Ian McFly Posted January 20, 2021 Share Posted January 20, 2021 That’s a really good point. Now it makes me think.... I just paid £350 for an indonesian made SUB Ray4. Ok, it’s a cheap bass and some parts do feel cheap-ish. Overall it’s quite a good bass still, and it makes me wonder.... is an US-made Stingray actually worth 8 times the price of the SUB? It’s definitely worth more, there’s no debate... but eight times?! 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
acidbass Posted January 20, 2021 Share Posted January 20, 2021 3 minutes ago, Kev said: However, I think brands like Ernie Ball, Rickenbacker etc are looking at brands like Dingwall and Strandberg and seeing them selling basses between £2k and £3k for instruments built in the Far East I still struggle with understanding how a Chinese built Dingwall NG series sells for around £2k. Surely they only cost a couple of hundred to make on a CNC machine, plus maybe another hundred for the DG preamp. They are effectively telling us a setup in Canada adds £1700 to the value? Strewth! 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kev Posted January 20, 2021 Share Posted January 20, 2021 (edited) 4 minutes ago, acidbass said: I still struggle with understanding how a Chinese built Dingwall NG series sells for around £2k. Surely they only cost a couple of hundred to make on a CNC machine, plus maybe another hundred for the DG preamp. They are effectively telling us a setup in Canada adds £1700 to the value? Strewth! The Strandberg basses I referenced start at £2,750 I believe, fully built and assembled in the Far East. Spector have just released a new multiscale bass as well, and I believe they are also £2k and built in...the Far East. I don't get it either. I bought a Dingwall NG-2 when they were first released and it cost me £1,150 from Bass Direct. At the time, it felt like it was good for the money, but it still had a feeling of a cheaper bass, which was off putting when I put out 4 figures for it. The fact they are double that now, when the Canadian built models have had nowhere near the same level of increase, is staggering. For example, I think a fairly base level Afterburner was around £2650 when I bought my NG-2. and they're around £3250 now. We're talking 6 or 7 years, so that seems fair. The Strandberg, well its just daft. I've played a couple, and they were both rubbish. Sharp metal edges, poor routing quality, only good thing about them was the neck, and that's basically what you're paying for. Edited January 20, 2021 by Kev Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Musicman20 Posted January 20, 2021 Share Posted January 20, 2021 4 minutes ago, acidbass said: I still struggle with understanding how a Chinese built Dingwall NG series sells for around £2k. Surely they only cost a couple of hundred to make on a CNC machine, plus maybe another hundred for the DG preamp. They are effectively telling us a setup in Canada adds £1700 to the value? Strewth! Yep. I don't get it either 😂 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ped Posted January 20, 2021 Share Posted January 20, 2021 17 minutes ago, Musicman20 said: Yep. I don't get it either 😂 You need to change your username to Musicman3000 2 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted January 20, 2021 Share Posted January 20, 2021 22 minutes ago, Musicman20 said: Yep. I don't get it either 😂 Because they’re now charging the best part of £3K for an ABZ (which is “Canadian” but used to use Chinese Combustion bodies, not sure if they still do), which is about as basic a bass you can buy - passive, no top, simple neck etc. And they charge upwards of £4-5K for the AB1/2 and Fodera money for the Z and Prima ranges. I’m sure there’s a load of labour-intensive handwork but £5K for a basic bass with a painted finish is silly money in today’s world. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kev Posted January 20, 2021 Share Posted January 20, 2021 (edited) 7 minutes ago, FDC484950 said: Because they’re now charging the best part of £3K for an ABZ (which is “Canadian” but used to use Chinese Combustion bodies, not sure if they still do), which is about as basic a bass you can buy - passive, no top, simple neck etc. And they charge upwards of £4-5K for the AB1/2 and Fodera money for the Z and Prima ranges. I’m sure there’s a load of labour-intensive handwork but £5K for a basic bass with a painted finish is silly money in today’s world. That isn't quite right, Bass Direct don't currently have stock of any ABZs, but AB1's start at £2650 odd actually now I've just checked Bass Direct (less actually, as the one linked has upgrades from the base spec), so actually the prices of the Canadian models haven't really changed, during the time the chinese models have almost doubled!! That's the point here, its why suddenly all these builders feel they are able to charge very premium prices for their Far Eastern basses built at mass in factories at a much lower cost. https://bassdirect.co.uk/bass_guitar_specialists/ABI_5_Vintage_White.html Edited January 20, 2021 by Kev Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grahambythesea Posted January 20, 2021 Share Posted January 20, 2021 And we can’t even blame Brexit for the price increase or did Trump sneak an export tariff through at the last minute without telling us? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted January 20, 2021 Share Posted January 20, 2021 26 minutes ago, Kev said: That isn't quite right, Bass Direct don't currently have stock of any ABZs, but AB1's start at £2650 odd actually now I've just checked Bass Direct (less actually, as the one linked has upgrades from the base spec), so actually the prices of the Canadian models haven't really changed, during the time the chinese models have almost doubled!! That's the point here, its why suddenly all these builders feel they are able to charge very premium prices for their Far Eastern basses built at mass in factories at a much lower cost. https://bassdirect.co.uk/bass_guitar_specialists/ABI_5_Vintage_White.html I asked them for a quote recently and was told that prices have increased and an ABZ (6) starts from £2500 and the one I enquired about was nearly £3K. A decent AB1 is nearer 3.5K but it depends on how many strings of course. I assume the one you link to is an older one at a lower price as they also have an AB1 5/3 in CAR at £1K more. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kev Posted January 20, 2021 Share Posted January 20, 2021 (edited) 4 minutes ago, FDC484950 said: I asked them for a quote recently and was told that prices have increased and an ABZ (6) starts from £2500 and the one I enquired about was nearly £3K. A decent AB1 is nearer 3.5K but it depends on how many strings of course. I assume the one you link to is an older one at a lower price as they also have an AB1 5/3 in CAR at £1K more. The upcharges are significant. That Candy Red one has a £300 finish upgrade, £260 pickup upgrade and £365 preamp upgrade. Adding that to the £2650 white one takes you to £3,575, so just a fraction different than what Bass Direct are asking. They turn around basses quickly so they'll both be current crop. Expensive, but they always have been and pricing over the last 7 years or so has been consistent. The Far East basses, however, have exploded. Edited January 20, 2021 by Kev Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Musicman20 Posted January 20, 2021 Share Posted January 20, 2021 55 minutes ago, ped said: You need to change your username to Musicman3000 I might just predict 2022 and go 3500. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Munurmunuh Posted January 20, 2021 Share Posted January 20, 2021 I hadn't really realised that SBMM prices had reached these kinds of levels too. The price of my made-to-order USA G&L SB-1 is suddenly looking like a bargain. (Ok not a bargain, but less of a ridiculous indulgence 😬 ) 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted January 20, 2021 Share Posted January 20, 2021 18 minutes ago, Kev said: The upcharges are significant. That Candy Red one has a £300 finish upgrade, £260 pickup upgrade and £365 preamp upgrade. Adding that to the £2650 white one takes you to £3,575, so just a fraction different than what Bass Direct are asking. They turn around basses quickly so they'll both be current crop. Expensive, but they always have been and pricing over the last 7 years or so has been consistent. The Far East basses, however, have exploded. I tried an ABII 5 with exotic bubinga top and all the trimmings in the Gallery not long after Dingwall first arrived in the UK. It was about £1,600. The same bass in the same spec would now be £5,350. Not long after I bought and owned an ABZ5 in ash/maple for £1250. The same bass is now approx £2400. Even 4-5 years ago a decent spec ABZ was about £700-800 less than their quoted 2021 pricing. Personally I think they are extremely over priced and they’re only going to get more expensive. That applies to both Dingwall and Music Man (the point of the thread...) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kev Posted January 20, 2021 Share Posted January 20, 2021 3 minutes ago, FDC484950 said: I tried an ABII 5 with exotic bubinga top and all the trimmings in the Gallery not long after Dingwall first arrived in the UK. It was about £1,600. The same bass in the same spec would now be £5,350. Not long after I bought and owned an ABZ5 in ash/maple for £1250. The same bass is now approx £2400. Even 4-5 years ago a decent spec ABZ was about £700-800 less than their quoted 2021 pricing. Personally I think they are extremely over priced and they’re only going to get more expensive. That applies to both Dingwall and Music Man (the point of the thread...) I don’t know what to say, that just isn’t my experience of the change in prices since I’ve been looking at/buying them 🤷🏻♂️ But yes, back on topic, £3k for a Stingray is crazy talk, as is the price rise since 2020. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Musicman20 Posted January 20, 2021 Share Posted January 20, 2021 41 minutes ago, Ricky Rioli said: I hadn't really realised that SBMM prices had reached these kinds of levels too. The price of my made-to-order USA G&L SB-1 is suddenly looking like a bargain. (Ok not a bargain, but less of a ridiculous indulgence 😬 ) My god!!! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kev Posted January 20, 2021 Share Posted January 20, 2021 13 minutes ago, Kev said: I don’t know what to say, that just isn’t my experience of the change in prices since I’ve been looking at/buying them 🤷🏻♂️ But yes, back on topic, £3k for a Stingray is crazy talk, as is the price rise since 2020. Jumping Off Topic briefly, I absolutely adore how the forum has interpreted the male shrugging emoji on my phone's keyboard! 😂 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eldon Tyrell Posted January 20, 2021 Author Share Posted January 20, 2021 1 hour ago, Grahambythesea said: And we can’t even blame Brexit for the price increase or did Trump sneak an export tariff through at the last minute without telling us? That could be the answer. Up to Dec 31.12.20, the UK was trading with the US as part of the EU (and there is a US-EU trade deal in place). Now, outside the US, how is the UK currently trading with the US without a US-UK trade deal in being in place yet? WTO? Could that increase the huge price increases? By comparison, in the US, prices only went up $100-200. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kev Posted January 20, 2021 Share Posted January 20, 2021 Just now, Eldon Tyrell said: That could be the answer. Up to Dec 31.12.20, the UK was trading with the US as part of the EU (and there is a US-EU trade deal in place). Now, outside the US, how is the UK currently trading with the US without a US-UK trade deal in being in place yet? WTO? Could that increase the huge price increases? By comparison, in the US, prices only went up $100-200. There is an active US-EU trade deal?? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eldon Tyrell Posted January 20, 2021 Author Share Posted January 20, 2021 2 minutes ago, Kev said: There is an active US-EU trade deal?? Oh, maybe not, thought they must have some kind of agreement in place. Well, just trying to get my head around this huge increase here in comparison to the small increase in the US. What could be the reason? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kev Posted January 20, 2021 Share Posted January 20, 2021 Just now, Eldon Tyrell said: Oh, maybe not, thought they must have some kind of agreement in place. Well, just trying to get my head around this huge increase here in comparison to the small increase in the US. What could be the reason? I think they just trade under WTO rules, so effectively the same as us, so it shouldn't be the reason. Unless, by chance, the UK uses an EU based distributor?? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Musicman20 Posted January 20, 2021 Share Posted January 20, 2021 The UK did use Strings & Things to distribute Musicman unless that changed recently. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Woodwind Posted January 20, 2021 Share Posted January 20, 2021 1 hour ago, Ricky Rioli said: I hadn't really realised that SBMM prices had reached these kinds of levels too. The price of my made-to-order USA G&L SB-1 is suddenly looking like a bargain. (Ok not a bargain, but less of a ridiculous indulgence 😬 ) Those are absolutely insane prices for what these basses are (I own one). 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chiliwailer Posted January 20, 2021 Share Posted January 20, 2021 Just imagine how much the BFR Ltd Editions will cost now... crazy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AndyTravis Posted January 20, 2021 Share Posted January 20, 2021 2 minutes ago, Chiliwailer said: Just imagine how much the BFR Ltd Editions will cost now... crazy. Wait for the clearance sales...they’ll be there. £3000 for a stingray. PAH Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chiliwailer Posted January 20, 2021 Share Posted January 20, 2021 Just now, AndyTravis said: Wait for the clearance sales...they’ll be there. £3000 for a stingray. PAH Too right, I thought the £2200 I paid for my HH Special in 2018 took the pi55. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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