Singers who don't understand how music works

[Nail Soup]

Not sure why, but thinking back to a episode in my music 'career'.

A guy I worked with was a drummer, and we liked similar music, so we decided to do music together.

After  while we got chatting to another guy at work. He had image (and music taste) somewhere between rockabilly and Psychobilly. 

Turns out he had a decent enough singing voice, a A4 folder full of lyrics and seemed like would have been good on stage.

Eventually it turned out that he didn't have a clue about music. He would join in anywhere in the bar, with the expectation that the rest of the band would fall in line.

He made ridiculous suggestions about what the players should do (like not playing the D string on the bass).

 

The drummer was a happy-go-lucky type who kind of laughed it off, but I quit. The band eventually ground to a halt - meanwhile I reunited with the drummer in parallel and we formed a decent originals band with my brother and an old uni mate of the drummer.

 

Anyone got any stories of singers who don't know about music... even they had some other good qualities?

 

[Bolo]

Well, there's me...

[SteveXFR]

Sounds like a guitarist I played with for a couple months. He knew power chords and no other chords, I tried showing him bar chords but he "don't need that stinky poo". He would randomly change key and/or time signature when jamming. He claimed to have been playing for 30 years. He was a very, very heavy stoner. We parted ways. He still texts randomly asking if I want to meet up for a jam.

[Lozz196]

A guitarist and old friend of mine joined the band I was in. The others voted him in. He didn’t have an amp or transport, and his single coil feedback Strat was no good for our music, so we had to source everything for him. Which would have been fine…

We wanted a great lead player, and he was that, but he just couldn’t remember where the solos were in each song.

They were after the second chorus. In every song. No Carol Vordernans required to count to two. Wrong it seemed.

After a while I got fed up so said I wouldn’t be in the band with him anymore. So they sacked him. Didn’t bother me which way they went to be honest, would have been equally happy if they’d stuck with him.

[Barking Spiders]

15 minutes ago, SteveXFR said:

Sounds like a guitarist I played with for a couple months. He knew power chords and no other chords, I tried showing him bar chords but he "don't need that stinky poo". He would randomly change key and/or time signature when jamming. He claimed to have been playing for 30 years. He was a very, very heavy stoner. We parted ways. He still texts randomly asking if I want to meet up for a jam.

I'm of the opinion that power chords are for those who can't play barre chords

[Dan Dare]

11 minutes ago, Barking Spiders said:

I'm of the opinion that power chords are for those who can't play barre chords

I'm of the opinion that power cords are what supplies electricity to your gear

[Waddo Soqable]

11 minutes ago, Barking Spiders said:

I'm of the opinion that power chords are for those who can't play barre chords

Certainly true in my case !

[zbd1960]

I've encountered similar, although in a very different context... I don't sing solo, but I am a very experienced choral singer. We would occasionally get people wanting to join the chamber choir I sang in - a lot of our repertoire was a cappella (unaccompanied) - you very quickly discovered that some of these people had no idea. This included basic things like not all parts have got 'the tune', and the reason we have a conductor is so that we're all singing the correct things at the correct time. Then there's the issue of blend.... Fortunately we had a policy of trial periods which gave us the option to say 'no thank you'.

Won't be everyone's cup of tea as it's not exactly rock n roll, but this is an example of the kind of things we sang (I'm not religious, but a lot of choral music has its origins there). I would sing the baritone line, which partway through merges with the bass line https://youtu.be/5AOwGE0KuRI.  

Edited June 28, 2021 by zbd1960

[uk_lefty]

I had a "singer" trying to form a band call me up. Made me give chapter and verse on my bass cv etc and gave quite judgemental hmmms and uhuhs. Then I asked about her experience "I've never been in a band but my boyfriend says I'm good" was her reply. At the time I was a keen sportsman and was thinking of digging up my Scottish heritage to have one last crack at international competition for the upcoming under 21 World Cup. I used this as my excuse why I couldn't be as committed as she expected for her project "WHAT??!! You'd rather do that than be in a band with ME??!!!" was the final thing she said before I hung up, not sure whether to laugh or... I don't know! 

[SteveXFR]

9 hours ago, Barking Spiders said:

I'm of the opinion that power chords are for those who can't play barre chords

There's a place for both since they sound different and serve a different purpose. 

[PaulWarning]

maybe I'm being incredible thick but I always thought that power chords were partial barre chords, like Johnny Ramone Steve Jones, Billy Joe Armstrong etc

[Cat Burrito]

I hate musical snobbery when combined with stupidity. In Sixth Form my guitarist gave a long lengthy rant about how nobody can ever cover the Beatles. At the end of it I said, "what do you know about the Beatles?" which was met with the sincerest of replies, "It's George Lennon and that!" Over 30 years later and I still haven't forgotten that line.

[JapanAxe]

Personally I’ve had more grief with guitarists who don’t understand how music works, e.g.:

- Assuming the first chord of a song is its key;

- Coming in in the wrong place e.g. starting the lead part of Apache on beat 1 instead of beat 2;

- Adding the sus4 to a D chord (easy move for the LH pinky) regardless of musical context;

- Inappropriate use of the blues scale (and I do mean scale, played up then down);

- Inability to stop playing in breakdowns (or indeed at all).

I could go one but I think that’s depressing enough!

Edited June 28, 2021 by JapanAxe
Typo

[fretmeister]

10 hours ago, Barking Spiders said:

I'm of the opinion that power chords are for those who can't play barre chords

Can we change the thread to include bassists who don't understand music?

[ezbass]

3 minutes ago, fretmeister said:

Can we change the thread to include bassists who don't understand music?

I know someone who played the same major fill over obvious minor progressions. I’ve known guitarists who play the blues scale (fundamentally minor) over everything, whether it be major or minor (when I first started playing guitar, this was me too - for shame). I worked with a really good singer and front man, who rarely came in at the right point of Rhythm Stick after the sax solo and, given that this is a fundamentally bass riff driven ditty, was a PITA. Same band, same song, I’d count the drummer in (you can tell where this going just by that statement alone) and he’d start on the hi-hat at the correct tempo only to speed up by at the very least 10 bpm after just a bar, one night I just had to say stop because I couldn’t physically play the riff that fast (Norman W-R would have struggled I reckon). Keyboard players who left hands keep drifting into the bass guitarist’s register. They’re all out there, the only players I’ve encountered who don’t seem to cause problems are horn players, but I bet they exist.

In short, not everyone who can play or sing can do it with others.

[zbd1960]

6 minutes ago, ezbass said:

...In short, not everyone who can play or sing can do it with others.

This is an important point. There is stuff to learn about playing or singing in a group and amongst the obvious ones are listening to each other and adjusting pitch/tempo/volume etc as necessary. It's especially important in non-directed bands/ensembles since you haven't got a conductor to sort those things out.   

[adamg67]

29 minutes ago, fretmeister said:

Can we change the thread to include bassists who don't understand music?

Leave me out of this!

[JapanAxe]

19 minutes ago, ezbass said:

... They’re all out there, the only players I’ve encountered who don’t seem to cause problems are horn players, but I bet they exist.

...

Yes, I've met him. I'm on guitar at an open mic, sax player turns to me to take a solo, during which he continues to honk away at full volume. Of course this was a fun event, no paying punters, but the same guy is known locally for his inability to stfu on his sax.

[ubit]

15 hours ago, Nail Soup said:

Eventually it turned out that he didn't have a clue about music. He would join in anywhere in the bar

That reminds me of us way back when we first started the band. My mate had got a guitar for his Christmas and I had said I'll get a bass. I thought that would be easier. My other mate said he would learn drums and got a drum kit. We got to practice in the Scout hall. It was so bad acoustically but we didn't care. We were hammering away when the local hippy heard us and came in. He was called The Gunk on account of his long frizzy hair. Later we would learn that he was bloody amazing on guitar. He asked us to play something and when we did he was like stop, stop, you have to play together. We didn't realise that we were so loose that it was sounding rotten. That was an epiphany for us as we realised that you had to play in time. Sorry for digressing but that brought me back.

Edited June 28, 2021 by ubit

[FinnDave]

19 minutes ago, JapanAxe said:

Yes, I've met him. I'm on guitar at an open mic, sax player turns to me to take a solo, during which he continues to honk away at full volume. Of course this was a fun event, no paying punters, but the same guy is known locally for his inability to stfu on his sax.

I spent five years playing in a band with a harmonica player who suffered from the same disorder. I think he learnt to play (kind of) by honking along to recordings, so he'd just play over everything, vocals, guitar solos….the only time he hadn't got the ruddy gob iron stuck in his mouth was when he was singing. His singing was such that Id have preferred the harp!

He's a very pleasant bloke, though, and very helpful, just doesn't understand how to play in a band, despite being told countless times.

JapanAxe will immediately know who I mean!

Edited June 28, 2021 by FinnDave

[Jus Lukin]

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Edited March 15, 2022 by Jus Lukin

[peteb]

3 minutes ago, FinnDave said:

I spent five years playing in a band with a harmonica player who suffered from the same disorder. I think he learnt to play (kind of) by honking along to recordings, so he'd just play over everything, vocals, guitar solos….the only time he hadn't got the ruddy gob iron stuck in his mouth was when he was singing. His singing was such that Id have preferred the harp!

He's a very pleasant bloke, though, and very helpful, just doesn't understand how to play in a band, despite being told countless times.

I think I know his northern cousin!  

A nice guy (rather than pleasant - a biker with a bipolar issues & a chip on his shoulder) and what he plays is fine, just that he will never take the damn thing out of his mouth and plays over everything! 

[FinnDave]

I've played with a 'professional' singer who frequently asked us to play things half a semitone up or down to suit her voice.

[JapanAxe]

13 minutes ago, FinnDave said:

I've played with a 'professional' singer who frequently asked us to play things half a semitone up or down to suit her voice.

And I think I know who that is too...

[FinnDave]

5 minutes ago, JapanAxe said:

And I think I know who that is too...

I'm at least 99% certain you do! Al & I still talk about half semitones and chuckle.