Back up Amp - or nothing ?

[stewblack]

1 hour ago, Doddy said:

. What I will argue is that not carrying a spare everything is unprofessional.

I did say we all choose what we mean by the word professional. 

[mcnach]

I'm pretty sure the vast majority if not all of us would find a way to make it work when faced with a problem. What I don't get is the semicondescending tone of some towards those who have other preferences. 

[Doddy]

1 hour ago, stewblack said:

I did say we all choose what we mean by the word professional. 

You did, but I still take issue with being classed as unprofessional for not carrying a spare amp (not by you obviously). 

If people want to carry a spare amp, that's cool. I have no issue with that. But it in no way reflects on the professionalism of someone who doesn't, as long as they are still prepared to deal with potential issues.

[Cuzzie]

6 minutes ago, Doddy said:

You did, but I still take issue with being classed as unprofessional for not carrying a spare amp (not by you obviously). 

If people want to carry a spare amp, that's cool. I have no issue with that. But it in no way reflects on the professionalism of someone who doesn't, as long as they are still prepared to deal with potential issues.

But you are prepared so that’s fine.

when I was young and single I would always go out in hope of meeting a young lady and be ‘prepared’ but i have a face for radio so N inherent lack of success - the one time there is a chance - unprepared due to past history - consequence - home alone

[Lozz196]

I think we’re fortunate in these times to be able to carry either a DI/Preamp pedal or small Class D amp as backup, certainly wasn’t possible in the 80s when I started gigging - and even if it had been I’m sure I’d have still spent the money said backup would have cost on lager & vindaloos.

[Ed_S]

I take a spare small amp head.. and the last pedal on my board is a Sansamp.. and I give the sound engineer their feed from a DI box sat on top of my amp rather than the DI-out on the amp itself.

If my amp goes down then ideally I'd like nobody to really notice, and whether I swap it out or not should depend on how good the foldback happens to be. If my board goes down then I want to be able to just grab the end of my floor cable, jam it in the bass and be straight into my DI and amp; if the amp is down as well at that point because my power feed is out then I'm still straight into the DI. If the DI box implodes then I'll swap the cables into the amp and use that DI instead. If I turn up and find that a cab I've been promised hasn't materialised then at worst I'll soundcheck with the Sansamp straight into the desk and grumble profusely about the whole situation later!

I'm certain it will sound like complete overkill to some, but every time I've witnessed an equipment failure it's caused more of a mess than I would personally like to be in the middle of whilst trying to stay in the right frame of mind to play a half decent gig. I feel much more relaxed knowing that I have some contingency plans and that if something still goes wrong then it's not for the want of trying to preempt and mitigate.

[Beer of the Bass]

I'm not sure if it's been said yet, but I feel like the amount of cost and effort that it's justifiable to put into resilience measures (like backup gear) varies greatly with the amount of pressure and the money involved in a given gig. So I could picture  myself taking a lot more precautions with certains kinds of function work than I would for a laid back set in a scruffy pub.

[M@23]

I’ve never taken a spare amp, there’s always been a solution should the need arise. It’s a good idea if you’re playing weddings and use a vocal only PA. I’ve been lucky, never had an issue. Now, I go direct and without planning it so; I’ve got my Stomp, a DI box and a DI out on my wireless unit, or my monitor which could cover a small gig, so I’m pretty well covered!

[Al Krow]

That's useful and reassuring to know Mark. Particularly as you're about as professional as they come!

For most folk playing functions, I suspect their PAs can handle a bit of bass, if needed.

Obviously if you have a PA that is capable of handling vocal only, then DI into it isn't going to be a realistic plan B, but I don't know too many function bands on BC that have vocal only PAs. 

Edited February 21, 2021 by Al Krow

[Al Krow]

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Edited February 21, 2021 by Al Krow
duplicate post

[Dan Dare]

A decent DI box will usually get you out of jail (unless the PA is really cr*p).

[Al Krow]

On 21/02/2021 at 22:35, M@23 said:

I’ve never taken a spare amp, there’s always been a solution should the need arise. It’s a good idea if you’re playing weddings and use a vocal only PA. I’ve been lucky, never had an issue. Now, I go direct and without planning it so; I’ve got my Stomp, a DI box and a DI out on my wireless unit, or my monitor which could cover a small gig, so I’m pretty well covered!

John Paul Jones Interview: Part 3 | ELIXIR Strings - YouTube [3.03] Apparently he only had one bass even when he started with Led Zep.

Damn that must have made taking a spare along a bit tricky...😁

Nice video btw.

[Chienmortbb]

On 20/02/2021 at 01:24, jrixn1 said:

I'd take my RCF 732A over any bass head and 1x12 cab 😀

When these topics come up we all have to remind ourselves that some have tour grade PAs and others can barely support vocals through the FOH.

I would take the RCF as a general backup (if someone gave me one) and could happily use it as a backup. It performs as well as many bass combos. However I would not use it instead of my amp and cab.I don't take a backup but i do take a DI with me although  DI'ing through a PA, unless you have a really good PA, it's a waste of time.

As a good PA will cost orders of magnitude more than a half decent rig, I will stick with my rig. If I want FRFR with a pedal, I go in via the FX return (or aux in) and my cab is both full range and flat. 

However after reading this thread I am now considering a small format amp to fit in my accessory box.

 

 

 

 

 

Edited February 26, 2021 by Chienmortbb

[King Tut]

6 minutes ago, Chienmortbb said:

When these topics come up we all have to remind ourselves that some have tour grade PAs and others can barely support vocals through the FOH.

I would take the RCF as a general backup (if someone gave me one) and could happily use it as a backup. It performs as well as many bass combos. However I would not use it instead of my amp and cab.I don't take a backup but i do take a DI with me although  DI'ing through a PA, unless you have a really good PA, it's a waste of time.

As a good PA will cost orders of magnitude more than a half decent rig, I will stick with my rig. If I want FRFR with a pedal, I go in via the FX return (or aux in) and my cab is both full range and flat. 

However after reading this thread I am now considering a small format amp to fit in my accessory box.

 

 

 

 

 

Pretty much all my gigs have a pro installed PA, but I still take a back up amp (ELF). If my head goes down it's a lot quicker for me to swap 3 leads over rather than faff about getting a DI and monitor mix sorted. It's also useful for when the support band ask if they can use to your rig. I don't like having to reset my amp up just before we start so I always offer to let them use the ELF. 

Of course there's no right or wrong here. It's all down to the individual's band and gear situation, their attitude to risk and the potential consequences of gear failure.

Stay safe y'all! X

[jazzyvee]

Touch wood, I have never had any of my bass own amps fail on me, though I have had a backline rig fail at soundcheck a few times but fortunately in those instances I was able to just go DI and use had monitor.
These days I mostly use a rack system and whilst that has never failed, I know that if the pre-amp fails my bass has a high enough output to drive the power amp directly. The power amp is a stereo one so hopefully one channel will still be ok if there is a fault and if the power amp fails I can still get the signal FOH from the pre-amp DI out.  So it am pretty comfortable with that. Over the last year I have been looking for a small lightweight class D bass head for a compact EUB rig so if I find one, I may take that head as a backup on gigs.

 

[Muzz]

The bands I've gigged with in the last 10 years have all had decent PAs, so while I've taken a rig with me on some larger gigs, I've got the option of going straight from the Stomp to the PA. A lot of the inears gigs are exactly this. I've also got a Behringer BDDi21 in my gig bag that I've never used, but for £20 it's worth leaving there, if only for hoodoo's sake...

I take 2 basses to every gig (mostly because I can, in a double gig bag) and I have spares of all the gigbag stuff like strings, leads, batteries, etc...

[chris_b]

I've had 2 amps fail on a gig and they were both valve amps. In 20 years I've never had an SS or D class amp fail. My Aguilar amps are "flightcased" in aluminium foam lined cases I got from Maplins. The combined weight of 2 amps and 2 cases is about 10lbs so taking both to every gig isn't a hassle at all. I don't get the "buying a backup amp, just in case" idea. I'll often sound check both and use the one that sounds best on the day. 

[gjones]

In the old days of huge heads and combos I couldn't be bothered taking a spare. 

But these days, with class D heads the size of a paperback, it is much easier to keep one handy just in case.

[bassace]

I take a spare class D along not so much out of professionalism but simply to feel comfortable that in the event of an amp  failure I can do a quick plug in. In the same way that I carry a spare set of strings. What pees me off is the player who turns with an amp/keyboard/whatever and a two metre kettle lead. That’s not professional.

Edited February 26, 2021 by bassace

[paulbuzz]

1 hour ago, bassace said:

 What pees me off is the player who turns with an amp/keyboard/whatever and a two metre kettle lead. That’s not professional.

This.

"Uhh... have you got a spare 4-way?"
"No, sorry, I haven't. Where's yours? Did you forget it?"
"No, I just haven't got one. But you've got a spare socket on yours. Will it reach over here?"
"Yes, if I fish it out from where I've tucked it tidily behind/under all my other stuff, and instead drape it (and all my cables that are plugged into it) right across the middle of the room/stage."
"Well, we'd better do that then, because I need to plug my stuff in."
"..."

Although this is not quite as annoying as the time we arrived at a gig to find that the PA guy hadn't finished setting up yet, so we dumped our gear and went off to get a beer while he finished.
On returning, I started to set up my bass gear, only to discover that my 4-way wasn't in my leads bag.
I then noticed that this was because the PA guy had taken it from my bag and used it to plug one of his amp racks in...!
He was quite alarmed and seemingly surprised when I unplugged it... 🙄

Edited February 26, 2021 by paulbuzz

[Owen]

I have never carried a spare amp in nearly 40 years of gigging. The only time my amp did not work was when I wired it up wrongly. I cannot imagine carrying a spare amp. Or bass for that matter. 

[Al Krow]

21 minutes ago, owen said:

I have never carried a spare amp in nearly 40 years of gigging. The only time my amp did not work was when I wired it up wrongly. I cannot imagine carrying a spare amp. Or bass for that matter. 

I envy the fact that you've already done more gigs than I'm ever likely to do and I suspect had a huge amount fun along the way. 

Obviously you were risking irretrievable damage to your "brand" at every gig by having gear that you've been able to rely on and had clearly managed to look after. But sometimes it's good to live life on the edge, eh?! 😁

[peteb]

1 hour ago, owen said:

I have never carried a spare amp in nearly 40 years of gigging. The only time my amp did not work was when I wired it up wrongly. I cannot imagine carrying a spare amp. Or bass for that matter. 

I’ve been gigging for 43 years now and in all that time I’ve needed a spare amp or a spare bass four times each. Obviously, these have included some of the biggest and most important gigs I have ever done (including having to use my spare bass in the gig with the biggest audience I’ve played to the past fifteen years – the drummer didn’t even realise I had used the spare until he saw the video later).

Fortunately, I’ve nearly always carried a spare bass unless there is a reason that makes it completely impractical. Carrying a spare amp is less practical, but I generally have had one to hand. These days I carry a DI and one of those Trace Elliot micro amps in my gigbag. It isn’t really loud enough for proper gig volumes, but it sounds OK and will get you out of trouble if disaster strikes…

Edited February 26, 2021 by peteb

[paulbuzz]

47 minutes ago, owen said:

I have never carried a spare amp in nearly 40 years of gigging.

Same.

Over a similar period of time, my two biggest amp fiascos have both involved the amp vibrating off the top of the cab and hitting the deck:

1) Old Trace Elliot GP11 pre-amp. Very loud bass, very resonant stage.
    Amp hits deck. Carries on working like nothing has happened. I'm completely unaware until my bandmates start gesticulating frantically at me. Shrug and carry on playing.
    Lesson learned: Trace Elliot amps are tough as shi t.

2) My first Class D amp.
    Amp hits deck. Stops working, input socket caved in. Replug directly into PA, bass sounds terrible, finish gig anyway.
    Lesson learned: Class D amps are really light. Put some velcro on the bottom of them.
 

[Chienmortbb]

12 hours ago, paulbuzz said:

Same.

Over a similar period of time, my two biggest amp fiascos have both involved the amp vibrating off the top of the cab and hitting the deck:

1) Old Trace Elliot GP11 pre-amp. Very loud bass, very resonant stage.
    Amp hits deck. Carries on working like nothing has happened. I'm completely unaware until my bandmates start gesticulating frantically at me. Shrug and carry on playing.
    Lesson learned: Trace Elliot amps are tough as shi t.

2) My first Class D amp.
    Amp hits deck. Stops working, input socket caved in. Replug directly into PA, bass sounds terrible, finish gig anyway.
    Lesson learned: Class D amps are really light. Put some velcro on the bottom of them.
 

This is a very salient point. If your amp is too light you may pull it off the cabinet of wherever else you put it. Thank goodness those coiled leads are a thing of the past.