warwickhunt Posted June 14, 2021 Author Share Posted June 14, 2021 1 hour ago, wateroftyne said: Ah man... that's outrageous. I hope you get it - or your money - soon. 😞 I'm 100% certain that I'll not see the cab (via the sale in question), I'm 99% certain that the seller is a lying cretin, I'm not putting a percentage on me getting a refund any time soon because it involves eBay and Paypal (now passing the buck)... we shall see. Up until this incident I've been of the opinion that as a seller eBay/Paypal is fraught with hazards and areas where you can get scammed/ripped off. However, I thought as a buyer it was pretty much bomb-proof and the exact opposite to the situation for a seller. My experience is revealing a whole minefield of situations. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zbd1960 Posted June 14, 2021 Share Posted June 14, 2021 This is now fraud and there is little excuse for you not to be refunded Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LukeFRC Posted June 14, 2021 Share Posted June 14, 2021 2 hours ago, warwickhunt said: eBay/Paypal have had a few changes of late. eBay made me wait 10 days for him to attempt delivery and then it was transferred to Paypal... who say I have to wait 7 days while they contact eBay for details! Luckily I paid on my credit card through Paypal but if I need to go down that route I'll be involving Action Fraud and the Police (not sure if it will be of help but my wife works for the Police) as it is theft from me rather than him. is it though? You've paid cash for an item, the seller is given the option of either shipping it (and therefor being able to prove delivery via the shippers) or having you collect it showing the pass code/ QR code that eBay provide. ... so from eBay's point of view the guy has done neither so you should lean on them for your money back. Just cos the guys made a crap story up doesn't mean that suddenly he gets to keep the cash and the cab is stolen from you at his front door... 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
warwickhunt Posted June 14, 2021 Author Share Posted June 14, 2021 7 minutes ago, zbd1960 said: This is now fraud and there is little excuse for you not to be refunded I know it, you know it, pretty much everyone who has viewed this knows it... but it is down to Paypal to investigate (with the help of eBay) and to decide. The guy doesn't have a leg to stand on because nobody hands over something like this to a stranger knocking on the door; I'll say again that even I don't have his address yet, so no idea how he expects to convince anyone that a fraudster managed to get it. The eBay system for collection requires him to scan a code, I can guarantee that hasn't been done because I haven't requested the code... due to the fact I paid him £30 to have it shipped to the other end of the country! Confused Luke - I didn't pay cash, I paid via Paypal, funds from my CC. eBay say it is a Paypal matter as that was my payment method. I've started a case but need to wait 7 days for the guy to reply via ebay. An unnecessary delay as the guy knows he should just refund me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bagsieblue Posted June 14, 2021 Share Posted June 14, 2021 1 hour ago, warwickhunt said: I'm 100% certain that I'll not see the cab (via the sale in question), I'm 99% certain that the seller is a lying cretin, I'm not putting a percentage on me getting a refund any time soon because it involves eBay and Paypal (now passing the buck)... we shall see. Up until this incident I've been of the opinion that as a seller eBay/Paypal is fraught with hazards and areas where you can get scammed/ripped off. However, I thought as a buyer it was pretty much bomb-proof and the exact opposite to the situation for a seller. My experience is revealing a whole minefield of situations. The guy in question, fairly local to me, contacts me regularly with offers of exactly 50per cent (always that amount) of the asking price with the comment of "xxx cash collected today". You'll be fine on this warwickhunt, he can't prove you've had it. It's inconvenient but you'll need to wait for it to play out and you'll get a refund. Shortly after its a safe bet the cab will resurface. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
warwickhunt Posted June 14, 2021 Author Share Posted June 14, 2021 Just now, bagsieblue said: The guy in question, fairly local to me, contacts me regularly with offers of exactly 50per cent (always that amount) of the asking price with the comment of "xxx cash collected today". You'll be fine on this warwickhunt, he can't prove you've had it. It's inconvenient but you'll need to wait for it to play out and you'll get a refund. Shortly after its a safe bet the cab will resurface. I wondered if anyone would message me or comment re. knowing the seller as he seems to sell a fair bit of gear on eBay and there must be some BCers who are near to Clitheroe! The inconvenience of having £230 locked up in a dispute for 2 weeks (to date) and possibly longer, is just that - inconvenient 'to me'. If someone desperately needed their cash it could be very different for them. Oddly enough, if I'd had the time to drive to Clitheroe to collect it, I'd have done so... and popped in to buy your Streamer while I was in the area. I'll be watching for said cab popping back up when this is all sorted. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bagsieblue Posted June 14, 2021 Share Posted June 14, 2021 9 minutes ago, warwickhunt said: I know it, you know it, pretty much everyone who has viewed this knows it... but it is down to Paypal to investigate (with the help of eBay) and to decide. The guy doesn't have a leg to stand on because nobody hands over something like this to a stranger knocking on the door; I'll say again that even I don't have his address yet, so no idea how he expects to convince anyone that a fraudster managed to get it. The eBay system for collection requires him to scan a code, I can guarantee that hasn't been done because I haven't requested the code... due to the fact I paid him £30 to have it shipped to the other end of the country! Confused Luke - I didn't pay cash, I paid via Paypal, funds from my CC. eBay say it is a Paypal matter as that was my payment method. I've started a case but need to wait 7 days for the guy to reply via ebay. An unnecessary delay as the guy knows he should just refund me. Beat me to it on most of my post while I was typing. Strange backstory on this one though with the story someone else has taken it. When I've won stuff cheap on eBay I've had get out reasons of....oh just found a fault when packing it, I knocked it over when packing...so I'll just refund you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bagsieblue Posted June 14, 2021 Share Posted June 14, 2021 1 minute ago, warwickhunt said: I wondered if anyone would message me or comment re. knowing the seller as he seems to sell a fair bit of gear on eBay and there must be some BCers who are near to Clitheroe! The inconvenience of having £230 locked up in a dispute for 2 weeks (to date) and possibly longer, is just that - inconvenient 'to me'. If someone desperately needed their cash it could be very different for them. Oddly enough, if I'd had the time to drive to Clitheroe to collect it, I'd have done so... and popped in to buy your Streamer while I was in the area. I'll be watching for said cab popping back up when this is all sorted. Yep - all agreed. Clitheroe is quite nice!! Got a few ex bandmates in that neck of the woods too. For what it's worth, I think I vaguely have had other contact with him over the years. Thinking back many years ....I recall a Noel Redding Fender Jazz / Clitheroe Connection - that I was going to go and view and he cancelled on the day at very short notice. Fairly sure he lurks on here or views without an account / logging in. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
warwickhunt Posted June 14, 2021 Author Share Posted June 14, 2021 13 minutes ago, bagsieblue said: Strange backstory on this one though with the story someone else has taken it. When I've won stuff cheap on eBay I've had get out reasons of....oh just found a fault when packing it, I knocked it over when packing...so I'll just refund you. The odd thing is that I've just looked at his feedback and it turns out he sold this very same cab back in April and received feedback for the sale! No idea what that is about! https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/154398118747 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doctor J Posted June 14, 2021 Share Posted June 14, 2021 Maybe he's not lying when he said a guy came and collected it, just that the collection happened in April? I can't see you not getting a refund from ebay/paypal. This situation is incredibly fishy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NickD Posted June 14, 2021 Share Posted June 14, 2021 I'm sure PP will play ball. I bought some drum cases for my partner that were collection only a couple of months ago. He opted for PP over cash which surpirised me (guess he wanted to make sure I'd turn up). We had to swap codes before PP would release the money, we were both surprised at how tight the process was. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hubrad Posted June 14, 2021 Share Posted June 14, 2021 12 minutes ago, warwickhunt said: The odd thing is that I've just looked at his feedback and it turns out he sold this very same cab back in April and received feedback for the sale! No idea what that is about! https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/154398118747 Even that looks fishy.. listing says sold for £199 plus postage, where feedback says sold for £179.95 and *glowing* feedback! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
warwickhunt Posted June 14, 2021 Author Share Posted June 14, 2021 Let's be honest... you'd not hand over something to someone turning up on your door with no proof of ID etc especially when the buyer lives 3 hours away and they've paid you up front for the courier. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
warwickhunt Posted June 14, 2021 Author Share Posted June 14, 2021 UPDATE The BC community moves in mysterious ways! I now have a name and FB profile for this guy - I'm going to give him time (and the benefit of the doubt) to square up with me. If he has indeed been scammed then that is his problem, not mine (I'm assuming he has informed the Police and has a crime number?). Refunding me is the legal and moral thing, let's see how quick it happens. 11 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jean-Luc Pickguard Posted June 14, 2021 Share Posted June 14, 2021 (edited) It won't do any harm in the meantime to contact your creditcard company and instigate a chargeback. Tell them the full saga and how ebay/paypal is making you wait for your money to be possibly returned. Edited June 14, 2021 by Jean-Luc Pickguard 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bass_dinger Posted June 14, 2021 Share Posted June 14, 2021 3 hours ago, bagsieblue said: When I've won stuff cheap on eBay I've had get out reasons of....oh just found a fault when packing it, I knocked it over when packing...so I'll just refund you. It does happen - I sold a pair of AR18s Hifi speakers, which my grandson genuinely knocked over and damaged while the auction was running! I had to check my photos to see if the damage was originally there, until my wife told me what I had happened. I offered a refund, or a discount, but the buyer was happy to go ahead with the purchase, which was for a refurbishment project. I felt very embarrassed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bagsieblue Posted June 14, 2021 Share Posted June 14, 2021 22 minutes ago, bass_dinger said: It does happen - I sold a pair of AR18s Hifi speakers, which my grandson genuinely knocked over and damaged while the auction was running! I had to check my photos to see if the damage was originally there, until my wife told me what I had happened. I offered a refund, or a discount, but the buyer was happy to go ahead with the purchase, which was for a refurbishment project. I felt very embarrassed. I'm sure it does. I've had similar comments back a handful of times when won things cheaply. Often times they pop us again for sale with no mention of the damage that prevented a previous sale. I was passing comment on there being seemingly easier ways to weasel out of an eBay deal than some far fetched someones already collected it story. . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
warwickhunt Posted June 23, 2021 Author Share Posted June 23, 2021 UPDATE TO THE UPDATE... I stated a dispute with eBay re this matter; eBay handed this over to Paypal as that is how I paid. Despite being given repeated opportunities to give ANY response re this matter Peter Barton (aka 'vintageinvestments' on eBay) refused to engage in the dispute process (quell surprise) and Paypal have refunded me. Why this guy has dragged this out is beyond me. He clearly did not hand over the cab to a stranger knocking on his door claiming to have won it... how could anyone know he had sold it on eBay and how the hell did they get his address when even I didn't have it? You just wouldn't would you? The main thing is that in about 30 days I'll have the funds credited back to my credit card (almost 7 weeks after paying) and with the assistance of BC I know a lot more about Mr Barton and I'm wise to him should I ever have the pleasure of meeting him professionally/in person. Oh and I'm still in the market for a TKS cab. 9 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheGreek Posted June 23, 2021 Share Posted June 23, 2021 Glad it worked out in the end... I've had sellers renege on deals when they didn't get what they'd hoped for/ expected - unfortunately that's the nature of auctions. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BassedinBucks Posted June 23, 2021 Share Posted June 23, 2021 59 minutes ago, warwickhunt said: Despite being given repeated opportunities to give ANY response re this matter Peter Barton (aka 'vintageinvestments' on eBay) refused to engage in the dispute process Is that the Peter Barton from The Animals who lives in Clitheroe? Runs Peter Barton Management? Or different one? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
warwickhunt Posted June 23, 2021 Author Share Posted June 23, 2021 11 minutes ago, BassedinBucks said: Is that the Peter Barton from The Animals who lives in Clitheroe? Runs Peter Barton Management? Or different one? There's a clear evidence trail that it is indeed the same person. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wateroftyne Posted June 23, 2021 Share Posted June 23, 2021 Glad it’s sorted! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Huge Hands Posted June 23, 2021 Share Posted June 23, 2021 17 minutes ago, warwickhunt said: There's a clear evidence trail that it is indeed the same person. If it is, I worked with him a couple of times about 20 years ago when he was in a Creedence Clearwater thing that also morphed into a version of the Animals mid weekend. i thought he was a bit of an arrogant k**b at times but didn't think he would be capable of that. Glad you got it sorted. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lozz196 Posted June 23, 2021 Share Posted June 23, 2021 1 hour ago, TheGreek said: Glad it worked out in the end... I've had sellers renege on deals when they didn't get what they'd hoped for/ expected - unfortunately that's the nature of auctions. Happened to me once, won a bass at the reserve price, seller contacted me to say the volume pot wasn’t working, wouldn’t be fair to sell it to me so was withdrawing it. I could have argued as a volume pot isn’t a huge cost but at that point I didn’t want the seller to have any of my money, irrespective. It was advertised a while after with a surprising lack of boasting about the shiny new volume pot it surely must have had. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
warwickhunt Posted June 23, 2021 Author Share Posted June 23, 2021 17 minutes ago, Huge Hands said: If it is, I worked with him a couple of times about 20 years ago when he was in a Creedence Clearwater thing that also morphed into a version of the Animals mid weekend. i thought he was a bit of an arrogant k**b at times but didn't think he would be capable of that. Glad you got it sorted. Before this was resolved and during my digging, every person who knows him has generally 100% been negative about him. BTW his FB profile (inc CCR band pics/promo etc) has him touting the TKS bass cab for sale. I've taken screen shots of all this stuff as I'd not want him to delete it all and claim it is all made up. I also found on his ebay feedback profile that he sold this same cab a couple of months back (feedback received by him for the cab with identical serial number). Now he either took the cab back because it was a duffer (then why relist it again) or he was simply planning on conning me and hoping he'd get away with the tale of someone collecting the cab. You have to basically judge; what would a decent and reasonable person have done... not what this guy has done patently, for whatever reason! Either way and any way it is pitched, he could have simply refunded me and not let this drag on, especially as it'll take weeks to get refunded to my credit card. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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