Is British rock and metal now a cottage industry?

[Barking Spiders]

So, the covid pilot festival at Download winds up tonight. An all British affair the headliners have been Enter Shikari, Frank Carter and the Rattlesnakes and Bullet for My Valentine. In a normal Download year, these bands typically play on the satellite stages while US and EU bands  pretty much hog the space on the 3 main ones, the exceptions being veterans like Maiden, Def Leppard, Ozzy Osborne and one or two current UK bands like Biffy Clyro. Once those former three retire/die off are there any Brit bands who could compete for the prime slots over the coming years?

[Lozz196]

I’m surprised Frank Carter & Rattlesnakes are at Download, but then I suppose there is an area of crossover between punk & metal.

[Stub Mandrel]

Phil Cambell and the Bastard Sons - if they find a new vocalist?

Thunder?

Black Star Riders?

Or am I being naive?

Edited June 20, 2021 by Stub Mandrel

[Chaosanator]

To be honest I don't think Download will quite be the same once Maiden et al retire.

[Geek99]

I don’t think they will ever retire will they ? They must all be very late fifties at least now

[peteb]

12 minutes ago, Geek99 said:

I don’t think they will ever retire will they ? They must all be very late fifties at least now

Early to mid sixties (plus) actually! 

[Jonesy]

I'm never that impressed with the main stage headliners at download. It's (pretty much) always a bunch of bands who were massive 30-40 years ago and there never seems to be anyone new or on the up headlining. Don't get me wrong, I like a lot of these bands, but it'd be nice if the organisers backed some new blood rather than it rotating between kiss, iron maiden and Def leppard et al. Who knows, maybe that's the only way to sell tickets? 

There are good bands out there, but admittedly, they're not as 'big' as the usual headliners. Maybe because hard rock/metal had its hay day when the old guard were in their prime?

[Downunderwonder]

Garage Rock is dead. Long live Cottage Rock.

[Waddo Soqable]

1 hour ago, Downunderwonder said:

Garage Rock is dead. Long live Cottage Rock.

Rob Halford would approve no doubt..

[police squad]

I've recently discovered FM. Got tickets to see them, can't wait, oh and the Quireboys

[Barking Spiders]

11 hours ago, Stub Mandrel said:

Phil Cambell and the Bastard Sons - if they find a new vocalist?

Thunder?

Black Star Riders?

Or am I being naive?

Hmm well Thunder have been around for donkeys and have never exactly packed out stadiums and shifted platinum albums. As for Black Star Riders, again they're no spring chickens and are mostly American

[Merton]

There are a reasonable few decent new(ish) UK bands - whether they can make the leap is another matter entirely. To name a few...:

Those Damn Crows

The Dust Coda

Tax The Heat

Mason Hill

Massive Wagons

Edited June 21, 2021 by Merton
smelling pistake

[redbandit599]

Muse put in a good headline set at Download fairly recently - even my 'traditional' rock and metal fan mates enjoyed them, but were pretty skeptical at first.

[MacDaddy]

 

First post of this thread:

Flea commented on how all the big rock bands such as RHCP, Metallica, Foo Fighters, U2 are still going and are the only bands that can fill big arenas. As if a wall was erected in the late 90’s and no one can get over it.

 

 

[tegs07]

Sorry I started this one feel free to merge/delete as appropriate. I am interested in old school approaches such as touring and small gigs rather than festivals and social media as a possible reason why the old rock dinosaurs are still going strong.

[Woodinblack]

14 minutes ago, tegs07 said:

Sorry I started this one feel free to merge/delete as appropriate. I am interested in old school approaches such as touring and small gigs rather than festivals and social media as a possible reason why the old rock dinosaurs are still going strong.

I believe (litteraly like on the other thread, genre unspecific), its not the old school approaches or that rock dinosaurs are still going strong, its that those old rock groups have a following that I don't think it is possible to get today. They got their following when it was still possible to get it.

This is why there is no one to replace them and why groups today doing exactly the same thing as groups did before won't get anything like the following that those groups got.

Not just rock, how many groups are there actually? Look at the charts, how many groups get in the charts at all? Its mostly solo singers (or singers featuring..).

[tegs07]

Just now, Woodinblack said:

I believe (litteraly like on the other thread, genre unspecific), its not the old school approaches or that rock dinosaurs are still going strong, its that those old rock groups have a following that I don't think it is possible to get today. They got their following when it was still possible to get it.

This is why there is no one to replace them and why groups today doing exactly the same thing as groups did before won't get anything like the following that those groups got.

Not just rock, how many groups are there actually? Look at the charts, how many groups get in the charts at all? Its mostly solo singers (or singers featuring..).

I think the old school guys got on the road to escape the tedium of every day life and see a bit of the world and have a laugh. They started of as not particularly good, with little expectations of a career let alone any money and got great through repetition and creating their own scenes. This (after Covid) must still be achievable. The motivation can’t be record sales anymore as they don’t really exist even if the bands are household names.

[Barking Spiders]

2 hours ago, Merton said:

There are a reasonable few decent new(ish) UK bands - whether they can make the leap is another matter entirely. To name a few...:

Those Damn Crows

The Dust Coda

Tax The Heat

Mason Hill

Massive Wagons

Planet Rock like playing these a lot but TBH I don't see or hear anything that'll  take the world by storm

[Merton]

5 minutes ago, Barking Spiders said:

Planet Rock like playing these a lot but TBH I don't see or hear anything that'll  take the world by storm

Indeed. They’re good (I have a soft spot for Those Damn Crows and Tax The Heat) but they’re not next level good I don’t think sadly.

[Jonesy]

Hopefully it's just a lull in the cycle rather than it being the death of rock or groups.

Much of the last batch of big established groups seemed to come about in the 90s where there was a be a bit of a 60s mod revival in fashion and social taste that led to indie bands in the UK and then in punk in the US that led to grunge.

Just an idea and I've got nothing that backs this, but hopefully it means were due a resurgence in guitar based groups, rather than listening to charts filled with whatever X factor based dullness that gets churned out!

[Dad3353]

I think it's a cycle that is still turning. How many pubs (remember them..?) have a 'joanna' for an 'everyone in the bar' singalong..? T'was all the rage, not so long ago. Is there going to be a resurgence of skiffle..? One or two local hot-spots, but I doubt it becoming, once again, the focus. Disco dancing..? It was massive for a decade, but is now just a side-line. I'd say it's the same for rock groups. In the Twenties, it was roller skating. Roller rinks (sometimes several...) in every town. They were converted to cinemas when the fashion changed. Then cinemas, in their turn, became bingo halls, which evolved into furniture stores, and are now mostly empty, I think. It's a wheel, still turning; it seldom turns backwards. Nostalgia is all that's left, for each generation. The present and future generations will be exactly the same, looking in their rear-view mirror. It's normal; nothing to see here. 

[Supernaut]

I wouldn't be surprised to see Greta Van Fleet headlining something like Coachella soon. 

[Stub Mandrel]

I don't see the likes of Taylor Swift and Lady Gaga struggling to fill stadia.

So why has rock, which is still popular, not got mass appeal any more?

[DawnPatroller]

5 hours ago, Woodinblack said:

I believe (litteraly like on the other thread, genre unspecific), its not the old school approaches or that rock dinosaurs are still going strong, its that those old rock groups have a following that I don't think it is possible to get today. They got their following when it was still possible to get it.

This is why there is no one to replace them and why groups today doing exactly the same thing as groups did before won't get anything like the following that those groups got.

 

I agree. Look at the success of NWOBHM in the 80's. Those guys were in the right place at the right time, nothing more nothing less. Okay, they eventually got to quit their jobs and hone their craft full time which generally improved their outputs. It's the very definition of gap in the market.

Also, clever marketing happening now is holding on to that aged fan base - that's why there's metal cruises and metal craft beer all for the taking. It's the demographic. KISS even have their own golf clubs and skis in their merchandise now. Such a simple idea and it's hit the spot once again.

[skankdelvar]

2 hours ago, Dad3353 said:

How many pubs (remember them..?) have a 'joanna' for an 'everyone in the bar' singalong..?

As in so many matters, you are entirely correct that time elapses and that cycles may (or may not) occur. There are also proximate causes which bear upon the rise and fall of certain customs and the institutions which exist to serve them.

People went to pubs for a singalong because their houses were cold, there was bugger-all to do at home and you couldn't get booze anywhere else after six o'clock.

The decline in public houses and the communal spirit which buoyed them up may therefore be attributed to:

* The widespread installation of central heating (you no longer have to go down the pub to keep warm)

* The inception of television (something interesting you can do at home apart from read a book or play a game)

* The liberalisation of laws and the growth of the supermarket sector which brought a wider availability of cheap, shop-bought alcohol

There's probably a similar, short list of reasons why rock (and to a lesser extent, metal) have dropped off the twig but that's for someone else to compile.