Researching small 350-500w amps for 'first' amp.

[warwickhunt]

What an eye opener it has been.  

A friend's daughter has joined a gigging band and needs an amp/cab/combo, so I said I'd help guide her/them (caveat being my bias).  She's done a couple of gigs with my TCRS210 cab and my back up amp (TC Staccato).  She was very impressed with those when compared to rehearsal space equipment.  her first thought was buy the same rig 'new' and despite my protestations of getting more bang for buck 'used', she is going down the new route.

As it happens she has found a deal on either a TCRS210 or 212... cab sorted!  The amp side of things less so as the TCRS amps are pricey new and I've guided her away from just buying a cheaper range TC amp as imho they're a different tonal slant.  SO... what amp to get?  This has been the eye opener; I'd not given much thought to new digital amps and their power ratings, features, price AND quality of tone. 

Peavey Mini-max - If anything like Peaveys of old they are often overlooked.

Tech21 VT500 - A powered sansamp pedal at how much?  

Warwick LWA500 - a bit of an unknown for me but reviews seem mixed

Markbass - how many different models do they have now!

I also looked at Ashdown (not my favourite tonal slant but I'm clouded by the older non Class D stuff) and most importantly I trawled BC!  

I'm pleasantly impressed with the range of amps on offer but I'd not realised how hard it might be for a newbie to wade through the competition, especially when shops hardly exist and trying an amp out in isolation in a shop is not a good environment for a newbie.  

NOW she has asked about cables!  😂

[Supernaut]

Secondhand Mark Bass LMII or LMIII. Can you get a bad sound out of those things? 

[fretmeister]

Markbass should now be limited to the Marcus models and the rest.

The Marcus ones have a much better EQ set up and all the freqs are useable rather than the LM3 etc versions.

It's a real shame they haven't used that EQ on the rest as I'm sure there are plenty of youngsters who have never heard MM and plenty of oldiewonks who wouldn't try it because they don't slap. But it's the most versatile amp I've ever owned.

[jrixn1]

33 minutes ago, warwickhunt said:

Tech21 VT500 - A powered sansamp pedal

As you say, this is a "powered pedal".

Continuing in that direction of thought: instead of a head and cab, why not a very flat bass combo without a preamp (the "blank canvas"),  plus a separate preamp pedal (for the "colour/flavour").  Then if she doesn't like the tone or just wants to experiment, either today or in six months or in two years, much easier and cheaper to swap out just a pedal than a head.

This "very flat bass combo without a preamp" is normally called an active PA speaker, and the one I recommend is an RCF 732A.  At £600 and 18kg, it will be cheaper and lighter than your proposed setup of RC210 + head, just as loud, and possibly more clarity.

[franzbassist]

31 minutes ago, fretmeister said:

The Marcus ones have a much better EQ set up and all the freqs are useable rather than the LM3 etc versions

Agreed, the Marcus 250 would be perfect in this situation.

[warwickhunt]

Used is/was off the cards, it needs to be new (Dad paying on the card).  

Markbass was put forward and the Marcus500 seemed to be the obvious choice for me.  

FRFR 'monitor' - yes I did start going down that route and the benefits (I almost did it myself recently but couldn't justify selling am amassed gear... to further more GAS) but the trad route of amp and cab was their preferred option.  Oddly she's actually a brass player (very good) but has recently branched off to bass.  

Now I have to convince them to just buy a good quality set of cables and not to buy cheap shyte. 

 

[Phil Starr]

I've got a Peavey Minimax (the older model with the chicken knobs) and a Markbass Tube, an LMIII with a tube pre-amp. I prefer the Peavey which just sounds more authoritative out of the box and has a nice array of tone enhancements. The downside is a noisy cooling fan in the Peavey.

[BassAdder60]

I’ve looked at this a few months back and in the end got the Ashdown RM800

The RM500 is great too

Had a Markbass LM111 a while back and it’s a nice amp but wasn’t for me

Peavey Minimax ruined by noisy fan even the new version suffers this 

Many rave about TC stuff but some say they are a bit sterile sounding ??

I think most Class D heads are very similar in truth with a few different features and tone tweeking ability.

A very good low cost 500W no frills amp is the Ashdown Original 500 

I also tried Ampeg PF800 but it wasn’t for me either.

Plus Ashdown are U.K. based and offer 5yr warranty and great service if needed

They also do good cabs too 

[Lozz196]

I found that the core tone of TC & Markbass to be quite similar, so as she liked the TC amp but there aren’t enough funds to cover a new one then I’d check the Marcus 500. My personal recommendation would be the Ashdown RM500 though.

[machinehead]

I've owned Markbass LM1 and LM2.  Both are great amps but I'm going to speak up for the Peavey miniMax.  These just sound excellent and are very well priced.  As mentioned, the fan is a bit noisy at home but inaudible at rehearsal or on a gig.

I bought mine as a backup to my Thunderfunk, but it often gets gigged because it just does the job so well.

Frank.

[Dan Dare]

I wouldn't worry about "noisy" fans. The drums will drown it out.

[Stealth]

Errr

what kind of music 

what bass

any fave tones 

[warwickhunt]

9 hours ago, Stealth said:

Errr

what kind of music 

what bass

any fave tones 

Sorry, I should have been clearer.  It wasn't so much wanting more recommendations, as a reflection on how things have moved on/muddied. 

As it happens she plays in a 'pop' band (is that a real thing?), with a pair of female vocalists.  She's got a short scale Squier Jag bass but looking at other options to possibly change.  Fave tones is tricky as she just needs to sit in the mix and as she is a classically trained brass player she isn't hung up on bass influences etc.  

I believe that she has committed to the Peavey.

[Stealth]

Good little amps the mini. The minimega not so imho. I would have gone there or and LM3 

[Dr.Dave]

Just reading folks views on the Minimax's noisy cooling fan. I have one as a gigging tool and it's possibly the best amp I've owned . It's size is a blessing. It's feature packed.  In built tuner - smashing. Sits on top of my two tiny barefaced cabs and copes with a noisy valve guitarist and big hitting drummer without needing to be cranked up even to half way.  Fan noise - rehearsal or gig , no problem whatsoever , you just don't hear it.

 

BUT

 

Surely considering it's price point and size this is the sort of amp that many players who don't gig regularly will be interested in. Or - like me - gigging players want to set it up in the house for a bit of practise or general noodling about. If so - the fan noise will annoy the hell out of you like it does me. I was reckoning on it being so compact I could dispense with any form of practise amp for home use. I was wrong. So for home users or sole amp owning giggers wanting to use it at home a lot - forget it.

 

 

[BassAdder60]

I tried one ( the early Minimax ) and you’re right it sounds like air conditioning lol 

 

Sent it back ASAP 

 

Apart from that it’s ok 

 

Far better amps out there Ashdown, Orange etc etc ( I have both ) 

[Al Krow]

If you don't mind have additional power on tap (circa 750W to 800W), then worth also checking out the Bugera Veyron BV1001M or T. I've got the M as a back-up amp and several of us are happily using one of the two models as our main gigging amp.

DV 247 currently have them on sale new for sub £200: Bugera BV1001M Veyron Mosfet Head | DV247 | en-GB

[Chienmortbb]

34 minutes ago, Al Krow said:

If you don't mind have additional power on tap (circa 750W to 800W), then worth also checking out the Bugera Veyron BV1001M or T. I've got the M as a back-up amp and several of us are happily using one of the two models as our main gigging amp.

DV 247 currently have them on sale new for sub £200: Bugera BV1001M Veyron Mosfet Head | DV247 | en-GB

I agree but the fan is not quiet on mine.  Look out for how to quieten a fan thread soon. I wonder why no one has a stage/studio switch like some amps had in the past?

Edited August 9, 2021 by Chienmortbb

[warwickhunt]

Just now, Chienmortbb said:

I agree but the fan is not quiet on mine.  Look out for how to quieten a fan thread soon.

The fan is also noisy on the Bugera Veyron?  

[Chienmortbb]

4 minutes ago, Chienmortbb said:

I agree but the fan is not quiet on mine.  Look out for how to quieten a fan thread soon.

Its not as bad as some but you can hear it in a home setting.

Edited August 9, 2021 by Chienmortbb

[Chienmortbb]

3 minutes ago, warwickhunt said:

The fan is also noisy on the Bugera Veyron?  

Sorry for some reason my computer keeps posting twice.

Edited August 9, 2021 by Chienmortbb

[Al Krow]

59 minutes ago, warwickhunt said:

The fan is also noisy on the Bugera Veyron?  

 

57 minutes ago, Chienmortbb said:

Its not as bad as some but you can hear it in a home setting.

It's audible, but actually not an issue for me at all even when playing at home and it's entirely lost the moment you start playing. My DG M900 AO is quieter, for sure, but costs a LOT more. My favourite amp is actually my Mesa M6 which is home use only for me given its weight, but has an awesome tone! The M6 fan is actually nosier than the the BV, which was a pleasant surprise for me given the fact this had been raised as an issue by others with the amp.

 

We all have different fan-noise tolerance levels - mine is certainly above what the BV is producing. And at £200 you're not going to find a better featured amp (e.g. 3 band EQ with semi-para mids, built in comp, 750W+ at 4ohms).

[Dr.Dave]

I read somewhere - apologies if it was here - that the grill itself on the minimax is responsible for most of the noise and that putting little spacers on the fan mount bolts holds it away from the case , reducing the noise.....

 

...but I can't be bothered trying it so it's just what I read 

 

 

[Marvin]

The MiniMax's fan is a bit disconcerting to start with, but it doesn't bother me after using it a few times. It's nowhere near as annoying as the noise some guitar amps make...all that buzzing and stuff.

 

For the money it's a good little bundle. Plenty of power, good tone and sound and plenty of features. I prefer the MiniMax to the Aguilar TH350 I had.

[lemmywinks]

The Harley Benton Block heads must be worth considering surely? £249 for the 800 version looks like a lot of amp for the money, compression is supposed to be nice enough too.

 

https://www.thomann.de/gb/harley_benton_block_300b.htm

https://www.thomann.de/gb/harley_benton_block_800b.htm