SpondonBassed Posted October 20, 2020 Share Posted October 20, 2020 I once read a post here that described tone using terms such as Honk. There was a name for each of about half a dozen frequency ranges. Apparently this is more widely recognised than I thought, possibly among sound engineers in particular. Yet I can't find a list of terms by searching. Has anyone got a link to that post. Failing that, can someone list those terms and the frequencies that they cover please? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul S Posted October 20, 2020 Share Posted October 20, 2020 It could be that I misuse the word 'honk' but I use it a fair bit to describe the nasal quality of upper mids that are pushed too far. Reminiscent of a distorted tuba. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NancyJohnson Posted October 20, 2020 Share Posted October 20, 2020 A word (which I believe I termed) was Ponk/Ponky. It was just a generalisation for this tone from the 60s...you have loads of guys creaming themselves over vintage basses/amps, but tonally there's little by way of dynamic range on a lot of those recordings. Listen to some of those old Motown/Jackson 5 isolated recordings. Jazz bass/dead flats/foam under the strings. Just tuned thumping. Ponk. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Woodinblack Posted October 20, 2020 Share Posted October 20, 2020 The terms seem quite consistent 5 2 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rich Posted October 20, 2020 Share Posted October 20, 2020 (edited) I would take issue with their description of 80-160Hz as 'boom/punch'. Punch definitely, but for me 'boom' is down the lower end near 'rumble'. Usually 'boom' is something I try to get rid of as it just makes the sound muddy. The red 30Hz slider on the Trace Elliot 12-band graphics was very useful for this. Edited October 20, 2020 by Rich Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigRedX Posted October 20, 2020 Share Posted October 20, 2020 What's the difference between the blue and red portion of each line? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jus Lukin Posted October 20, 2020 Share Posted October 20, 2020 (edited) - Edited March 9, 2022 by Jus Lukin 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NancyJohnson Posted October 20, 2020 Share Posted October 20, 2020 1 hour ago, Woodinblack said: The terms seem quite consistent This is a great graphic (although I'm not entirely certain whether bass refers to electric bass guitars, or orchestral uprights). Years ago I gigged at a place where the sound guy was saying we needed to 'own our frequency'; our guitarist favoured a very deep and boomy tone and by way of compansation, I tended to roll off the bass a bit and play with a bit more top. Sound guy was mooning around our kit and pre-stage time, rolled off some of the bass on the guitar and turned it up on mine and the sound came alive. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Woodinblack Posted October 20, 2020 Share Posted October 20, 2020 30 minutes ago, NancyJohnson said: This is a great graphic (although I'm not entirely certain whether bass refers to electric bass guitars, or orchestral uprights). I am suspecting that is electric bass, as it has a black section where covers where the B string would be Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MacDaddy Posted October 20, 2020 Share Posted October 20, 2020 The bass is a transposing instrument, and is written an octave higher than it sounds. Point being it is not just an octave lower than the guitar as the above graphic shows. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jrixn1 Posted October 20, 2020 Share Posted October 20, 2020 1 hour ago, Woodinblack said: I am suspecting that is electric bass, as it has a black section where covers where the B string would be It shows bass going down to C, which is I think where an orchestral double bass often/usually goes down to. 15 minutes ago, MacDaddy said: The bass is a transposing instrument, and is written an octave higher than it sounds. Point being it is not just an octave lower than the guitar as the above graphic shows. The guitar is also a transposing instrument. The low E string on a normal bass guitar is one octave below the low E string on a normal guitar. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Woodinblack Posted October 20, 2020 Share Posted October 20, 2020 41 minutes ago, MacDaddy said: Point being it is not just an octave lower than the guitar as the above graphic shows. It litterally is an octave below a guitar 24 minutes ago, jrixn1 said: It shows bass going down to C, which is I think where an orchestral double bass often/usually goes down to I would say it looks like B (30.7) rather than C (~32.7), but a bit hard to see on that chart Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MacDaddy Posted October 20, 2020 Share Posted October 20, 2020 40 minutes ago, jrixn1 said: It shows bass going down to C, which is I think where an orchestral double bass often/usually goes down to. The guitar is also a transposing instrument. The low E string on a normal bass guitar is one octave below the low E string on a normal guitar. 14 minutes ago, Woodinblack said: It litterally is an octave below a guitar I would say it looks like B (30.7) rather than C (~32.7), but a bit hard to see on that chart I am Today years old! Back in the day I got my grade 6 on classical guitar, never once was it mentioned in any lesson or theory that the guitar - as you both correctly state - is actually a transposition instrument. 🤯 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
leftybassman392 Posted October 20, 2020 Share Posted October 20, 2020 (edited) 5 hours ago, BigRedX said: What's the difference between the blue and red portion of each line? Looks to me like the blue represents fundamental frequencies (i.e. the notes you are actually playing), whereas the red appears to indicate the overtones (for a bass, the 'honk' indicated is best thought of as a characteristic created by tone control settings, specifically the midrange, rather than as a plucked note). The blue line for the bass (which could be either electric or DB as a 4-string bass has roughly the same range as a DB). The black sections dotted around the chart I'm not so sure about, but it could be showing possible extensions to the standard range. The low E on a 4-string bass is a little over 40Hz, whereas the low B on a 5 is a little under 30 Hz. I've seen orchestral DBs with a fifth string, which I imagine will be tuned to the same low B. As it happens I think the overtone series, if that's what it is, is a bit of an oversimplification without further qualification. YMMV of course. Hope this helps. Edited October 20, 2020 by leftybassman392 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hellzero Posted October 20, 2020 Share Posted October 20, 2020 7 hours ago, BigRedX said: What's the difference between the blue and red portion of each line? The blue is on the left and the red is on the right. 🤣 Same question for me... 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
leftybassman392 Posted October 20, 2020 Share Posted October 20, 2020 1 minute ago, Hellzero said: The blue is on the left and the red is on the right. 🤣 Same question for me... Check my previous post (just above yours) ^^ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hellzero Posted October 20, 2020 Share Posted October 20, 2020 Just now, leftybassman392 said: Check my previous post (just above yours) ^^ Read it, I think you're right. Check this for our lovely instruments : https://www.studybass.com/gear/bass-tone-and-eq/bass-frequency-range/ 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nail Soup Posted October 20, 2020 Share Posted October 20, 2020 Maybe I've misunderstood the term 'honk' (when applied to a bass) all my life then. I always thought it described something like the envelope of the sound rather than a frequency - similar to how sometimes a guitar pick up or something is described (normally negatively) as having a 'quacking' sound. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SpondonBassed Posted October 21, 2020 Author Share Posted October 21, 2020 My understanding is that Honk refers to the tone when you boost it in the 500Hz region. There was also a term for each of the other regions in the audible range. I think there were eight or nine altogether. So far no-one has listed them. Woodinblack has come close but his image is not bass specific. Thanks though. It is a comprehensive diagram that contains a lot of information about the range of lots of instruments. It will be useful at some point I imagine. I'm still hoping someone else can remember what I'm trying to... the list. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jus Lukin Posted October 21, 2020 Share Posted October 21, 2020 (edited) - Edited March 9, 2022 by Jus Lukin Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SpondonBassed Posted October 21, 2020 Author Share Posted October 21, 2020 16 minutes ago, Jus Lukin said: You may be able to find that list, and will certainly find many similar, but different. None of them will contain official terms, because there aren't any. I think this thinking is the trouble here. Sound engineers are the last people to use a list of terms such as this. I'm tempted to call them layman's terms, but the fact is that they are even more amorphous and subjective than that. As far as these descriptive terms go, call it what it sounds like to you- that's all you've got. If you want to improve your understanding of the audible frequency range, there are much better places to be looking- literally any other part of Woodinblack's chart is far more useful and universal as a starting point. Thanks for the encouragement. While I take your points about terminology, there was a list that, if not widely accepted, was at least recognisable by a lot of musos. I'll find it eventually. You know what search engines are like... helpful one day, next-to-useless the next. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
leftybassman392 Posted October 21, 2020 Share Posted October 21, 2020 (edited) I ran my own project studio for a number of years, and in all honesty I don’t recall using any of this terminology at any time. The only frequency-related term I do remember using is ‘presence’, usually when discussing microphone characteristics. Microphones, especially studio mics, normally have a slight ‘lift’ in the response curve at around 5kHz. ETA: Having looked at the list again, 'treble' and 'sibilance' are terms I am likely to have used, and I do recall studio engineers talking about warmth. Apologies for the oversight. That said I do still see the list as being a bit of a contrivance overall. Edited October 21, 2020 by leftybassman392 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spencer.b Posted October 21, 2020 Share Posted October 21, 2020 I've heard honk used by soundmen and players from time to time to describe too much upper mid Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SpondonBassed Posted October 21, 2020 Author Share Posted October 21, 2020 (edited) Maybe it was only a Basschat thing but it was posted here a couple of years ago. If I could recall more than the one term I could peg it down but with just the one term I get too many search results back to go through. I won't be the only one to have read the post though so it's only a matter of time, if enough members read this, before someone remembers and at least I'd have that. Honk IS used widely. You'll hear folk like Guy Pratt using it. The other terms were suitable descriptive of the frequencies they represented too. I've flogged this horse for long enough. It's either a dead 'un or it's got no legs. I'm past caring now. Edited October 21, 2020 by SpondonBassed Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dad3353 Posted October 21, 2020 Share Posted October 21, 2020 On 11/04/2016 at 10:56, luckydog said: Here's a sort of rough rule of thumb of for how eq settings might generally map on to sounds 31Hz Chest/Gut 63Hz Bottom 125Hz Thump 250Hz Fullness 500Hz Honk 1kHz Whack 2kHz Pluck 4kHz Edge I thought the OP settings looked plausible for a good band mix with a precision in a difficult room without mid preshape.....but much depends what one is aiming for in character of bass sound and one has to be guided by ears not by eyes. LD 19 minutes ago, SpondonBassed said: Maybe it was only a Basschat thing but it was posted here a couple of years ago... S'your Lucky Day, old chum. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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