Closest tone to '51 Precision

[Beedster]

Folks

Looking at a nice new musical venture and something I've been wanting to do with the guys in question for a while. Kind of a tribute act, but perhaps more of a 'various songs in the style of' band really. Ideally I'd be looking at a 51' to emulate the rather special tone the bassist gets, which having listened at length, really is quite different to the tone of my Precision, even when it's driven to hell through my SVT-II. So if I want that gnarly '51 single-coil tone, without buying a '51, what's the most likely contender? I'm guessing front PUP of a Jazz, but I was wondering whether there are other options?

Cheers

C 

[AndyTravis]

I found the 55 we shared at one point sounded like neck pickup of a Jazz

[Beedster]

8 minutes ago, AndyTravis said:

I found the 55 we shared at one point sounded like neck pickup of a Jazz

Thanks Andy, yeh that's my sense, I'm wondering whether the neck PUP of the Jazz will get as grunty as a '51 when pushed, or perhaps whether there are any P-PUPs that'll get me close to the tone? I've got a pair of '80's DiMarzios in my Jazz, and they don't, at least to my ear?

[CameronJ]

Nordstrand have recently answered this very requirement. Their ‘51 Split J pickups are hum cancelling ‘51 Precision pups in Jazz housings. BassDirect sell them at the moment:

https://www.bassdirect.co.uk/bass_guitar_specialists/Nordstrand_Jazz_pickups.html

Edited September 12, 2020 by CameronJ

[Beedster]

37 minutes ago, CameronJ said:

Nordstrand have recently answered this very requirement. Their ‘51 Split J pickups are hum cancelling ‘51 Precision pups in Jazz housings. BassDirect sell them at the moment:

https://www.bassdirect.co.uk/bass_guitar_specialists/Nordstrand_Jazz_pickups.html

Ha ha, thanks Cameron, that had probably done the job, although I have a sneaking suspicion they’re not going to be at the low end of the price spectrum

[Beedster]

OK, does anyone here speak Nordstrand, i think I need an interpreter

[Chiliwailer]

34 minutes ago, Beedster said:

OK, does anyone here speak Nordstrand, i think I need an interpreter

Must be the ‘potted for twenty minutes in a parrafin-beeswax mix’ effect... 🤪

[Lozz196]

1 hour ago, Beedster said:

OK, does anyone here speak Nordstrand, i think I need an interpreter

I think it reads:

The 51 Split J is fackin great.

[Beedster]

So this begs the question of the differences between a Jazz SC and a 51 SC, they’re in a similar point on the string, at least the front Jazz PUP? 

[Jus Lukin]

-

Edited March 8, 2022 by Jus Lukin

[CameronJ]

3 hours ago, Beedster said:

Ha ha, thanks Cameron, that had probably done the job, although I have a sneaking suspicion they’re not going to be at the low end of the price spectrum

Indeed, at £200 for a pair they ain’t cheap. Might be worth getting in touch with BD as they may be able to get you a single neck pickup, allowing you to keep your existing bridge pup

[Beedster]

1 hour ago, Jus Lukin said:

Not sure about position, but I believe the dual poles per string were to reduce the attack of the note, as the original single pole had a tendancy to blow the drivers in amplifiers (although that was as much to do with the flimsy drivers used at the time as anything). Also, I think the early pickups were actually quite hot, and Fender pickups became weaker into the 60's and 70's.

Do you have a rosewood or maple board on your Jazz? Some will swear it makes no difference, but I find the maple board is a key part of that sound, too.

Maple, plus a chunky neck, do part way there already mate (and yes, I totally agree re boards despite the naysayers) 

[Beedster]

17 minutes ago, CameronJ said:

Indeed, at £200 for a pair they ain’t cheap. Might be worth getting in touch with BD as they may be able to get you a single neck pickup, allowing you to keep your existing bridge pup

Yep, I could probably buy a half decent SC PBass for that. At present I’m hoping that the right strings, the right action, and some vey big and very warm tubes are going to get me close enough

[ClassicVibes]

5 hours ago, CameronJ said:

Nordstrand have recently answered this very requirement. Their ‘51 Split J pickups are hum cancelling ‘51 Precision pups in Jazz housings. BassDirect sell them at the moment:

https://www.bassdirect.co.uk/bass_guitar_specialists/Nordstrand_Jazz_pickups.html

These in this would be perfect.

[CameronJ]

3 minutes ago, ClassicVibes said:

These in this would be perfect.

That would be very cool

[Beedster]

5 minutes ago, ClassicVibes said:

These in this would be perfect.

Great idea. Main concern at present however is how the PUPs sound. Anyone played them? 

[JohnDaBass]

To achieve a tone close to your target  why not get a Harley Benton 51p and either a Jess Loureiro split 51 P or a Lindy Fralin split 51 P bass pickup and a @KiOgon loom.  Job done .😎

Edited September 12, 2020 by JohnDaBass
Error

[JohnDaBass]

Ooops,  not sure about brand vanity 😂

[pete.young]

8 hours ago, Beedster said:

 So if I want that gnarly '51 single-coil tone, without buying a '51, what's the most likely contender?

Who are you, and what have you done with the real @Beedster ?

[Graham]

Is the front pickup of a jazz in the same position as the single coil pickup on a 51P?

I always thought it was further back

[Cuzzie]

If you want a very beefy jazz pick up look at Haüssel they have a small and a Big pole range-the closest I have heard to a P bass and phenomenal - they have some grunt on em

[Steve Browning]

A 51 Precision has a gigantic sound (I'm afraid mine was 2 years younger).; I strongly suspect that the body mass was a factor. A similar debate has raged about the slab 66 Precisions for much the same reason. Somehow the sound is much bigger even though the components appear to be the same.

My own experience (of a slab 53 and a slab 66) would indicate you want a slab body to really get the sound. It's hard to describe it without having experienced it (hoping not to sound patronising there). I can only pass on my conclusions and opinion based on that experience.

I don't know about the pickups mentioned here. My basses were stock.

[Cuzzie]

Slab body will play a part, but pick up is vital - I Made a contoured body from a block of ash, it’s not light, but not heavy - but I know the Pick up makes it massive.

[Paul S]

What about this Squier and upgrade the pickup?

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/FENDER-Squier-Classic-Vibe-50s-Precision-Bass-stunning-looker/373207324202?hash=item56e4e3d62a%3Ag%3ATAgAAOSw7MlfQib6&LH_ItemCondition=3000

Edit, nowt to do with me.

Edited September 13, 2020 by Paul S

[kodiakblair]

47 minutes ago, Paul S said:

What about this Squier and upgrade the pickup?

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/FENDER-Squier-Classic-Vibe-50s-Precision-Bass-stunning-looker/373207324202?hash=item56e4e3d62a%3Ag%3ATAgAAOSw7MlfQib6&LH_ItemCondition=3000

Edit, nowt to do with me.

The pickup itself makes very little difference, position is king.

I put 7 different singles in a P-bass and recorded short clips.

Pickups varied with DCR, most were alnico 5, couple were split singles in series/parallel, staggered poles, big 1/4 lb'er poles. One was £8 from China.

Did a blind test, no names mentioned or materials or  the way they were wired. Just asked folk to pick out the £8 one.

Each pickup had the same number of folk claiming it was the one from China 😀