ubit Posted January 6, 2022 Share Posted January 6, 2022 I remember this album coming out and to be honest I never noticed the lack of bass on the album. I always thought it was my shitty system (at the time) but after years of reading about it and finding out what really happened. It's no wonder Jason Newsted left that band. It was criminal the way they turned down the bass until it was dialled right out of the mix. The reasons are even more mind blowing. I love Metallica but it seems like Lars is a little toss pot Hitler and Hetfield isn't much better. You do see that side on the video Some Kind Of Monster but it's only now that I have a stinky poo hot sound system that I can appreciate just how little bass is on this album. Steve Thompson actually said he was asked to drop the bass. He took it almost right out of the mix as a joke and Lars said ok, a bit more. He couldn't believe it. Then years later Lars asked Thompson what happened to the bass on Justice? This was a great album spoiled by interfering know alls. https://archive.blabbermouth.net/news/metallicas-james-hetfield-defends-and-justice-for-all-production-we-wanted-the-best-sounding-record-we-could-make/ 5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MacDaddy Posted January 6, 2022 Share Posted January 6, 2022 There are versions where bass has been added. Search for 'And Justice For All With Bass', on the YouTube. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ubit Posted January 6, 2022 Author Share Posted January 6, 2022 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ubit Posted January 6, 2022 Author Share Posted January 6, 2022 Just now, MacDaddy said: There are versions where bass has been added. Search for 'And Justice For All With Bass', on the YouTube. I just added it as you posted Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ubit Posted January 6, 2022 Author Share Posted January 6, 2022 I'm not talking about the fact that you can't hear it with bass. I mean the original album was criminally handled. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thunderbird Posted January 6, 2022 Share Posted January 6, 2022 I believe it is a Metallica fan who plays bass on the "remaster" it is called and justice for Jason if memory serves me correct the fan presented it to Jason and said this is how the bass should of sounded 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doctor J Posted January 6, 2022 Share Posted January 6, 2022 (edited) The real crime was not getting it mixed properly, at last, for the 30th anniversary edition. They could have had a remastered disk with the original mix and a second disk with whoever giving it a decent mix. They could have righted a very big wrong but, rather spitefully, stick to their guns. They were wrong, they know it, and still refuse to acknowledge it. Those "with bass" albums, as far as I'm aware the only Newsted studio tracks which ever came out were the 4 or 5 on Guitar Hero, so there is no full album with Newsted on every track. Everything else is some dudes playing what they think the basslines are. The irony of "...and Justice For Jason" was that Newsted still couldn't be heard on it. Edited January 6, 2022 by Doctor J 6 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NikNik Posted January 6, 2022 Share Posted January 6, 2022 (edited) The tale about Lars' direction on this will be remembered forever. Wee cnut. Edited January 6, 2022 by NikNik 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Munurmunuh Posted January 6, 2022 Share Posted January 6, 2022 I think it sounds right. The album is a mausoleum, and it sounds like one. Lars deserves every name he gets called, but his artistic vision is genuine, and he got this right. Absolute masterpiece. 2 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ubit Posted January 6, 2022 Author Share Posted January 6, 2022 3 minutes ago, Doctor J said: They could have righted a very big wrong but, rather spitefully, stick to their guns. They were wrong, they know it, and still refuse to acknowledge it. Indeed mate, they said their ears were shot during the original recording and mixing. What a crap excuse. Then when they had the chance to remix it said we don't need to change it, it's perfect. Like the Mona Lisa, would you change that? How up yer derrière is he? Comparing your record with a timeless, priceless masterpiece. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NikNik Posted January 6, 2022 Share Posted January 6, 2022 3 minutes ago, Ricky Rioli said: I think it sounds right. The album is a mausoleum, and it sounds like one. Lars deserves every name he gets called, but his artistic vision is genuine, and he got this right. Absolute masterpiece. Disasaterpiece, you mean? 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ubit Posted January 6, 2022 Author Share Posted January 6, 2022 4 minutes ago, Ricky Rioli said: I think it sounds right. The album is a mausoleum, and it sounds like one. Lars deserves every name he gets called, but his artistic vision is genuine, and he got this right. Absolute masterpiece. I don't know whether to agree with you or not. Yes it's a great album and the guitars and drums sound great but being a bass player I love bass thumping out. If you do sound tests with the videos above and hear the difference you will know that it sounds better with a good bass sound. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doctor J Posted January 6, 2022 Share Posted January 6, 2022 8 minutes ago, ubit said: Indeed mate, they said their ears were shot during the original recording and mixing. What a crap excuse. Then when they had the chance to remix it said we don't need to change it, it's perfect. Like the Mona Lisa, would you change that? How up yer derrière is he? Comparing your record with a timeless, priceless masterpiece. Here's the other side of that story "We had to get the drum sound up the way he had it. I wasn't a fan of it. So now he goes, "See the bass guitar?" and I said, "Yeah, great part, man. He killed it." He said, "I want you to bring down the bass where you can barely, audibly hear it in the mix." I said, "You're kidding. Right?" He said, "No. Bring it down." I bring it down to that level and he says, "Now drop it down another 5 db." I turned around and looked at Hetfield and said, "He's serious?" It just blew me away. https://www.ultimate-guitar.com/news/interviews/steve_thompson_when_lars_asked_me_what_happened_to_the_bass_in__justice_i_wanted_to_cold_cock_him.html Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MacDaddy Posted January 6, 2022 Share Posted January 6, 2022 If their ears were shot during mixing, why wouldn't they want to release a version where their ears are not shot during mixing? 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Munurmunuh Posted January 6, 2022 Share Posted January 6, 2022 With audible bass it sounds notionally more satisfying, but what is there in this long bleak album to make satisfaction seem relevant? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ubit Posted January 6, 2022 Author Share Posted January 6, 2022 5 minutes ago, Ricky Rioli said: With audible bass it sounds notionally more satisfying, but what is there in this long bleak album to make satisfaction seem relevant? Is that serious? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jason Karloff Posted January 6, 2022 Share Posted January 6, 2022 I haven't listened to that in years. Do you think it's worth a revaluation? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ubit Posted January 6, 2022 Author Share Posted January 6, 2022 4 minutes ago, Jason Karloff said: I haven't listened to that in years. Do you think it's worth a revaluation? Yes'o Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jason Karloff Posted January 6, 2022 Share Posted January 6, 2022 OK consider it homework. I will. Is this the original or bass in yer face version? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ubit Posted January 6, 2022 Author Share Posted January 6, 2022 1 minute ago, Jason Karloff said: OK consider it homework. I will. Is this the original or bass in yer face version? If you can be bothered to listen to the Youtube version with bass, it's much betterer! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lozz196 Posted January 6, 2022 Share Posted January 6, 2022 30 minutes ago, MacDaddy said: If their ears were shot during mixing, why wouldn't they want to release a version where their ears are not shot during mixing? Quite, when we were recording our last album we wanted to get done to a timescale and a days mixing opportunity came up earlier than expected on a Sunday. But as we were gigging both the Fri & Sat before I said no we shouldn’t do it as our ears wouldn’t be in the best shape after that, as well as overall tiredness of two gigs in a row at distance. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jason Karloff Posted January 6, 2022 Share Posted January 6, 2022 Sounds wise. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Supernaut Posted January 6, 2022 Share Posted January 6, 2022 1 hour ago, Ricky Rioli said: With audible bass it sounds notionally more satisfying, but what is there in this long bleak album to make satisfaction seem relevant? Have a lie down mate, you've earned it. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fretmeister Posted January 6, 2022 Share Posted January 6, 2022 1 hour ago, Doctor J said: The real crime was not getting it mixed properly, at last, for the 30th anniversary edition. They could have had a remastered disk with the original mix and a second disk with whoever giving it a decent mix. They could have righted a very big wrong but, rather spitefully, stick to their guns. They were wrong, they know it, and still refuse to acknowledge it. Those "with bass" albums, as far as I'm aware the only Newsted studio tracks which ever came out were the 4 or 5 on Guitar Hero, so there is no full album with Newsted on every track. Everything else is some dudes playing what they think the basslines are. The irony of "...and Justice For Jason" was that Newsted still couldn't be heard on it. Not quite - the version the Bass Channel did was carefully constructed from watching and listening to live performances of the tracks. Ok, the guy from the Bass Channel used his fingers instead of a Pick, but they are Jason's parts. It's this one: They also have individual tracks with much louder bass to learn from. They did have individual proper mix as well, but Metallica's record label got upset about that. I don't listen to the original anymore - I listen to this version. It's much better. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Graham Posted January 6, 2022 Share Posted January 6, 2022 It's my favourite Metallica album, but that mix 😡 To think how it could have sounded. It's also heartbreaking for Jason, he wrote Blackened, so it's his song opening the first album he recorded with them but then finds he's inaudible. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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