60’s vs 70’s jazz bass pickup spacing / position - SAME BASS !!!

[Bart Funk Bass]

A short comparison of 60’s vs 70’s jazz bass pickup spacing on the SAME BASS!

I haven’t found such clip on YouTube.

The pickup position was changed by a luthier.

Which option do you prefer?

 

 

[Doctor J]

Interesting intonation setting change on the E string. Was the string affected by magnetic pull and different pickup heights or what was going on there?

[ped]

Always preferred 70s myself. Lots of people say there’s no difference believe it or not, or say that you can EQ them to sound the same 😔

[Marvin]

I prefer the 60s spacing personally, which is fortunate because I think my Jazz bass has 60s spacing...if it hasn't I'll have to buy a new Jazz bass.

 

The 60s spacing sounds fuller to me and the pickups seem to work better together.

[Hellzero]

I like both, but prefer the 60's position for fretless bass and 70's position for fretted bass. Here the difference between the two positions is more than obvious and you can't EQ one to get the other as there's the natural low mid out of phase frequencies cancelling in the 70's position that gives this typical scooped sound when both pickups are engaged.

 

Nice work. 👍

Edited August 12, 2021 by Hellzero
Phrasing

[4000]

That’s very interesting. They do sound completely different; I much prefer the ‘60s version. The ‘70s one is the JB sound that I really don’t like, in every instance. 

[ped]

It must be said that the clips aren't particularly well recorded - a limiter is needed big time... but the woody bark from a 70s spacing is clearly the winner 🤣

 

Maybe it's because I listened to a lot of Marcus Miller as an impressionable teen

 

That's weird - my computer autocorrected MARCUS MILLER to all caps!?!

[BigRedX]

No mention is made of how the change the pickup position affects the playing style - for instance if you used the bridge pickup as your thumb anchor then moving the position of the pickup also changes the plucking position. Similarly playing with a pick, do you consciously or unconsciously avoid playing over the pickup so having it in a different place with again affect the plucking position. Interestingly the one technique that shouldn't be affected by the pickup position (slap) showed to least change in sound between the two examples.

 

Also to make the two versions of the bass as similar as possible the examples should have been recorded with the new route for the pickup in place but without the old cavity filled and simply move the pickup from one hole to the other. Also since it was likely that the bass would have been disassembled to create the new route and fill the old one, we don't know what the change in tone would be from simply the disassembly and reassembly process was.

[ped]

7 minutes ago, BigRedX said:

No mention is made of how the change the pickup position affects the playing style - for instance if you used the bridge pickup as your thumb anchor then moving the position of the pickup also changes the plucking position. Similarly playing with a pick, do you consciously or unconsciously avoid playing over the pickup so having it in a different place with again affect the plucking position. Interestingly the one technique that shouldn't be affected by the pickup position (slap) showed to least change in sound between the two examples.

 

Also to make the two versions of the bass as similar as possible the examples should have been recorded with the new route for the pickup in place but without the old cavity filled and simply move the pickup from one hole to the other. Also since it was likely that the bass would have been disassembled to create the new route and fill the old one, we don't know what the change in tone would be from simply the disassembly and reassembly process was.

 

Sure, but those of us who have owned a variety of 60s and 70s spaced jazz basses will hear the key difference regardless of the minutiae. I'd say it's a clear as day, and like comparing a P to a J. 

[BigRedX]

2 minutes ago, ped said:

 

Sure, but those of us who have owned a variety of 60s and 70s spaced jazz basses will hear the key difference regardless of the minutiae. I'd say it's a clear as day, and like comparing a P to a J. 

 

But the majority of those minutiae are lost the moment you drop the bass sound into any kind of band mix, unless you EQ the flip out of it.

[ped]

Just now, BigRedX said:

 

But the majority of those minutiae are lost the moment you drop the bass sound into any kind of band mix, unless you EQ the flip out of it.

 

I don't agree - a 70s bass stands out in a mix like anything, to my ears at least. And you absolutely cannot EQ a 60s bass to sound 70s. But it all depends on what you 'listen' to, and might not matter to most people. But we're bass geeks so...

[Nicko]

In isolation, with whatever settings are used for this recording I prefer the 60s sound.  That said in a band mix the difference would be very subtle and I have cloth ears so probably couldn't tell from listening whether a track was recorded using a Jazz or a Precision - when eq playing style and amps are involved.  In fact I play a P bass so if I was setting my sound I probably wouldn't want to get the sound that is produced by either option - I'd be on the front pickup.

[DiMarco]

I don't know... This is my custom built Jazz. Rear coil is at 70's position. Front coil a bit further from the bridge than 60's position.

Neck pickup intersects with the E string at 70's position but runs closer to the neck towards the G string side, for a more even sound across the strings.

I mostly use it with both coils on in series. Big ballsy tone that way. Second fave tone on it is with just the front coil of the bridge pickup engaged. It gets that Jazz Bass upper mids growl that way.

 

 

That said, I mostly play this "jazz" which has 70's pickup positioning and an awesome onboard preamp. No more Fenders for me this one covers it all.

 

Edited August 13, 2021 by DiMarco

[BigRedX]

22 hours ago, ped said:

 

I don't agree - a 70s bass stands out in a mix like anything, to my ears at least. And you absolutely cannot EQ a 60s bass to sound 70s. But it all depends on what you 'listen' to, and might not matter to most people. But we're bass geeks so...

 

I didn't mean using EQ to change one version to the other. I mean that once the bass has been dropped into the mix at an appropriate level the differences between the two will be negligible without using EQ to further boost the frequencies that each pickup position accentuates.

[ped]

5 minutes ago, BigRedX said:

 

I didn't mean using EQ to change one version to the other. I mean that once the bass has been dropped into the mix at an appropriate level the differences between the two will be negligible without using EQ to further boost the frequencies that each pickup position accentuates.

 

Ah OK. Depends on the music I guess. I still think there's a massive difference and much prefer 70s spacing!

[chris_b]

In isolation, I guess my preference is for the 60's position, but it's not something that would influence whether I bought the bass or not. Fender have used many different pickups in the last 70 years and the difference between pickup location and pickup sound could easily cancel each other out. I would buy a bass based on the overall sound and there are many other factors involved there.

[ped]

6 minutes ago, chris_b said:

In isolation, I guess my preference is for the 60's position, but it's not something that would influence whether I bought the bass or not. Fender have used many different pickups in the last 70 years and the difference between pickup location and pickup sound could easily cancel each other out. I would buy a bass based on the overall sound and there are many other factors involved there.

The characteristic of the spacing is unmistakeable. The type of J pickup doesn’t influence that character - that same 70s snap is there in basses from £300 to £3000

[4000]

On 12/08/2021 at 10:08, ped said:

It must be said that the clips aren't particularly well recorded - a limiter is needed big time... but the woody bark from a 70s spacing is clearly the winner 🤣

 

Maybe it's because I listened to a lot of Marcus Miller as an impressionable teen

 

That's weird - my computer autocorrected MARCUS MILLER to all caps!?!

That’s your computer’s version of “HOW VERY DARE YOU!”. 😂

[4000]

On 12/08/2021 at 10:59, BigRedX said:

 

But the majority of those minutiae are lost the moment you drop the bass sound into any kind of band mix, unless you EQ the flip out of it.

They’re not necessarily lost when you’re playing it. It’s not just about recording or FOH.

 

TBH, I don’t really agree with that anyway. I’ve done numerous recordings where I’ve done a separate bass track using each of my Rics, no adjustment to eq, and they all sound different, so I pick the one that works best. 

Edited August 13, 2021 by 4000

[BigRedX]

I think that too often we over-obsess about minutiae.

 

It's not necessarily a bad thing, in a great studio with unlimited time and budget, but we also need to acknowledge that there are times when no-one cares or will even notice in the slightest except us and it really doesn't matter.

[4000]

4 minutes ago, BigRedX said:

I think that too often we over-obsess about minutiae.

 

It's not necessarily a bad thing, in a great studio with unlimited time and budget, but we also need to acknowledge that there are times when no-one cares or will even notice in the slightest except us and it really doesn't matter.

That’s true, but the trying to satisfy myself is, for me at least, the point of doing it. In the scheme of things, most people wouldn’t care whether or not we were recording in the first place, so it’s mostly for our own benefit that we bother doing it at all. 

[ped]

15 minutes ago, 4000 said:

That’s true, but the trying to satisfy myself is, for me at least, the point of doing it. In the scheme of things, most people wouldn’t care whether or not we were recording in the first place, so it’s mostly for our own benefit that we bother doing it at all. 

This. These discussions always go the same way - “the audience won’t notice” 

 

It all comes down to what you enjoy about playing, I suppose. We’re all right! 
 

MARCUS MILLER

[4000]

39 minutes ago, ped said:
 

MARCUS MILLER

I’m now hearing that in the voice of Terry Pratchett’s Death. 😂

[shoulderpet]

18 hours ago, 4000 said:

That’s true, but the trying to satisfy myself is, for me at least, the point of doing it. In the scheme of things, most people wouldn’t care whether or not we were recording in the first place, so it’s mostly for our own benefit that we bother doing it at all. 

I agree with this, I'm sure to my bandmates I could turn up with my P bass or I could turn up with my Hofner or I could turn up with a bass uke and as long as my band mates can hear the bass they don't care and probably don't hear the difference, to them it just sounds like a bass but to me I sound better when I use a certain bass and my sounding better makes me enjoy playing more

[BigRedX]

19 hours ago, 4000 said:

That’s true, but the trying to satisfy myself is, for me at least, the point of doing it. In the scheme of things, most people wouldn’t care whether or not we were recording in the first place, so it’s mostly for our own benefit that we bother doing it at all. 

 

In the early days when I was gigging I used to get very wound up about things not sounding right on stage and FoH and TBH a lot of the time because of this I could be rather unpleasant to be around at gigs. In the end I realised that it was not good for me, the band and the other band members or for anyone who had come to see us play.

 

These days so long as I can hear enough to know that I am in time and in tune with the rest of the band and can hear any important musical cues to know where I am in the song, I am perfectly happy. As a result I'm much nicer to be with at gigs and an I put on a much better performance, both musically and visually.