get used to the neck but that did not happen and I sold these basses (including a 2018 Professional P bass that has a 63 neck, which I did not like). All the other things (tuners, bridge, pickups) can be replaced easier than the neck. 

That is what I did with a Strat I bought last year - I went to the shop and tried the Player and Pro side by side and didn't actually like either neck so ended up getting the Player then ordering one of the old American Standard necks online and swapped it.

I will definitely try both the basses out too when the shops open again but I believe that judging them in a shop like that is only part of the decision process, I wouldn't make my whole decision based on that. There will be things I don't notice at the time (once bought a Gibson that seemed great in the shop only to then find some bad wood problems after playing it for a lot longer at home after a week or two).

The tuners on the Professional seem very appealing to me, I love the idea of them being tapered to force the strings down. They can be purchased separately though. The pickups don't really come in to it much for me, there's a chance I'd change either.

I think one of the main things I wish I knew is something that is a bit of a mystery to the general public and something a lot of people make very different guesses about, and that's whether the actual pieces of wood that make the body and the neck are any higher quality on the American Professional. I've heard people say they believe they are and I've heard the opposite but I've never really heard from a definite reliable source which is true. I'd guess that even if they're no different, Fender would like there to be the belief that there is.

I think if I take the price of the American Pro, take away what the case would cost, take away the extra labour cost for it being American made and take away something for the prestige that people will pay for American then I can compare that to the price of the Player and have a more realistic comparison. That way I can decide if the real differences are worth paying all the extra for.

[la bam]

I've just got a player today. The comparison to the old usa standard is spot on. I had a 1995ish usa standard and this feels pretty much the same in build quality, finish and looks. The standard (if I remember correctly) was slightly heavier and thicker neck, but the quality and attention to detail is at first look the same.

Personally i couldnt justify the extra £1000 for the new US but I can understand why some people would.

I had a fsr Japanese black and gold precision which was lovely, but I'd say the finish and build is better on the player. Just feels more substantial. Whereas the Japanese fsr was a high quality machine, but lighter to hold.

Glad to hear fender have upped their game all round.

[thegummy]

9 minutes ago, la bam said:

I've just got a player today. The comparison to the old usa standard is spot on. I had a 1995ish usa standard and this feels pretty much the same in build quality, finish and looks. The standard (if I remember correctly) was slightly heavier and thicker neck, but the quality and attention to detail is at first look the same.

Personally i couldnt justify the extra £1000 for the new US but I can understand why some people would.

I had a fsr Japanese black and gold precision which was lovely, but I'd say the finish and build is better on the player. Just feels more substantial. Whereas the Japanese fsr was a high quality machine, but lighter to hold.

Glad to hear fender have upped their game all round.

If the Player is like an American Standard then that's mind blowing value.

I know that on guitars, one big difference between the American models and the Mexican models (the Professional, Player and respective Standards all included) is that the American ones have the edges of the fingerboard rounded while the Mexicans don't. Is it the same for the basses?

I don't think it really bothers me on bass much since I hold a bass neck in a different way than I hold a guitar neck when playing chords; for guitars I just don't like the non-rounded edges and would (and do) pay a lot extra even just for that difference.

One thing I should have mentioned is that if I go for a Player it will be a maple fingerboard I go for. I know that a big difference between the two is that the other option for fingerboards is rosewood on the Pro and pau ferro on the Player and I personally don't like the colour of the latter so would be going maple which takes away that difference.

[la bam]

I think US standard just had normal frets (not rounded) that was approx a 95 model. I have them on my Sire v7 and they're nice to play. It looks like the player ones are just normal flat frets.

[uk_lefty]

The whole thing on cases is interesting to read this morning because I was discussing it yesterday with one of my wife's family! I think for the amount of money you're paying for a bass of the quality of a US Fender you absolutely should be getting a decent case, the tools and all the trimmings. If you don't want the case you could make 100 quid selling it I guess, but to me a premium product needs to come with all the stuff. I'd be peeved at that much money being handed over and then "what's that sir? A case sir? You expected a case did you sir? Well the sh!tty ships own ones are 30 quid but if you want one for that bass it's 200 quid, please". I get the point that you could trim some money off if the case didn't come as part of the bundle but then it all gets a bit Ryanair if the pricing is so transparent you're paying a tenner for your truss rod adjuster, etc. And you could get loads of punters asking "can't you just throw in a case/ new strings / a tuner". Also, with my Stingray I've kept everything together, makes it a bit more complete of I hand it on to my kids in future, more than just a well used bass it's a whole package with the case and all the case stuff, I just think it shows the off the quality a bit more. 

Just my opinion, and I fully understand why people disagree... 

How it came up in convo yesterday? My wife's relative makes luxury cat trees and was debating whether to include shipping in the price or charge extra... We agreed it was better to include it in the price. 

[thegummy]

What you're saying still just comes down to seeing the case as an added extra vs seeing it as a bundle (which is the reality).

You'd be annoyed if it didn't come with a case because that would mean the guitar itself was even more expensive. But if it wasn't bundled with the case then it would be cheaper and you could buy the case if you wanted one.

The idea of it leading to other things not being included like the truss rod adjuster is the slippery slope fallacy. And there are already fender models that don't come with a case but of course do come with an allen key for the truss rod.

The comparison to the shipping is a different story - if the person only offers shipping then no one can just choose not to have that, they have to get it shipped, it's not an optional extra. If they also allow the customer to pick it up then they're ripping those customers off cause they're not even getting it despite paying for it.

In short, it's just whether you see the guitar itself as being that price and the case being a free extra (what fender wants you to think) or whether you see the reality that everyone is paying for that case whether they want it or not.

I don't see how anyone who understands they're paying for the case would think it's a good thing for it to be bundled because if it wasn't and they wanted it they could just buy it and the people who don't want it don't have to.

[skej21]

If you're actually interested in the differences, they are as follows;

Spec	Player	Professional
Body Finish	Gloss Polyester	Gloss Polyurethane
Neck Shape	Modern "C"	"1963 C"
Fingerboard Material	Pau Ferro	Rosewood
Nut Material	Synthetic Bone	Bone
Fret Size	Medium Jumbo	Narrow Tail
Truss Rod	Standard	Posiflex Graphite Rods
Pickup	Player Series Alnico 5 Split Single-Coil Precision Bass®	V-Mod Split Single-Coil Precision Bass®
Bridge	4-Saddle Standard	4-Saddle HiMass™ Vintage (String-Through-Body or Topload)
Tuning Machines	Standard Open-Gear	Fender® Lightweight Vintage-Style Keys with Tapered Shafts
Strings	Fender USA 7250M Nickel Plated Steel	Fender USA 7250M Nickel Plated Steel
Cases/Gig bag	None	Elite Molded Case

Personally, i can see the pickup, the hardware and the fingerboard wood having a significant impact on the cost of the instrument itself, so even without the case (whether you want it or not aside), is justifiably more expensive. Whether it is £1000 more expensive is a different story...

I do however, agree with @uk_lefty. Even if Fender sold the bass without a case, it'd still be £1,300ish and for that price i think a majority of potential buyers would look to another manufacturer immediately if a decent hardcase wasn't included!

[la bam]

7 minutes ago, skej21 said:

Personally, i can see the pickup, the hardware and the fingerboard wood having a significant impact on the cost of the instrument itself 

Usually I'd agree, but the pick ups in the player in particular are very usa precision sounding to me. That's what really surprised me.

[uk_lefty]

32 minutes ago, thegummy said:

don't see how anyone who understands they're paying for the case would think it's a good thing for it to be bundled because if it wasn't and they wanted it they could just buy it and the people who don't want it don't have to

I do understand where you're coming from, and if it was about the Squier range or MIM range I'd be agreeing because of the proportion of the total cost that the case would make up, it would be a big difference to add or remove it. I'm just saying it's a premium product so I'd personally expect it. But maybe if you didn't want it you could do a deal with the shop for them to sell it as separate and knock off some cash for you, or flog it on here or ebay. Luckily it's a decent quality case and not just a tatty gig bag. 

Anyway, Mex vs US? I'm considering a Player Jazz soon but would only be able to compare it to MIJ having never had the luxury of owning a US Fender and from what I'm reading here I think I'd save the 1000 myself. 

[skej21]

18 minutes ago, la bam said:

Usually I'd agree, but the pick ups in the player in particular are very usa precision sounding to me. That's what really surprised me.

Oh, don't get me wrong I don't mean in terms of "quality" i mean in terms of cost. Fender charge £80-100 for the V-Mod split coil and about £80 for the Yosemite (Alnico 5), so only a slight increase in cost, but still there!

[grenadillabama]

I PLAYED THE AP PERFORMER PRECISION THIS WEEK AT THE LOCAL STORE. I HAD PREVIOUSLY SEEN A PHOTO OF DUSTY HILL (ZZ TOP) SIGHTING DOWN THE EDGE OF THE FINGERBOARD SO I LOOKED AT IT FIRST. THE NECK HAD MORE CURVE ON ONE EDGE THAN THE OTHER. SO IT PLAYED LIKE A TWISTED NECK WITH HIGH ACTION. IT DID SOUND VERY CRISP ON TOP THROUGH A TRAYNOR 200 WITH 4 KT-88 TUBES !!!! HEY- THIS AMP BEAT MY OLD MARSHALL MAJOR ! THE SALES GUY WENT ON ABOUT AMERICAN QUALITY AND I LET HIM SPEAK HIS PEACE. THE  ENSENADA, MEXICO PRECISION WAS (IN THIS VISIT) BETTER. HARD CASE -$ 100

[uk_lefty]

1 hour ago, thegummy said:

The comparison to the shipping is a different story - if the person only offers shipping then no one can just choose not to have that, they have to get it shipped, it's not an optional extra. If they also allow the customer to pick it up then they're ripping those customers off cause they're not even getting it despite paying for it

Depends how the product is costed though doesn't it and what assumptions are made over how many want shipping vs how many don't. Maybe she loses out every time she ships? But you don't know that your default is to resort to talk of being ripped off without thinking. 

[Lozz196]

1 hour ago, la bam said:

Usually I'd agree, but the pick ups in the player in particular are very usa precision sounding to me. That's what really surprised me.

Yes, agree, I fully expected to have to change them in mine but found they were more than up to the job. In past MIMs I found them a tad harsh but not on the Player.

[skej21]

1 hour ago, uk_lefty said:

Depends how the product is costed though doesn't it and what assumptions are made over how many want shipping vs how many don't. Maybe she loses out every time she ships? But you don't know that your default is to resort to talk of being ripped off without thinking. 

There’s no pleasing some people. It’s like complaining your new car comes with tyres as part of a ‘bundle’ when 1 in 50 customers kept a perfectly good set in the garage from the old car...

[uk_lefty]

34 minutes ago, skej21 said:

There’s no pleasing some people. It’s like complaining your new car comes with tyres as part of a ‘bundle’ when 1 in 50 customers kept a perfectly good set in the garage from the old car...

Indeed. Why buy a bass when there's trees all along my road? Charging for wood is a rip off. 

[skej21]

9 minutes ago, uk_lefty said:

Indeed. Why buy a bass when there's trees all along my road? Charging for wood is a rip off. 

“Can I buy this new bass without strings, I’m just going to swap them for flats anyway so....”