ReeV0 Posted September 19, 2020 Share Posted September 19, 2020 (edited) Hi all, I currently use a Zoom B3 with no other effects pedals (apart from the SpectraComp on my RH750). The Zoom has been great although none of the effects sound *that* great. But you get what you pay for. One effect in particular, the octaver, is not good and distorts with anything below an A (standard tuning) which turns into mud. So I then said to myself, "Ok I'll just buy a separate dedicated octaver!" That's now opened up a wormhole... And not just because there are so many octavers to choose from... I now find myself looking at different small pedal boards to buy (never used one before) and am considering selling the B3 as it would take up too much real estate. I don't need its drum machine function (as I have an SDRUM) and I don't need the looper function (as I have a Boss RC3). I'm now considering one of the following as a suitable alternative to the B3: - Zoom MS60B: Pretty much the same as the B3 but smaller and with less effects, harder to use in a gig situation, unless it's already pre-setup. Also a YouTube hack apparently unlocks more effects... - Zoom MS100BT: Don't know much about this, not sure if it's more guitar-orientated. But one forum user highly recommended it in place of the MS60B. Like the MS60B, a YouTube hack can apparently unlock more effects... - Zoom B1four: Seems the same size as the B3 so wouldn't gain any real estate, but newer technology means better sounding effects? - Someone's also told be that the Line 6 Pod X3 is miles ahead of the Zoom pedals in terms of effects quality, so now I just don't know what to do! Haha. I always thought the Line 6 gear was quite dated... Any sage advice would be greatly appreciated!! Edited September 19, 2020 by jjl5590 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Al Krow Posted September 19, 2020 Share Posted September 19, 2020 (edited) A few pointers from me: In terms of size the B1-4 is actually half way between the M6-60B and B3. Looking at the dimensions online just now, its almost exactly half the footprint of the B3. As you said, the B1-4 does have the latest chip set and its defo a feature rich piece of kit. I've had the MS-60B, B3N, B1-4X and have settled on the B1-4 and am very happy with it. Personally, I found the interface on the MS-60B the least user friendly but with the advent of Tonelib editing software, it's much easier to create and edit patches, so that should be less of an issue. The B3 and MS-60B have some legacy patches that are very cool e.g. a couple of the synth effects which are not (yet) available on the B1-4 and B3N; although tbf there's quite a bit of new stuff on the B1-4 that's not on the older models. The B3 has a DI out which the rest don't and I believe a better interface for recording, and still has a LOT of fans! Edited September 20, 2020 by Al Krow 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Helbass Posted September 19, 2020 Share Posted September 19, 2020 With the MS, I prefered the pitch to the octaver. I found that the octaver on the B1-4 is better and pretty nice.. I like the old serie (MS-60B, B1on, B3) but the new one sounds better. I keep an old MS as a HPF/noise gate/reverb in my amp loop. Do not sell your B3 if you can. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skybone Posted September 20, 2020 Share Posted September 20, 2020 (edited) I went through the very same process a few years ago, ended up going around in circles for ages. I bought a Zoom B3, and although it was Good, I found it a bit limited if I was using the amp sim, add a compressor or a reverb, that left only 1 slot left for effects. I'd had a PODxt bean for years, so I bought an XT Live, and the bass expansion pack. Decided to try it against the Zoom to see which one stayed, which one got moved on. IMO, the XT Live had slightly better amp sims than the Zoom, and the fact that you could assign more than 3 effects to a patch meant that the XT won. The XT wasn't perfect, but it was very good. The POD X3 uses the same amp / cab / effects model sets as the XT series, except it's 'fully loaded', as in it came with all the model packs from the XT series. After a few months using the XT Live, I was finding that the effects were 'getting lost' in the mix. So the search began again. Again, After a long search, I kept coming back to the Line6 POD, but the HD500x. Again, you had to buy the bass pack, as the standard model set only has two or three amp sims that would be alright for bass. Compared to the XT (and the Zoom B3), it had very few amp sims. Anyway, managed to pick one up relatively inexpensively second hand, added the bass pack, then compared it against the XT Live. After a few minutes, and without too much tweaking either, the quality of the models on the HD simply blew the XT Live out of the water in every aspect. The effects are better quality as well. Yes, it takes a bit of time to tweak, but even the standard settings sound great. Four years later, I'm still using the HD500x as the basis of my rig. You can get them for around £200-250 on eBay. The Bass pack is around £20, but money worth spending IMO. Loads of connectivity as well, and if you play guitar, even better. Plug it into the Effects Return of your amp, bypass the preamp. Result. Well, works for me. If you just want effects, maybe look at the Line6 M series. Edited September 20, 2020 by Skybone Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ReeV0 Posted September 20, 2020 Author Share Posted September 20, 2020 I don't know guys... I'm leaning more towards the MS60B - according to this it has around 152 bass-specific effects! https://zoomcorp.com/media/documents/E_MS-60B_FX-list_v2.pdf Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Al Krow Posted September 20, 2020 Share Posted September 20, 2020 1 hour ago, jjl5590 said: I don't know guys... I'm leaning more towards the MS60B - according to this it has around 152 bass-specific effects! https://zoomcorp.com/media/documents/E_MS-60B_FX-list_v2.pdf Go for it! What's the worst that could happen (particularly if you manage to bag a used one)? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baloney Balderdash Posted September 20, 2020 Share Posted September 20, 2020 (edited) The Zoom MS60B has way more effects than the B3, cause it got upgraded with a new patch with a load of new effects unlike the B3, basically the same kind of quality though. The B1-Four got better quality effects, but fewer and with fewer editable parameters, but is about half the size of the B3. As for octaver, get a dedicated one, the ones build into multi effects are never good, I'd recommend the TC Electronic Sub'N'Up or Sub'N'Up Mini. The Zoom MS100BT is discontinued and basically the same as the MS60B, just discontinued and with fewer effects. Edited September 20, 2020 by Baloney Balderdash Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ReeV0 Posted September 22, 2020 Author Share Posted September 22, 2020 Thanks for all the replies. I've learned that the MS50G, MS60B, MS70CDR can all share effects by using a 3rd party software, which is pretty awesome! But now I'm wondering, maybe I'll go for the MS50G or MS70CDR, as they can have up to 6 effects in a row rather than the MS60B which can only have 4... But I also read somewhere that the extra added effects cannot be read by the Tonelib editing software, meaning all the patch editing would need to be done on the stompbox which isn't very handy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ReeV0 Posted September 23, 2020 Author Share Posted September 23, 2020 Ok, so I think I may have made a mistake... lol Since ordering the MS70CDR earlier today, I've been playing with my B3 for about 2 hours -man I forgot how awesome this thing is... It's just so easy to use, everything is displayed clearly etc. I like how I can have basically 100 slots for my own patches. My only reason I wanted to change it was because: A) I wanted more effects in a chain (6 as opposed to 3) B) I wanted a smaller sized pedal C) I wanted the option to be able to change patches AND turn effects on/off using a footswitch. The MS70CDR ticks A & B, but not C. I think only the Zoom B3n ticks C. So if I want to tick C, it seems I need to buy myself a Disaster Area DMC footswitch for another £100... So that's £200 altogether with the MS70CDR. For £130, I could have bought a Zoom B3n. Heck, for £250 I could have bought a used Helix! The more videos I watch, the harder the MS70CDR looks to use (compared to the B3). I also didn't realise that it only has 25 patch slots (I've already used up around 50 slots on my B3 so far). And if I put on the other effects from the other pedals using the firmware hack, then the Tonelib software won't recognise them (although I think there is a browser-based patch editor, which is a must seeing as the pedal only only has one screen). I think my ideal scenario is, if I can accept that the B3 has a 3-effect limit (which is annoying but not the end of the world), is there any way I can use a footswitch to scroll through the patches, whilst still being able to turn off individual effects? Will the Disaster Area DMC.micro or DMC-3XL solve this problem? I already have the Digitech FS3X footswitch that I use for my SDRUM, but annoyingly it isn't compatible with Zoom devices - and I don't want to start attempting to mod my own electronics... I've already had a look at Ashbass and the mods look too complicated. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tauzero Posted October 12, 2020 Share Posted October 12, 2020 You want a Zoom B3n, you do. Or a Helix Stomp. The MS70CDR seems a worse choice than the MS60B - you'd have been better off with an MS60B as you can use the Tonelib editor with it, whereas it won't recognise "foreign" effects loaded into the MS models. The MS100BT, incidentally, is pretty pointless unless you have an iPhone - Android isn't supported, which seems incredibly short-sighted of Zoom. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ReeV0 Posted October 13, 2020 Author Share Posted October 13, 2020 I've gone with a Hx Stomp Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dannybuoy Posted October 14, 2020 Share Posted October 14, 2020 I know you were after a Darkglass pedal too, both the newer Zooms (B1Four or B3n) and HX Stomp have a great B7K model. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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