soopercrip Posted April 7, 2009 Share Posted April 7, 2009 i have an old fusion style 5 string fretless (cheapo) which I have decided to abuse for practice, before I attempt a self build. I have been a joiner (latin: woodus spoilitus) for most of my working life. Redundancy has given me far too much spare time, so rather than sit on here for too long I'm going to make my mistakes with my old 5er, and then go for the real deal. Posting it here rather than self build as I can forsee a few techical issues. Having said that a bit tounge in cheekish, I would really like it turn out ok So the bass has a single jazz and a single humbucker, both active and both dead Rosewood fingerboard. Everything else is painted black. I've stripped the electrics out and removed all the hardware, separated the neck and body and begun removing the paint to expose the woods and check the quality. Er, it's not good, but not horrendous. There is some damage round the j pick up hole. The neck is jointed (very well done, to be fair) near the head stock. and thats about it. The neck looks like maple the body looks like it could be wood, yep it's wood, sound and dry but iffy quality, so it's going to get painted Will consult my cabinet maker buddy Lea, who is my consultant and assistant for finishing, to identify it. Would like to simplify and upgrade the electrics and this is where i tumble over. Because it's now paint, I'm going to fill the J pickup in (maybe a scratchplate? will see how it finishes) and fit a better quality humbucker (a la MM) Consequently I would like to have a 2 band eq. and I struggle to wire a plug safely!! I have an electrician friend who will help and make sure I don't kill myself, but I want to do as much as possible. Your input is most definately required here! (in fact your input is required everywhere!) Think I can get away with a laquered neck, but the body is a defo paint, and is going to be white. I'm going to fret the neck for the practice. (I bet you lot ask for b*oody photo's now ok-soonish) Andy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BOD2 Posted April 7, 2009 Share Posted April 7, 2009 Sounds like a good project. If you're filling in the J-pickup hole, I'd suggest you simplify the hole (i.e. make it a simple rectangle) then make a wooden plug to fill it. Glue in the plug then sand it all in while the body is still at the bare wood stage. There are a few sites on guitar finishing - use Google for this. It can be tricky to get a good solid painted finish, but it can be done if you take plenty of time between coats and sand/buff carefully. Good priming of the bare wood prior to painting is also essential. As for electrics - if you want 2-band EQ then your looking at active electronics. The simplest setup would be a passive pickup with an active 2-band preamp. You'd have volume, bass and treble (you could combine the bass and treble onto a single stacked pot). Remember to allow space and access for a battery. The actual wiring will be quite simple for a single pickup and there are plenty of excellent wiring diagrams around once decide what you need. Some soldering practice before you wire up the real thing will be useful - keep the old electronics for this. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
soopercrip Posted April 7, 2009 Author Share Posted April 7, 2009 i intended fitting a wood plug in the pick up hole, never thought of squaring it up (duh), was more concerned about matching the wood for expansion rates cracking the finish? Always found myself ducking when threads on here started talking electrics, so now I need to know it has come back to haunt me Vol/bass/treble controls will be more than enough for a first attempt I think, with a humbucker to eliminate noise. Photos soon... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BOD2 Posted April 7, 2009 Share Posted April 7, 2009 Here's an example wiring diagram to be looking at and getting familiar with With a single pickup, the relevant diagrams are - "1 Volume 1 BTC Control" or "1 Volume 1 BTS Control" Ignore all the other variations as these are for two pickups. The BTC has a stacked pot for treble and bass, the BTS has separate treble and bass pots. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
soopercrip Posted April 7, 2009 Author Share Posted April 7, 2009 [quote name='BOD2' post='456384' date='Apr 7 2009, 01:43 PM']Here's an example wiring diagram to be looking at and getting familiar with With a single pickup, the relevant diagrams are - "1 Volume 1 BTC Control" or "1 Volume 1 BTS Control" Ignore all the other variations as these are for two pickups. The BTC has a stacked pot for treble and bass, the BTS has separate treble and bass pots.[/quote] Thanks Bod but the link is? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BOD2 Posted April 7, 2009 Share Posted April 7, 2009 [quote name='soopercrip' post='456456' date='Apr 7 2009, 02:42 PM']Thanks Bod but the link is?[/quote] Oh don't you just hate it when that happens..... [url="http://www.emginc.com/content/wiringdiagrams/BTseries.pdf"]http://www.emginc.com/content/wiringdiagrams/BTseries.pdf[/url] Sorry ! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peaty Posted April 7, 2009 Share Posted April 7, 2009 (edited) Good luck soopercrip If you wanted a bit of reading before diving in I would recommend a look at Melvin Hiscocks book 'Make your own electric guitar' it certainly helped me out a lot. The book building electric guitars by Martin Koch is also very good. Pete Edited April 7, 2009 by Peaty Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
soopercrip Posted April 7, 2009 Author Share Posted April 7, 2009 [quote name='BOD2' post='456519' date='Apr 7 2009, 03:55 PM']Oh don't you just hate it when that happens..... [url="http://www.emginc.com/content/wiringdiagrams/BTseries.pdf"]http://www.emginc.com/content/wiringdiagrams/BTseries.pdf[/url] Sorry ![/quote] No worries matey well maybe one or two actually this looks quite complex for a simple joiner who's soldering iron is still to be bought think I'm going to order up the bits and sit and stare at them until it makes sense Thanks pete, slow and steady, this isn't a race eh? will research the books, Andy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
soopercrip Posted April 8, 2009 Author Share Posted April 8, 2009 (edited) Decisions, decisions Spent some time wondering round the ether looking at various pickups, pre amps, and thought I would run these by you guys. Seymour duncan mb 5a music man pup Aguilar obp 2 tk pre amp The one with separate bass and treble. Gives three controls so the existing fourth hole I will fill. you think thats ok? Option to go for the ACG/john east which seems to be the holy grail on here, can always liberate it for the full build later Wondering wether to go for through body stringing, again for the practise. Honest I will put up some pics soon Andy Edit: photos-[attachment=23491:Picture_3491.JPG][attachment=23492:Picture_3501.JPG][attachment=23493:Picture_3511 .JPG][attachment=23494:Picture_3521.JPG][attachment=23495:Picture_3541.JPG][attachment=23496:Picture_ 3551.JPG][attachment=23497:Picture_3561.JPG][attachment=23498:Picture_3571.JPG][attachment=23499:Pict ure_35621.JPG] Neck pick up hole routed square, plug is cut, just making sure it's plenty dry. All sanded with 120 grit Headstock reshaped (Had some odd looking angled bit on the end, er now looks like a lollipop but hey...) Still unsure about jointed neck. doesn't look too bad feels good and solid, dont know if it will disguise with sanding and laquer, or if it will be paint. suggestions?... Edited April 8, 2009 by soopercrip Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
soopercrip Posted April 8, 2009 Author Share Posted April 8, 2009 Pics as promised in edit ^^^^^^ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
soopercrip Posted April 16, 2009 Author Share Posted April 16, 2009 AAAAAAAAAARRRRRRRRRGGGGGGHHHHHHHH!!!!!!!!!!! (Coughs and clears throat) Body: So the j pick up hole was plugged with some sycamore scavenged from my bud Lea, filled two control holes with dowels and re drilled a third in line for symmetry, filled all the nooks crannies and crevices and sanded 240 then some more sanding 500 sprayed the body with primer and there was bloody dings everywhere! more sanding 120 more 240 more 500 3 coats primer and... we're ok ish (it is only practice) 4 coats paint wait 2 days light sand 1200, 4 coats lacquer next is to buff and polish Neck Sanded down to 1200 grit bit the bullet and fretted it (fret wire is a bugger to radius) went ok for first attempt although it does take courage to make the first cut, lol then base coat lacquer x2 6 top coats lacquer with v light sand with 1200 in between polishing compound and wax. finish looks bloody marvellous, although joint in neck is p ing me off headstock is good too with some figuring. Painted the heel to match in with the body. So why Argh? Well Mr bloody impatience decided to assemble things for an idea of how the end product is going to look... ...and split the bloody neck at the heel I think I'm going to put it down for a day or so before I chuck it in a skip. Pics ----- [attachment=23878:Picture_3511.JPG][attachment=23877:Picture_3501.JPG][attachment=23876:Picture_3491 .JPG] [attachment=23879:Picture_3521.JPG]<<dickhead!!! [attachment=23880:Picture_3531.JPG][attachment=23881:Picture_3541.JPG][attachment=23882:Picture_3551 .JPG][attachment=23883:Picture_3561.JPG][attachment=23884:Picture_3571.JPG][attachment=23886:Picture_ 3591.JPG] For electrics I decided on a nordstrand mm5.2 pickup and the aguilar pre amp I mentioned earlier. ordered them from a U.S. dealer I found on the web and ebay (bass specialties. feedback was 100%) prices were very good I thought. Still waiting for delivery though. Need beer Andy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Longmayyourun Posted April 16, 2009 Share Posted April 16, 2009 Andy - DON'T SKIP IT, this is looking much too good for that, and you've put in a load of work. All you need to do is reinforce the split to stop it getting worse. I think if it were me I'd try inserting one or two fine screws into the side of the neck heel (they'll be hidden when it's assembled). Put a clearance hole through the split off section, and pilot hole into the rest to pull the split together, if possible do this either side of the neck screw that has caused the split. I realise you might come across the truss rod end if you are unlucky, but it looks to me that you should have enough room. Re-drill the pilot holes for the neck screws (my specialist subject is stating the bl**ding obvious!) Insert the neck screws with the neck removed from the body and a G cramp across the heel (careful with the depth) to be sure everything is OK before assembly. It's looking great - don't lose heart now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Count Bassy Posted April 21, 2009 Share Posted April 21, 2009 (edited) [quote name='Longmayyourun' post='464301' date='Apr 16 2009, 07:15 PM']Andy - DON'T SKIP IT, this is looking much too good for that, and you've put in a load of work. All you need to do is reinforce the split to stop it getting worse. I think if it were me I'd try inserting one or two fine screws into the side of the neck heel (they'll be hidden when it's assembled). Put a clearance hole through the split off section, and pilot hole into the rest to pull the split together, if possible do this either side of the neck screw that has caused the split. I realise you might come across the truss rod end if you are unlucky, but it looks to me that you should have enough room. Re-drill the pilot holes for the neck screws (my specialist subject is stating the bl**ding obvious!) Insert the neck screws with the neck removed from the body and a G cramp across the heel (careful with the depth) to be sure everything is OK before assembly. It's looking great - don't lose heart now.[/quote] All the above, plus, had you considered putting threaded inserts into the neck and using bolts rather than wood screws to hold it on. This would reduce any tendency for the neck to split again when fastening it onto the body. Also if it is possible to (extremey carefully) open the split up enough to force some good glue down it and then screw it up immediately. Perhaps 'Screw it up' was a bad choice of words. Edited April 21, 2009 by Clive Thorne Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
soopercrip Posted April 27, 2009 Author Share Posted April 27, 2009 Just an update, didn't skip it, calmed down after a few beers and a hangover. Had some reaction between the primer and the paint so had to strip back the body (and neck heel) and re-finish. Managed to get some glue into the neck crack and pilotted a fix through, and it's solid and clean. Pick up and pre- amp should arrive today (according to parcelforce) With customs and Vat saved around £30 buying in US, but will probably be available at similar rate here somewhere. Did loads of research, but couldn't match it so far, 3 week wait is a bit of an ar*e tho. going to spend some time studying the wiring diagrams and staring at the bits, until I feel comfortable and confident to solder them. Then I'll get my sparky mate to check it before I do it Better to do it right eh? Where's that bloody parcelforce van.... Andy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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