I don't like slap

[inthedoghouse]

52 minutes ago, Chewie said:

I’ve noticed that sometimes people who don’t like slap bass have tried to do it and failed miserably.

 

I'd probably really suck at it, but I'll never find out

[Al Krow]

53 minutes ago, Chewie said:

I’ve noticed that sometimes people who don’t like slap bass have tried to do it and failed miserably.

Actually that's very astute. 

Yup, agreed: if you can do something well on bass, particularly if you can do it tastefully and your audiences appreciate it (and there are several BC'ers who fall into that category when it comes to slap bass technique, whom I admire a lot for their skills) you're pretty unlikely to be slagging it off!

[BillyBass]

1 minute ago, Al Krow said:

Actually that's very astute. 

Yup, agreed: if you can do something well on bass, particularly if you can do it tastefully and your audiences appreciate it (and there are several BC'ers who fall into that category when it comes to slap bass technique, whom I admire a lot for their skills) you're pretty unlikely to be slagging it off!

True but if you don't like most slap bass music but need to learn it for a song your band covers, as in my case, it is difficult to find the motivation.  

I generally have the action on my basses higher than optimum for slap; one of the first things Phil Mann says in his course on slap in SBL is that a low action is essential.  So that means either using two basses or fret rattle and buzz, particularly when using a pick, or leaving the action higher and struggling with slap...which I'm not a fan of anyway.

I will knuckle down and learn it eventually but until then I'll try and wing 'By The Way' with finger style.

[Doctor J]

There are few things as sad as seeing a dog try to learn how to slap.

[Al Krow]

32 minutes ago, BillyBass said:

True but if you don't like most slap bass music but need to learn it for a song your band covers, as in my case, it is difficult to find the motivation.  

Tbf that's also entirely valid! If you really don't like something, especially something you're doing for fun, you're pretty unlikely to put in the effort to get good at it. 

So I guess this becomes very self selecting!

A bit like saying that good 5 string bass players will pretty often be individuals who like playing 5 string basses. 

[Tdw]

33 minutes ago, BillyBass said:

True but if you don't like most slap bass music but need to learn it for a song your band covers, as in my case, it is difficult to find the motivation.  

I generally have the action on my basses higher than optimum for slap; one of the first things Phil Mann says in his course on slap in SBL is that a low action is essential.  So that means either using two basses or fret rattle and buzz, particularly when using a pick, or leaving the action higher and struggling with slap...which I'm not a fan of anyway.

I will knuckle down and learn it eventually but until then I'll try and wing 'By The Way' with finger style.

Definitely a low action helps and light strings, especially for the pops. Trying to slap and pop on a bass with a high action and heavy strings is really making it hard for yourself. A pickup near the bridge helps too. That said you don't have to slap , you can play the songs with a different style if you want.

[grandad]

The 2 things that I really don't care to hear are slap & rap. 

[xgsjx]

8 hours ago, BillyBass said:

True but if you don't like most slap bass music but need to learn it for a song your band covers, as in my case, it is difficult to find the motivation.  

I generally have the action on my basses higher than optimum for slap; one of the first things Phil Mann says in his course on slap in SBL is that a low action is essential.  So that means either using two basses or fret rattle and buzz, particularly when using a pick, or leaving the action higher and struggling with slap...which I'm not a fan of anyway.

I will knuckle down and learn it eventually but until then I'll try and wing 'By The Way' with finger style.

None of this makes logical sense.

It’s like your covers band playing a song that your singer can’t sing, or your guitarist can’t play.  Or even like you playing a different instrument that you’re rubbish on.

Implying having to have such a low action for slap would cause fret rattle and buzz, especially with a pick isn’t true. If your action is so low that you’re getting those, then it’s gonna sound crap when you slap (like my rhyming). The ideal action is one where you can play as fast as your fingers will allow & get no rattles or buzz.  I found a very high action can make it harder for me to play fast (though I suppose it depends on your playing style).

Being in a covers band & having this time off from it for the past year, you should have spent the time to learn new techniques & become a better bassist (I’m not saying your not already a great bassist, but the more you learn, the better you become).

I can play with pick & fingers equally as good, I can play slap, but I struggle with ghost notes & I really struggle with the double thumbing technique, but I keep going back & give it a go. I think it’s more my hand position than anything else.

By the way, By The Way is played with fingers, not slapped. 😂

[Nibody]

9 hours ago, Al Krow said:

Actually that's very astute. 

Yup, agreed: if you can do something well on bass, particularly if you can do it tastefully and your audiences appreciate it (and there are several BC'ers who fall into that category when it comes to slap bass technique, whom I admire a lot for their skills) you're pretty unlikely to be slagging it off!

I think the defining word here is "tastefully". I don't play slap, I have never tried in any seriousness, and have no motivation/desire to learn nor need to do so. However it becomes irritating when anyones percieved ability on the instrument is measured by their ability to perform a niche technique.

Also when listening to a gear demo having someone flex their slap ego tells me nothing about the tonal charachteristics of a bass guitar or amp.

If it serves the song its great, if it purely serves the ego of the player not so much.

[Al Krow]

Completely agree that a slap dominated gear review is often not particularly useful!

Not sure I agree about the live ego performance point, though. The very fact that you're prepared to play in front of a live audience requires an element of 'ego'. If you entertain your audience and they enjoy what you're bringing to the party collectively and individually all the better. 

[SteveXFR]

11 hours ago, Chewie said:

I’ve noticed that sometimes people who don’t like slap bass have tried to do it and failed miserably.

 

I've tried it and can play a few Rage and FNM songs which have a little slap but never tried any songs with lots of slap because there aren't any I like. 

[Belka]

11 hours ago, Chewie said:

I’ve noticed that sometimes people who don’t like slap bass have tried to do it and failed miserably.

 

It seems nobody hates slap more than bass players. I'd imagine in the guitar world you get guitarists 'hating' tapping or sweep picking for the same reason. Or drummers who 'hate' double kick drum playing. Do any of the bassists here who hate slap also hate tapping and sweep picking on guitar, or double bass drum patterns, or does the fact that it's not actually done on bass mean you don't have that intimate emotional connection with those styles?

Edited March 25, 2021 by Belka

[Barking Spiders]

44 minutes ago, Belka said:

It seems nobody hates slap more than bass players. I'd imagine in the guitar world you get guitarists 'hating' tapping or sweep picking for the same reason. Or drummers who 'hate' double kick drum playing. Do any of the bassists here who hate slap also hate tapping and sweep picking on guitar, or double bass drum patterns, or does the fact that it's not actually done on bass mean you don't have that intimate emotional connection with those styles?

As I've said I'm a bit taken aback by the level of anti-slap here on BC. I find it dymanic and exciting.

I'm firstly a drummer and love the double kick drum sound you hear in a lot of metal tunes yet my own playing owes more to the funk styles of Zigaboo Modeliste, Mike Clarke and Bernard Purdie.

[Doddy]

11 hours ago, BillyBass said:

True but if you don't like most slap bass music but need to learn it for a song your band covers, as in my case, it is difficult to find the motivation.  

Surely the motivation is to play the song as well as you can in order to make your bandmates happy or to get rehired, or whatever your situation is?  

1 hour ago, Al Krow said:

Completely agree that a slap dominated gear review is often not particularly useful!

Personally, I find it more useful than demos played with a pick. Mainly because I usually play more with my thumb than with a pick,  but also because I think the difference between fingers and slap is generally greater than between fingers and pick.

1 hour ago, SteveXFR said:

I've tried it and can play a few Rage and FNM songs which have a little slap but never tried any songs with lots of slap because there aren't any I like. 

None at all? Forget Me Nots? Aeroplane? Thank You? Never Too Much?  Higher Ground? Stomp?

Let's be honest, the slap technique is just a way of playing a note, just like playing with a pick or your fingers. It's not the fault of the technique that a lot of people seem to only play octaves in E minor.

[Doctor J]

This line of thought - you don't like slap because you can't do it - is just a little bit silly lads, let's be honest. You wouldn't say "You don't like technical death metal only because you can't play it" out loud and expect it to be taken seriously, so let's accept that people have different tastes and move on. Statistically, yes, someone who doesn't like slap bass is less likely to be proficient at it you'd have to think that it's quite likely, probable even, that they haven't spent time practising the technique as it's something which doesn't have a home on the palette of musical things which give them pleasure. How many slap fiends spend time getting their Atheist or Obscura chops together in order to find out they actually don't like it once they master it? Not many, I will wager. Playing an instrument is supposed to be something you enjoy, no?

It's interesting to see other techniques on guitar and drums mentioned. Just like slapping on bass, guitar shredding and double bass drumming have their time and place and I hope we'd all agree it's not all the time and everywhere. Also, like slap bass, they're frequently the party-piece techniques rolled out when someone wants to show off their chops rather than tastefully play a piece of music. A very brief scan of Youtube will back this up. As a result, it's easy to understand why people take a dislike to them as they frequently soil an otherwise pleasant listening experience. In the right context, however, they can have a very powerful impact but it has got to be musical, first, and technical, second. You see, slap isn't the problem, it's the many bassists without the good sense to employ it tastefully 😁

[Cat Burrito]

It's the style I use the least and the style I rarely listen to, unless it's incorporated into a part of a bass line but I would never write off a technique fully. I am afraid I automatically think less of anyone who posts anti-plectrum comments and I guess that cuts both ways. I slapped on an old punk recording in the 90s because the producer recommended it and it worked a treat.

Some of the tasteful soul playing that spilled out into other genres in the late 70s and early 80s is great. It's not how I play (strictly speaking) but I can appreciate it. Walking into a bass convention to a deafening racket of 80 players slapping the hell out of basses is an experience I would look to file under "not my bag" though.

[Grahambythesea]

Definitely NO. Good way to give yourself arthritis or RSI 👎

[SteveXFR]

26 minutes ago, Doddy said:

 

None at all? Forget Me Nots? Aeroplane? Thank You? Never Too Much?  Higher Ground? Stomp?

Nope. Metal is what I listen to most but even then I don't like Korn or any of the other bands who play nearly all slap. I just dislike the sound of slap other than where used as a percussion effect (Epic by Faith No More for example). 

That's just my particular taste. Im not saying its bad, just that I dislike it. I'm sure many people dislike the heavily overdriven bass sound I like. 

[EBS_freak]

All this talk of Davie. If Davie was a smoking hot girl, would all these white middle aged derogatory comments be so present in conversations? You know as well as I do, it would all be a load of heart eyes emoji, marry me comments and rubbish like that.

I think people have a problem with Davie because he is a better player than them, makes a mint doing something that looks like fun and isn't classed as a "proper job" - and has a certain level of celeb about him. I say fair play to him, he found an avenue for his skills and exploited it. Anybody who says that they wouldn't want to have all the musicality and technique is either in denial or just an outright liar. Put Davie on a gig and he would smash it - without having to slap a note. The slap thing, it's a catchphrase and a gimmick. And catchphrases sell merchandise. He's got the thing completely sewn up.

Me? Slap? Yeah, I can do it - and do it well. Do I do it a lot? Not really - because most of the music that I play doesn't tend to require it.

Do I like slap? Well, the answer to that is yes and no. It depends upon the song. I tend to gravitate towards songs rather than techniques.

It's like all these things, technique is largely about building up muscle memory. Put in the hours doing it, the chances are, you'll be able to do it. A lot of people won't put the hours in though.

[Doddy]

27 minutes ago, SteveXFR said:

Nope. Metal is what I listen to most but even then I don't like Korn or any of the other bands who play nearly all slap. I just dislike the sound of slap other than where used as a percussion effect (Epic by Faith No More for example). 

That's just my particular taste. Im not saying its bad, just that I dislike it. I'm sure many people dislike the heavily overdriven bass sound I like. 

Fair enough.  I think that guys like P Nut, Ryan Martinie, Evan Brewer, and Trevor Dunn have done some really cool metal (or at least metal influenced) slap lines.

[BoomTing]

 

[BillyBass]

4 hours ago, xgsjx said:

None of this makes logical sense.

It’s like your covers band playing a song that your singer can’t sing, or your guitarist can’t play.  Or even like you playing a different instrument that you’re rubbish on.

Implying having to have such a low action for slap would cause fret rattle and buzz, especially with a pick isn’t true. If your action is so low that you’re getting those, then it’s gonna sound crap when you slap (like my rhyming). The ideal action is one where you can play as fast as your fingers will allow & get no rattles or buzz.  I found a very high action can make it harder for me to play fast (though I suppose it depends on your playing style).

Being in a covers band & having this time off from it for the past year, you should have spent the time to learn new techniques & become a better bassist (I’m not saying your not already a great bassist, but the more you learn, the better you become).

I can play with pick & fingers equally as good, I can play slap, but I struggle with ghost notes & I really struggle with the double thumbing technique, but I keep going back & give it a go. I think it’s more my hand position than anything else.

By the way, By The Way is played with fingers, not slapped. 😂

Do you have to be so judgemental?  I posted something pointing out difficulties I was having and you seem to have taken it personally.  

You don't know anything about how much time I spend practising so don't lecture me on what I should be doing with my time.  And no, I'm not a great bassist but I am trying to improve; I normally get about 2 hours of practice in on days off work.

'By the way' is something we decided to learn and have a go at.  We managed one rehearsal with it before the last lockdown in December.  I was under the impression the open E in the riff was slapped, maybe I'm wrong.  

 

[xgsjx]

Sorry if you took offence, it was not my intention & no, I didn’t take your comments personally.
I wasn’t trying to be judgemental, just pointing out that if your band are going to choose songs that have a style that you’re not comfortable playing, then why would they ask you to play them in front of paying customers.  It’s not really fair on you.

You’re right. I have no idea how much practice you get or how good a bassist you are. But my point there is “if” you now have what was band time to now practice on your own and your band have already suggested songs with a bit of slap in them, why not use that found time to learn those parts?  If you don’t have the time, then fair enough, it was merely a suggestion.

I’ve not seen By The Way being played live, so you could be right.

Off to watch it on YouTube. 😎
 

The problem with text is there’s no tonal context. Read my comments in a Bob Ross voice. 

Edited March 25, 2021 by xgsjx

[LeftyP]

It's not that I dislike slapping (I enjoy much of the Level 42 catalogue), it's just that I find it tiring to listen to.

In its place - "Forget Me Nots" by Patrice Rushen and some Luther Vandross tracks, it works very well but overall I prefer much more melodic playing like Paul McCartney and Joe Osborne.  The well known and revered (on this forum) bass players are well above my skill level but their style of playing leaves me cold.  Slapping and popping, showing off their licks, is OK as far as it goes but after about 15 seconds I'm longing for some light and shade and melody.  It's horses for courses and the music I like does not fit well with slap bass.

[BillyBass]

29 minutes ago, xgsjx said:

... just pointing out that if your band are going to choose songs that have a style that you’re not comfortable playing, then why would they ask you to play them in front of paying customers.  It’s not really fair on you.

You’re right. I have no idea how much practice you get or how good a bassist you are. But my point there is “if” you now have what was band time to now practice on your own and your band have already suggested songs with a bit of slap in them, why not use that found time to learn those parts?  If you don’t have the time, then fair enough, it was merely a suggestion.

We haven't played in front of paying customers yet, that will hopefully come later.

We play a few songs together that I have found very difficult and it is normally me that decides on those songs.  I want to be pushed and by picking something out of my comfort zone I am obliged to develop and stretch my comfort zone.  The day I stop learning on the bass is the day I finally put the instrument down.  

I would like to learn how to slap as it's another weapon in the arsenal so to speak.  I am unlikely to use it much with my current band and, RATM and RHCP aside, there isn't much slap music that I listen to but having an ability is never a bad thing.