51m0n Posted April 1, 2009 Share Posted April 1, 2009 [quote name='alexclaber' post='451490' date='Apr 1 2009, 01:59 PM']Check out The Meters too. Technically very easy to play but the feel is hard - you need to sit back and cope with the drums sitting even further back. Alex[/quote] Oh yeah right with you on that - I came from a very punk/avante garde noise rock meets funk background, and playing behind feels totally alien to me as a result - Tippie Toes [b]should[/b] be easy, but making it feel like they do is a complete @*&^!! Love The Meters though, recently covered Fire on The Bayou with a band, that is absolutely awesome to play and its about 4 notes!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
crez5150 Posted April 1, 2009 Share Posted April 1, 2009 One thing I'd like to point out about playing funk/disco/rare groove type music is to be aware of the rhythm, leave space.... it's not all about constant playing... I think to many people try to overplay or cloud the groove with too many notes.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
crez5150 Posted April 1, 2009 Share Posted April 1, 2009 Oh and here's one of my faves.... not overly complicated but shows what can be achieved with good riffing - [url="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ABLwmYI09Lw"]Maceo Parker - Shake everything you got[/url] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
51m0n Posted April 1, 2009 Share Posted April 1, 2009 To the OP the only way to really cop the funk is to listen to it almost exclusively for a few months. Craig Charles' show is a great starting point as is the funk101 thread on talkbass. Enjoy! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lowdown Posted April 1, 2009 Share Posted April 1, 2009 Commercial funk this one - but a f**k off Bass line.. Garry Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AM1 Posted April 1, 2009 Author Share Posted April 1, 2009 [quote name='molan' post='451491' date='Apr 1 2009, 01:59 PM']Can't beat Rocco: [/quote] That's exactly what I like. Really great technique and control. A big part is feel for sure but for this particular example of the genre, technique plays a big part. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alexclaber Posted April 1, 2009 Share Posted April 1, 2009 [quote name='AM1' post='451564' date='Apr 1 2009, 03:03 PM']That's exactly what I like. Really great technique and control. A big part is feel for sure but for this particular example of the genre, technique plays a big part.[/quote] Put the bass down and step away from the Tower of Power! Rocco's style is so hard to pull off correctly and sounds so bad when done wrong that it is the last place to start with funk. The world is full of bad funk players who followed Mark King's slap playing and Rocco's fingerstyle (if they were good then the later would sound good but there'll never be any true funk in that Level 42 plinkily plonkily silliness). Aim to funk with as few notes as possible, that way even when you're a beginner you'll sound funky. Once you get busier the note spacing, length, accenting, tone, position vs the beat, and other phrasing, becomes more and more critical. Alex Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YouMa Posted April 1, 2009 Share Posted April 1, 2009 I still say if you are not heavily into funk you will never be a good funk player,i also think a lot of people get confused between funk,jazz/funk,soul,rare groove etc. I personally have never been a massive fan of funkadelic and prefer more soulful funk than this. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AM1 Posted April 1, 2009 Author Share Posted April 1, 2009 [quote name='alexclaber' post='451574' date='Apr 1 2009, 03:11 PM']Put the bass down and step away from the Tower of Power! Rocco's style is so hard to pull off correctly and sounds so bad when done wrong that it is the last place to start with funk. The world is full of bad funk players who followed Mark King's slap playing and Rocco's fingerstyle (if they were good then the later would sound good but there'll never be any true funk in that Level 42 plinkily plonkily silliness). Aim to funk with as few notes as possible, that way even when you're a beginner you'll sound funky. Once you get busier the note spacing, length, accenting, tone, position vs the beat, and other phrasing, becomes more and more critical. Alex[/quote] Aaah Shaddap and don't be a killjoy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alexclaber Posted April 1, 2009 Share Posted April 1, 2009 [quote name='AM1' post='451592' date='Apr 1 2009, 03:26 PM']Aaah Shaddap and don't be a killjoy [/quote] By all means learn Rocco's stuff to get your right hand technique happening but please don't use it on a gig for a good few years! Alex Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
crez5150 Posted April 1, 2009 Share Posted April 1, 2009 [quote name='YouMa' post='451576' date='Apr 1 2009, 03:15 PM']I still say if you are not heavily into funk you will never be a good funk player,i also think a lot of people get confused between funk,jazz/funk,soul,rare groove etc. I personally have never been a massive fan of funkadelic and prefer more soulful funk than this.[/quote] +1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KennysFord Posted April 1, 2009 Share Posted April 1, 2009 Hey Ann-marie. The book you should get is Funk Fusion Bass by Jon Liebman [url="http://www.jonliebman.com/Books.html"]http://www.jonliebman.com/Books.html[/url] This book comes highly recommended by Nick Carey btw.There's a full section on practising 1/8ths 1/16ths etc and it brought my speed up a treat.Not quite Rocco speed yet but i now have the same Bass he uses in the vids....well nearly. There's a few excersises from the book [url="http://www.nickcarey.co.uk/page10.htm"]here[/url] on Nick's website.Hammer ons,slides etc It's a great book,buy it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AM1 Posted April 1, 2009 Author Share Posted April 1, 2009 [quote name='alexclaber' post='451594' date='Apr 1 2009, 03:28 PM']By all means learn Rocco's stuff to get your right hand technique happening but please don't use it on a gig for a good few years! Alex[/quote] Duuuurrrrrr Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AM1 Posted April 1, 2009 Author Share Posted April 1, 2009 [quote name='kennyrodg' post='451597' date='Apr 1 2009, 03:29 PM']Hey Ann-marie. The book you should get is Funk Fusion Bass by Jon Liebman [url="http://www.jonliebman.com/Books.html"]http://www.jonliebman.com/Books.html[/url] This book comes highly recommended by Nick Carey btw.There's a full section on practising 1/8ths 1/16ths etc and it brought my speed up a treat.Not quite Rocco speed yet but i now have the same Bass he uses in the vids....well nearly. There's a few excersises from the book [url="http://www.nickcarey.co.uk/page10.htm"]here[/url] on Nick's website.Hammer ons,slides etc It's a great book,buy it. [/quote] Brilliant! Just ordered it. Happy Days Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KennysFord Posted April 1, 2009 Share Posted April 1, 2009 [quote name='crez5150' post='451523' date='Apr 1 2009, 02:22 PM']Oh and here's one of my faves.... not overly complicated but shows what can be achieved with good riffing - [url="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ABLwmYI09Lw"]Maceo Parker - Shake everything you got[/url][/quote] Wow,one word Immense !! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Funk Posted April 1, 2009 Share Posted April 1, 2009 (edited) There's so much great funk music out there. I kind of agree with Alex about steering clear of trying to cop Rocco or the Jamaica, Queens, NY '80s funk or the N'awlins Meters funk until you get your head around the funk in general (really, it should have a 'the' before it) but then I think if you're going to develop your own funk style you should try to blend all the stuff YOU'RE into. So, as we've all said, listen to as much of it as possible. Don't overplay. Don't think of funk as something you need to learn from a book or a video, although any tips you can pick up from anyone might be useful. I've heard the playing of a lot of the guys who've posted in this thread and I've discussed the funk with many of the other guys - you're in the company of some serious funkateers. Everyone will have their own angle. Listen to the things you like and develop your own approach to funk the same way they have. One reason I mentioned [i]Papa Was A Rollin' Stone[/i] was because there are hardly any notes in that groove. There's a full bar of rests between the first half and second half of the riff. I mentioned [i]If You Want Me To Stay[/i] because the only difference between that bassline and a pumping 1/8th notes punk rock bassline is the accents that Garry mentioned earlier. If you're not playing with a funky drummer yet, it's going to delay your development. Given your thread about drummer/timing problems, you might have to get looking. EDIT: I hear a lot of people saying you have to lock in with the drummer, and while that's true you also sometimes have to boss the drummer with your playing to keep them from speeding up or dragging. It's a tough skill but I think quite useful to develop. I don't think I have it yet. Edited April 1, 2009 by The Funk Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AM1 Posted April 1, 2009 Author Share Posted April 1, 2009 [quote name='The Funk' post='451623' date='Apr 1 2009, 03:51 PM']So, as we've all said, listen to as much of it as possible. Don't overplay. Don't think of funk as something you need to learn from a book or a video, although any tips you can pick up from anyone might be useful.[/quote] The book stuff is useful from the perspective of tackling stuff like string crossing, but it's not the be all and end all I agree. [quote name='The Funk' post='451623' date='Apr 1 2009, 03:51 PM']If you're not playing with a funky drummer yet, it's going to delay your development. Given your thread about drummer/timing problems, you might have to get looking.[/quote] I've got a funky drummer, he's on my PC. [quote name='The Funk' post='451623' date='Apr 1 2009, 03:51 PM']EDIT: I hear a lot of people saying you have to lock in with the drummer, and while that's true you also sometimes have to boss the drummer with your playing to keep them from speeding up or dragging. It's a tough skill but I think quite useful to develop. I don't think I have it yet.[/quote] I've never bought into the philosophy that everyone should follow the drummer. That only works if the drummer is rock solid and that's fairly rare. The bass player in my view, definitely has a role to play. If the drummer speeds up (in a way that's not pre-meditated or planned) then I refuse to go with them and I hold back the time til they realise who's the tempo boss. But if you can get a drummer that can keep time AND tempo and lock in - that's poetry! Like I said, I've found one, he's on my PC and he's in no position to argue. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Funk Posted April 1, 2009 Share Posted April 1, 2009 [quote name='AM1' post='451631' date='Apr 1 2009, 03:58 PM']I've got a funky drummer, he's on my PC. [/quote] You've got Clyde Stubblefield on your PC? (Seriously though, I think he does CDs just of drum tracks. If you can get hold of it, then you WILL have the original Funky Drummer on your PC). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AM1 Posted April 1, 2009 Author Share Posted April 1, 2009 [quote name='The Funk' post='451634' date='Apr 1 2009, 04:01 PM']You've got Clyde Stubblefield on your PC? (Seriously though, I think he does CDs just of drum tracks. If you can get hold of it, then you WILL have the original Funky Drummer on your PC).[/quote] [url="http://www.numericalsound.com/clyde-stubblefield.html"]http://www.numericalsound.com/clyde-stubblefield.html[/url] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Funk Posted April 1, 2009 Share Posted April 1, 2009 OMG! F*ck that one - they have a Bernard Purdie one!!! My favourite drummer of all time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alexclaber Posted April 1, 2009 Share Posted April 1, 2009 [quote name='The Funk' post='451623' date='Apr 1 2009, 03:51 PM']I mentioned [i]If You Want Me To Stay[/i] because the only difference between that bassline and a pumping 1/8th notes punk rock bassline is the accents that Garry mentioned earlier.[/quote] Sly Stone is generally a good starting place. "Everyday People" is open E 8th notes all the way through the song. d-dah-d-dah. Staccato-Legato etc. "Thank You (falletmebemiceelf)" is a dead simple thumpin' n' pluckin' thang. Larry Graham is great feel-wise because he generally lays it right down the middle of the beat, none of the weird Rocco topspin or George Porter Jr laying back. (Though check his overdubbed fuzz on "Dance to the Music" - he sits the fuzz line behind the beat but the clean line on the beat. Genius!) Alex Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lowdown Posted April 1, 2009 Share Posted April 1, 2009 (edited) [quote name='The Funk' post='451623' date='Apr 1 2009, 03:51 PM']There's so much great funk music out there. I kind of agree with Alex about steering clear of trying to cop Rocco or the Jamaica, Queens, NY '80s funk or the N'awlins Meters funk until you get your head around the funk in general[/quote] You should never stear clear of any FUNK!.. Listen to as much as possible, Its good for the soul. But you are right, playing it is another thing. A basic chart for Jamaica... Add your own fills for taste...[not to show off] [attachment=23166:Jamaica_Funk.pdf] Garry Edited April 2, 2009 by lowdown Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alexclaber Posted April 1, 2009 Share Posted April 1, 2009 [quote name='The Funk' post='451654' date='Apr 1 2009, 04:13 PM']OMG! F*ck that one - they have a Bernard Purdie one!!! My favourite drummer of all time.[/quote] Too smooth! Also if you're coming to funk from rock there is a wealth of fantasic late '60s/early '70s rock that straddles the funk/rock gap. Some deeply funk laden moments in Led Zeppelin and this particular favourite of mine from Black Sabbath - so dirty, so greasy and so dark: The shift from this to The Meters is not as far as you'd think - both the drummers and bass players have remarkably similar feels. And in more recent times RATM and even Korn have funked out, though from more of a hip hop perspective. Alex Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Funk Posted April 1, 2009 Share Posted April 1, 2009 If you like Tom Browne, you should check out his contemporaries/collaborators Don Blackman and Bernard Wright. I always thought Jamaica Funk was about the Island but it's a neighbourhood in Queens, New York. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lowdown Posted April 1, 2009 Share Posted April 1, 2009 [quote name='The Funk' post='451686' date='Apr 1 2009, 04:42 PM']If you like Tom Browne, you should check out his contemporaries/collaborators Don Blackman and Bernard Wright. I always thought Jamaica Funk was about the Island but it's a neighbourhood in Queens, New York.[/quote] Yep all good stuff. Might be worth AM checking out the great Paul Jackson as well...good finger style. Garry Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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