Basschat easy-build lockdown cab project

[Downunderwonder]

4 hours ago, Finbar said:

Would that be helpful?

Sure. It might even help you if you miss something!

[Rich]

On 17/02/2021 at 17:04, stewblack said:

OK. Draw circle on panel. Drill hole inside the edge of the circle. Place panel on work bench with hole just over the edge. Jigsaw blade into hole. Start cutting, pulling panel towards you. 

Stop. Remove tins, tools, cup of tea which panel almost knocks from bench. Resume. 

You forgot:

If cutting suddenly becomes more sluggish & difficult, stop and move panel further out from the edge of your workbench, which now has a 1" slot sawn into it.

[stewblack]

17 minutes ago, Rich said:

You forgot:

If cutting suddenly becomes more sluggish & difficult, stop and move panel further out from the edge of your workbench, which now has a 1" slot sawn into it.

Ha ha !  I will share a shot of my workmate tomorrow which thoroughly supports your thesis.

[Rich]

Does the relative stiffness or even the resonance of the cabinet wood have any bearing? Is there any advantage to be had by one particular wood -- e.g. any advantage to using ply rather than MDF, apart from it being lighter?

[Stub Mandrel]

Ply is more resonant IME.

 

 

[Phil Starr]

we've done this before I think, there are a few considerations for panels, toughness and weight for practical reasons rather than sound. Then there are sonic properties; mass, Young's modulus (springiness) and self damping. Ply is usually used as it is light weight, tough and finishes easily. MDF is the densest material with good self damping so has low resonance, it also has the fatal flaw of swelling if it ever gets wet. Chipboard (particle board in the US) is somewhere in between but more difficult to finish but comes in a wide variety of grades, it is usually cheaper too.

 

Sonically MDF is great for speaker cabs but only usually used for hi-fi where cabs are smaller and aren't moved around. Chipboard is good and you can get special boards where the finest particles are on the outside and that makes finishing easy. A lot of old 70's stuff is made of Chip. at one point the 'wrap' was made of ply and the baffles were chip often of greater thickness. Ply is probably the least appropriate material for speakers but really practical for portable gear.

 

If you want to build this cab you can use any material you want.

[Phil Starr]

12 hours ago, Finbar said:

I am very tempted to give this a go. Having a (relatively cheap) neat little project with something to show at the end of it sounds good to me. I'm looking at getting into a semi-permanent practice room with my band now that we're getting into a post-covid world, and I would really like to have a cab to leave there!

 

For me, the main obstacle is that I'm a total cack-handed beginner to all of this stuff. And I mean a total beginner. I'm also not interested in frequency response graphs, tuning my ports etc. Just be nice to have something that works. I've read through the thread and I'm still feeling like there are things I don't understand - I've never read or implemented a wiring diagram in my life, for instance, even if it is the simplest solder free diagram! Even understanding exactly the right components I need is a little hard for me. While I get the gist of it, I think it'll take some trial and error on my part

 

I think it's likely that there are more people in the same situation as me, so if I do end up going for this, I'll probably try and put together an "Explain it like I'm 5" style shopping list with links and everything as part of the diary. Would that be helpful?

Give it a go, buried in the text here is all the help you will need and @stevie will sell you the components for the crossover at more or less cost. There's a cutting list here too so you can get the panels cut to size before you start and all you need to assemble the box is glue and a screwdriver. The rest can be ordered on-line from two suppliers. If you give it a go I'll start a new thread and talk you through the process and hopefully others will see how easy it is.

[Downunderwonder]

10 hours ago, Phil Starr said:

Give it a go, buried in the text here is all the help you will need and @stevie will sell you the components for the crossover at more or less cost. There's a cutting list here too so you can get the panels cut to size before you start and all you need to assemble the box is glue and a screwdriver. The rest can be ordered on-line from two suppliers. If you give it a go I'll start a new thread and talk you through the process and hopefully others will see how easy it is.

Would it not be more productive to do it in here and edit the OP into a comprehensive guide?

[Phil Starr]

7 hours ago, Downunderwonder said:

Would it not be more productive to do it in here and edit the OP into a comprehensive guide?

It's a matter of lack of time, there's only three of us working on these projects and two of us have proper jobs. It's about prioritisation and also being fun for us of course. The 'paperwork' is never the most interesting bit  As well as writing everything up we also have to build the cabs try them out with our various bands ideally at gigs and rehearsals, take measurements and keep our families happy. Not complaining but it is the reality most of humanity shares. 

 

Having said that we have talked to the staff at BC about creating a more stable way to save the designs and make them available. They've been really helpful and I need to take them up on their offer, watch this space. The nature of the forum is that anyone and everyone can join in and make the threads as long and meandering as this (on 13 pages and counting). It's hard to go back and edit with the current format but we are working on ways of making it more user friendly.

 

We tried a guided build with a previous design however where @funkle did a build of the BC112T mark III. It gave us a fresh start without a lot of effort Stevie’s 12” FRFR Cab Build Thread (Basschat Cab v3) - Amps and Cabs - Basschat

 

 

The thought here was that if Finbar or someone else took on a build then I could pack it up front with the necessary information without a lot of effort. He could put up pictures of his build to help people through and it's encouraging for people to see someone build a cab. Talking someone through a build helps everyone, and keeps us all at BC entertained.

Edited August 19, 2021 by Phil Starr

[Downunderwonder]

3 minutes ago, Phil Starr said:

It's a matter of lack of time, there's only three of us working on these projects and two of us have proper jobs. It's about prioritisation and also being fun for us of course. The 'paperwork' is never the most interesting bit  As well as writing everything up we also have to build the cabs try them out with our various bands ideally at gigs and rehearsals, take measurements and keep our families happy. Not complaining but it is the reality most of humanity shares. 

 

Having said that we have talked to the staff at BC about creating a more stable way to save the designs and make them available. They've been really helpful and I need to take them up on their offer, watch this space. The nature of the forum is that anyone and everyone can join in and make the threads as long and meandering as this (on 13 pages and counting). It's hard to go back and edit with the current format but we are working on ways of making it more user friendly.

 

We tried a guided build with a previous design however where @funkle did a build of the BC112T mark III. It gave us a fresh start without a lot of effort Stevie’s 12” FRFR Cab Build Thread (Basschat Cab v3) - Amps and Cabs - Basschat

 

 

The thought here was that if Finbar or someone else took on a build then I could pack it up front with the necessary information without a lot of effort. He could put up pictures of his build to help people through and it's encouraging for people to see someone build a cab. Talking someone through a build helps everyone, and keeps us all at BC entertained.

I am in lockdown so plenty of free time to edit stuff if you like.

[Phil Starr]

Thanks that's kind, many of us here looking enviously at the way you guys are handling Covid.

 

I should say we are happy for whoever wants to do a build and is prepared to take a few photo's on the way to be our guinea pig. It really helps to have someone asking the questions as they build as we don't always anticipate the problems you might have at home. 

[Dan Dare]

On 18/08/2021 at 10:16, stewblack said:

Ha ha !  I will share a shot of my workmate tomorrow which thoroughly supports your thesis.

 

I have a dining chair that does the same thing.

[tauzero]

What would be handy would be to have the PDF of the cab components and JPG of the crossover attached to the first post, plus details of the drivers and the port, and a pointer to page 5 as the start point for the build guide. Plus a link to cheap sources of replacement Workmates and/or dining chairs.

[nekomatic]

You asked for cheap…

 

https://www.toolstation.com/work-bench/p12739

[Stub Mandrel]

14 minutes ago, nekomatic said:

You asked for cheap…

 

https://www.toolstation.com/work-bench/p12739

 

'Over 20% off' at Screwfix 😉 last time I was in - £17.

[Bigwan]

So given the freq response a few pages back, could this (with a little eq around the upper midrange dip) be something approaching frfr... Asking for a friend... 

[stevie]

I'd say so. It's certainly more frfr than many (more expensive) cabs on the market that  claim to be so - and the only one, apart from the RCF PA cabs, that proves it with a frequency response graph. Plus, it will handle a lot more bass than  frfr cabs designed for guitar.

 

It wasn't designed specifically as an frfr cab, but my experience experimenting with bass guitar cabs over the past few years has taught me that a flat frequency response is desirable even if you're not going to use a modeller.

 

The proof of the frfr pudding is playing music through the cab, and this one sounds convincing, with no nasties. So you can use it with guitar and a modeller or also as a keyboard cab if you want. 

 

As soon as I finished the design, I started working on a more advanced version  and sent the parts to @Phil Starr  to build up. Phil has tested it and gigged with it and will no doubt be along shortly to give you his opinion.

 

 

[Bigwan]

6 hours ago, stevie said:

I'd say so. It's certainly more frfr than many (more expensive) cabs on the market that  claim to be so - and the only one, apart from the RCF PA cabs, that proves it with a frequency response graph. Plus, it will handle a lot more bass than  frfr cabs designed for guitar.

 

It wasn't designed specifically as an frfr cab, but my experience experimenting with bass guitar cabs over the past few years has taught me that a flat frequency response is desirable even if you're not going to use a modeller.

 

The proof of the frfr pudding is playing music through the cab, and this one sounds convincing, with no nasties. So you can use it with guitar and a modeller or also as a keyboard cab if you want. 

 

As soon as I finished the design, I started working on a more advanced version  and sent the parts to @Phil Starr  to build up. Phil has tested it and gigged with it and will no doubt be along shortly to give you his opinion.

 

 

Brilliant... Does the advanced version you mention also use the Pulse 10 driver?

[stevie]

No, it uses all neo drivers. It won't be available as a self-build, I'm afraid. 

[Bigwan]

36 minutes ago, stevie said:

No, it uses all neo drivers. It won't be available as a self-build, I'm afraid. 

Not a problem - the lockdown project will be perfect! 

[Phil Starr]

Just a quick update. My band did a proper pub gig! The First in nearly two years. @stevie was kind enough to come along, so we had to give the 110T a run out. In the second set we swapped to try his new super speaker.

 

So the pub was atypical British pub not ideal for live music, originally two bars knocked into a single space. U shaped with is jammed into a tight space in the corner. There were maybe 50 people there and it wasn't rammed so a decent size but not huge. We had no PA support for the bass. For practical reasons the bass cab was jammed into the corner behind the drumkit and out of reach. Soundcheck was minimal, about 90secs. Not ideal and I was mixing so just a matter of setting levels. Far too much bass because of the corner position so I cut that on the bass and just managed to reach across and trim the bass eq back and boost the mids before having to set up the drummer's in ears. He'd forgotten the batteries, not downloaded the app and used my in ears. By this time we were late so just got on with the First set.

 

Said drummer is lovely man 30 years younger than me and well built so he is loud but I had turned the bass down so there was plenty of volume from this tiny cab. We aren't the absolutely loudest band out there but Stevie who arrived to hear the end of the First set said he was surprised how loud we were. That volume is set by the drummer of course. The bass sound where I was seemed ok. It was dominated by resonances from the  corner position and was abit woolly but the horn was doing it's job well and I was getting plenty of detail. Out front Stevie reported that the balance was fine but the bass sound could have been less bass dominated and more mid forward.

 

So conclusions? Well if 50-100people is a medium sized gig then this little speaker will be enough indoors. Sitting on the floor with the speaker backed against the wall you'll be trimming back the bass. For me it worked really well as a monitor in a difficult space. The dispersion characteristics of the horn made my job as a bassist easy. The big plus for me is that I can say for certain that even with it's diminutive size and modest power handling it was really happy matching a very solid drummer.

 

Back at the gig second set and Stevie's new 'super speaker' 🔊 . Well that's his story, but it was super.

[Pea Turgh]

So the 1x10 first set, and a new, as yet unannounced super speaker for 2nd set?

 

@stevie- tell us more!

[JohnDaBass]

15 minutes ago, Pea Turgh said:

So the 1x10 first set, and a new, as yet unannounced super speaker for 2nd set?

 

@stevie- tell us more!

+1

[Rich]

16 minutes ago, Pea Turgh said:

So the 1x10 first set, and a new, as yet unannounced super speaker for 2nd set?

 

@stevie- tell us more!

+2

[Downunderwonder]

Cab in corner is a massive boost to the low end. I did a small show with my 6'' practice amp in the corner!