shoulderpet Posted August 30, 2020 Share Posted August 30, 2020 I know, I know , Obvious but I was listening to this track but Flotsam and Jetsam with Newsted on the bass and ok the bass could be a touch louder (but still much more prominent than he was mixed through most of his career with Metallica) but the bass playing is fantastic, great playing and tone. His playing never sounded as good with Metallica which really makes me realise how much they were stifling him creatively, oddly he never seems to be mentioned in the same breath Frank Bello or David Ellefson but he is skilled, without a doubt [Youtube] 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Drax Posted August 30, 2020 Share Posted August 30, 2020 (edited) The best musician in Metallica has always been the bass player. Interesting you mention Bello as always feel he’s the overlooked one. Edited August 30, 2020 by Drax 5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shoulderpet Posted August 30, 2020 Author Share Posted August 30, 2020 52 minutes ago, Drax said: The best musician in Metallica has always been the bass player. Interesting you mention Bello as always feel he’s the overlooked one. Thats interesting, I have heard many people praise his playing especially the bass part for Caught in a mosh, also interesting is that when I listened to the youtube vid i posted I was struck by how similar to Frank Bello the tone is, not dead on but definitely a similarity there 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
No. 8 Wire Posted August 30, 2020 Share Posted August 30, 2020 2 minutes ago, shoulderpet said: Thats interesting, I have heard many people praise his playing especially the bass part for Caught in a mosh, also interesting is that when I listened to the youtube vid i posted I was struck by how similar to Frank Bello the tone is, not dead on but definitely a similarity there Frank Bello mostly plays fingerstyle though doesn't he? Although I do know he plays pick it the song needs it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
No. 8 Wire Posted August 30, 2020 Share Posted August 30, 2020 1 hour ago, shoulderpet said: I know, I know , Obvious but I was listening to this track but Flotsam and Jetsam with Newsted on the bass and ok the bass could be a touch louder (but still much more prominent than he was mixed through most of his career with Metallica) but the bass playing is fantastic, great playing and tone. His playing never sounded as good with Metallica which really makes me realise how much they were stifling him creatively, oddly he never seems to be mentioned in the same breath Frank Bello or David Ellefson but he is skilled, without a doubt [Youtube] I think it's the creativity that is the difference. Ellefson and Bello (and Burton) are responsible for some iconic basslines, Newstead... not really. Maybe not his fault, but that's the way it is. I was thinking the other day about the other new boy in Metallica, Hammett. He pretty much always gets derided but many of his solos up to the black album are iconic too. If you could cut off their careers in 1989 they'd all be legends! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Black Coffee Posted August 30, 2020 Share Posted August 30, 2020 So sad the bass sound was rubbed out in the justice recordings when the bass would have put the depth in the songs that was so painfully obviously absent. Ive been a Metallica fan for decades but it seems that the loss of Cliff (genius bass player imho) has never really been put behind them. Ive seen them live only once and Mr Trujillo bosses the bass, but I can’t help but wonder what may have been had that bus not flipped. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shoulderpet Posted August 30, 2020 Author Share Posted August 30, 2020 (edited) 12 minutes ago, No. 8 Wire said: I think it's the creativity that is the difference. Ellefson and Bello (and Burton) are responsible for some iconic basslines, Newstead... not really. Maybe not his fault, but that's the way it is. I was thinking the other day about the other new boy in Metallica, Hammett. He pretty much always gets derided but many of his solos up to the black album are iconic too. If you could cut off their careers in 1989 they'd all be legends! Yeah I think with Newsted it was because he was creatively stifled in Metallica, a good example the song My friend of misery, Jason came in with the idea and wanted to have it as an instrumental solo piece and Hetfield basically said b*llo*ks to that and demanded to turn it into a song with lyrics,his moment to shine on the album after the fiasco of And justice for all where he was mixed out of the album and he was robbed of it, granted it came out ok but it would have been nice to have heard both versions on the album Edited August 30, 2020 by shoulderpet 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shoulderpet Posted August 30, 2020 Author Share Posted August 30, 2020 (edited) 24 minutes ago, Black Coffee said: So sad the bass sound was rubbed out in the justice recordings when the bass would have put the depth in the songs that was so painfully obviously absent. Ive been a Metallica fan for decades but it seems that the loss of Cliff (genius bass player imho) has never really been put behind them. Ive seen them live only once and Mr Trujillo bosses the bass, but I can’t help but wonder what may have been had that bus not flipped. I mean no disrespect to Trujillo , he has ability I can only dream of having and his right hand attach is deadly but although he is a great player he has always seemed like a hired gun in Metallica , to clarify what I mean he seems like the kind of player that could play circles round the others but decides not to rock the boat so as not to damage the other peoples ego's , again I mean no disrespect Edited August 30, 2020 by shoulderpet 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MacDaddy Posted August 30, 2020 Share Posted August 30, 2020 41 minutes ago, Black Coffee said: So sad the bass sound was rubbed out in the justice recordings when the bass would have put the depth in the songs that was so painfully obviously absent. There is a re-mixed version somewhere on the interweb, with the bass. Others may be able to be more specific? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thebigyin Posted August 30, 2020 Share Posted August 30, 2020 25 minutes ago, shoulderpet said: I mean no disrespect to Trujillo , he has ability I can only dream of having and his right hand attach is deadly but although he is a great player he has always seemed like a hired gun in Metallica , to clarify what I mean he seems like the kind of player that could play circles round the others but decides not to rock the boat so as not to damage the other peoples ego's , again I mean no disrespect Why Rock the Boat when your earning millions of dollars. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shoulderpet Posted August 30, 2020 Author Share Posted August 30, 2020 11 minutes ago, MacDaddy said: There is a re-mixed version somewhere on the interweb, with the bass. Others may be able to be more specific? Theres a few remixes on Youtube, this is one of my favourite ones, this guy does good remixes [Youtube] 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shoulderpet Posted August 30, 2020 Author Share Posted August 30, 2020 1 minute ago, thebigyin said: Why Rock the Boat when your earning millions of dollars. True, I suspect his willingness to not rock the boat was as important to them as his abilities Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stu_g Posted August 30, 2020 Share Posted August 30, 2020 I remember buying the $5.98 EP when Newsted had joined and i love the bass sound on that and it was all recorded and mixed in 5 days or something. bought justice for all and i was so dissapointed in the mix it sounded so lame to me,i think they must have disappeared up there own bums when they mixed that one. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shoulderpet Posted August 30, 2020 Author Share Posted August 30, 2020 (edited) 6 minutes ago, stu_g said: I remember buying the $5.98 EP when Newsted had joined and i love the bass sound on that and it was all recorded and mixed in 5 days or something. bought justice for all and i was so dissapointed in the mix it sounded so lame to me,i think they must have disappeared up there own bums when they mixed that one. Honestly I think Metallica should leave the mixing engineering etc to someone else instead of getting so involved, there involvement in the process gave us the bassless AJFA, the horrible drum sound on AJFA, the dreadfull boomy guitar tone on AJFA, the way too loud (and horrible sounding) drums on AJFA and that awful snare sound on St Anger, honestly they may be able to play but Metallica have not got a clue about what actually sounds good Edited August 30, 2020 by shoulderpet Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Barking Spiders Posted August 30, 2020 Share Posted August 30, 2020 That's the problem being brought into a band run by giant egos. They don't want anyone else to outshine them. Just ask Michael Anthony. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nail Soup Posted August 30, 2020 Share Posted August 30, 2020 Not an expert/fan of Metallica, but from what I can gather Jason's issues in Metallica had nothing to with any lack of ability as a player. Seems like like some kind of in-group bullying ☹️. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Black Coffee Posted August 30, 2020 Share Posted August 30, 2020 18 minutes ago, Nail Soup said: Not an expert/fan of Metallica, but from what I can gather Jason's issues in Metallica had nothing to with any lack of ability as a player. Seems like like some kind of in-group bullying ☹️. Having watched some coverage about the period of the band when JN was just through the door I though he did well to not lose the rag with the stick about “Jizz on you ‘stead” and the way JH and LU kept saying “how do you know when the bass is too loud? You can hear it”. At the end of the day it’s all ancient history now, and JN is an accomplished player who was the right man at the right time to put up with the angst and frustration in the band at the time and he was there through it. Cliff Burton was a genius and was more to do with Metallica’s early sound than most would give him credit for. The one time I saw them they were a class act and they played a stack of oldies which imho sounded better than most of the newer material. My elder son was only 12 and was at the gig too with me and he loved it. Good night of music. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Graham Posted August 30, 2020 Share Posted August 30, 2020 It must've been heartbreaking for Newsted hearing the mix for Justice the first time, opened with a song he wrote, only for his playing to be completely absent on the recording. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shoulderpet Posted August 30, 2020 Author Share Posted August 30, 2020 3 minutes ago, Graham said: It must've been heartbreaking for Newsted hearing the mix for Justice the first time, opened with a song he wrote, only for his playing to be completely absent on the recording. Yeah, hows that for gratitude for writing one of the best songs on the album Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Black Coffee Posted August 30, 2020 Share Posted August 30, 2020 (edited) Would I put up my bass being absent on my debut album to play on one of the hottest shows in town tour after tour ? probably would have found a way to deal with it. Their cunning stunts dvd was not hiding the bass and it was excellent. JN was popular with the fans too. Always appears to give 100% Edited August 31, 2020 by Black Coffee Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fretmeister Posted August 30, 2020 Share Posted August 30, 2020 (edited) 4 hours ago, MacDaddy said: There is a re-mixed version somewhere on the interweb, with the bass. Others may be able to be more specific? Best one I’ve found. Edited August 30, 2020 by fretmeister 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fretmeister Posted August 30, 2020 Share Posted August 30, 2020 4 hours ago, Black Coffee said: So sad the bass sound was rubbed out in the justice recordings when the bass would have put the depth in the songs that was so painfully obviously absent. Ive been a Metallica fan for decades but it seems that the loss of Cliff (genius bass player imho) has never really been put behind them. Ive seen them live only once and Mr Trujillo bosses the bass, but I can’t help but wonder what may have been had that bus not flipped. I suspect the music would have been more interesting and yet less commercially successful. I can’t see Burton fitting on The Black Album. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cuzzie Posted August 30, 2020 Share Posted August 30, 2020 Jason’s a great bassist. Metallica hit on a style at the right time and it went nuts, they stick to the formula, and why not?! I remember my mates going to the snake pit tour when we were at school and declared Metallica the greatest band ever. A few weeks later I persuaded them to come with me to Alice In Chains in the Dirt and Facelift albums era - they dropped Metallica like a hot potato. Trujillo is supremely talented, apparently when he got the gig an instant cool million dollars went into his account - good on him, he deserves it, Infectious grooves was a very cool band. He kept this talent asleep till he was firmly on the mix, and does make the others look a little stodgy..... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fretmeister Posted August 30, 2020 Share Posted August 30, 2020 The million dollars bit is on film in “Some kind of monster” It was an advance on future earnings rather than a gift. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cuzzie Posted August 30, 2020 Share Posted August 30, 2020 I get your point - I certainly didn’t think of it as a gift - he works for it Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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