A Tale of International Shipping

[mxm]

Yes, I had the unfortunate displeasure of having to deal with UPS when they lost an imported parcel last year.

 

Shambles from beginning to end.

 

Happy to hear yours had a better ending.

 

 

[BigRedX]

I've bought instruments (and other stuff) from all over the world and sold them to pretty much all the major continents too.

 

Until the UK left the EU I'd only had two problems and they both happened while the item was still in the UK.

 

However since the beginning of 2020 the situation has become for more complicated, I had one parcel disappear c in customs in Belgium and another returned after several months in limbo for no apparent reason.

 

Therefore I will no longer ship outside of the UK, as it is just too unpredictable. As a result I've lost some sales and what was previously a fairly lucrative print contract for my business because the additional time, effort and therefore cost I now have to put in to shipping things outside of the UK negates any price savings I was getting my customers.

 

The OP is a braver man than me!

[NikNik]

I am so glad it worked out for you both.

 

I, too, have seen couriers in my area when I am expecting one but sometimes, apparently, there are several on the same route. After my last two disasters with Hermes (the first as a sender; the second as recipient) I am very reluctant to post a guitar or bass again, and certainly not abroad. The last foreign sale was concluded via Reverb and I actually flew out to Hamburg with the bass and handed it over to him personally. Obviously, that's not going got be economically viable every time but it is something I will have to the fore in future.

 

Incidentally, I thought the CITES restrictions on rosewood were now lifted?

[NikNik]

1 hour ago, mxm said:

Yes, I had the unfortunate displeasure of having to deal with UPS when they lost an imported parcel last year.

 

Shambles from beginning to end.

 

Happy to hear yours had a better ending.

 

 

Been there. Custom bass disappeared en route from Italy. It was never found.

 

I do wonder what happens to all those 'lost' parcels. By 'lost' I mean the ones genuinely lost, and not just nicked!

[JellyKnees]

Sounds like a complete nightmare, and reinforces my belief that I did the right thing by not offering to ship my currently for sale Dingwall outside of the UK.

[Guest]

It’s a tale of woe but there are some salient points:

1. Don’t sell to the US. It’s a long-established fact that their customs are some of the most picky and demanding in the world - they regularly hold all types of goods on spurious requirements. When I worked in shipping 15+ years ago properly documented shipments with all the right paperwork would be held up for days or weeks. There is also a high level of theft in US courier networks.
2. CITES now allows an exception for musical instruments but certain species are still restricted (like Brazilian rosewood) - so importers have to ask. If you must ship - put the wood species on the invoice for all the different types of wood (and anything else organic). Given the very precise nature of Mother of Pearl it’s not surprising that UPS knew little about it or held it up as the US Govt is very strict in this area. 
3. All export documentation should contain the harmonised commodity code. This will delay all imports as it’s used for calculating duties and taxes. It’s not enough to rely on the shipping courier to either ask for it or provide it. Just because you are a private customer shipping, does not mean you can avoid jumping through the same hoops as companies have to. It’s annoying but it is what it is.
4. UPS is decent enough by allowing you to ship and declare a large insurance value where most couriers no longer do this. However when anything goes wrong they are largely useless. I have sent 3 shipments recently via next day before 12pm and all 3 have been routed to the wrong warehouse and delivered a day late. I have made repeated attempts to ask for compensation but all I get is “someone will contact you in 1-2 business days”. The last shipment was 2 weeks ago. At least they all arrived undamaged.
5. When you purchase, do it via PayPal or credit card so you have some way of claiming back compensation in case of the above.
6. Given global shipping turmoil it’s probably not the best time to ship outside the UK. I’ve given up on it.

[Steve Browning]

1 hour ago, BigRedX said:

I've bought instruments (and other stuff) from all over the world and sold them to pretty much all the major continents too.

 

Until the UK left the EU I'd only had two problems and they both happened while the item was still in the UK.

 

However since the beginning of 2020 the situation has become for more complicated, I had one parcel disappear c in customs in Belgium and another returned after several months in limbo for no apparent reason.

 

Therefore I will no longer ship outside of the UK, as it is just too unpredictable. As a result I've lost some sales and what was previously a fairly lucrative print contract for my business because the additional time, effort and therefore cost I now have to put in to shipping things outside of the UK negates any price savings I was getting my customers.

 

The OP is a braver man than me!

 

No worth in looking at a non-established VAT registration in an EU country?

[BlueMoon]

2 hours ago, NikNik said:

I do wonder what happens to all those 'lost' parcels. By 'lost' I mean the ones genuinely lost, and not just nicked!

I think you might need an additional category "lost by arrangement". A lot of that goes on, I'm sure. If working conditions are limit exploitation, then sabotage and theft will go on apace.

[Dazed]

9 hours ago, RhysP said:

And I'm getting stressed out about picking an amp up from Bridgend this afternoon...  😂

 

It is Bridgend, why wouldn’t you be 😂 

[hiram.k.hackenbacker]

7 hours ago, FDC484950 said:

It’s a tale of woe but there are some salient points:

1. Don’t sell to the US. It’s a long-established fact that their customs are some of the most picky and demanding in the world - they regularly hold all types of goods on spurious requirements. When I worked in shipping 15+ years ago properly documented shipments with all the right paperwork would be held up for days or weeks. There is also a high level of theft in US courier networks.
2. CITES now allows an exception for musical instruments but certain species are still restricted (like Brazilian rosewood) - so importers have to ask. If you must ship - put the wood species on the invoice for all the different types of wood (and anything else organic). Given the very precise nature of Mother of Pearl it’s not surprising that UPS knew little about it or held it up as the US Govt is very strict in this area. 
3. All export documentation should contain the harmonised commodity code. This will delay all imports as it’s used for calculating duties and taxes. It’s not enough to rely on the shipping courier to either ask for it or provide it. Just because you are a private customer shipping, does not mean you can avoid jumping through the same hoops as companies have to. It’s annoying but it is what it is.
4. UPS is decent enough by allowing you to ship and declare a large insurance value where most couriers no longer do this. However when anything goes wrong they are largely useless. I have sent 3 shipments recently via next day before 12pm and all 3 have been routed to the wrong warehouse and delivered a day late. I have made repeated attempts to ask for compensation but all I get is “someone will contact you in 1-2 business days”. The last shipment was 2 weeks ago. At least they all arrived undamaged.
5. When you purchase, do it via PayPal or credit card so you have some way of claiming back compensation in case of the above.
6. Given global shipping turmoil it’s probably not the best time to ship outside the UK. I’ve given up on it.

Re point 3 - I disagree. I didn't even know harmonisation codes existed. If the shipping agent doesn't highlight the requirement anywhere (they didn't), how is anyone supposed to know that one is required? At the very least there should have been a box somewhere in the booking process that I had to fill in; the type of box that does not allow further progress unless you complete. I really don't think that would be too much to ask.

Re point 4 - I don't think that sets them apart. All couriers become largely useless when anything goes wrong.

Re point 5 - I did.

[Guest]

Well, you know now.

[BigRedX]

The Harmonised Commodity Code requirement for individuals sending things out of the UK appears to have become a requirement post January 1st 2021. I'd certainly never needed it it before. However it doesn't appear to have stopped Belgian Customs from holding up the parcel I was sending (it sailed straight through UK customs) and then managing to loose it. Also for some items can be tricky to assign and don't always fall into the sub-category you would expect. In my case printed self-adhesive labels were a sub category of Labels - Textile, Leather and Others, rather than Printed Papers.

[hiram.k.hackenbacker]

7 minutes ago, BigRedX said:

The Harmonised Commodity Code requirement for individuals sending things out of the UK appears to have become a requirement post January 1st 2021. I'd certainly never needed it it before. However it doesn't appear to have stopped Belgian Customs from holding up the parcel I was sending (it sailed straight through UK customs) and then managing to loose it. Also for some items can be tricky to assign and don't always fall into the sub-category you would expect. In my case printed self-adhesive labels were a sub category of Labels - Textile, Leather and Others, rather than Printed Papers.

Very much so. The buyer and I in this case narrowed it down to few codes it could be and just picked one hoping for the best. UPS Brokerage didn’t question it further once we chose the code, but refused to release until they had the details on the MoP.

[Steve Browning]

here's a link to the nomenclature (commodity codes). https://www.tariffnumber.com/2022/92

[Graham]

All very on brand for UPS, not sure if it's happened recently but at work we used to regularly have their drivers turn up demanding cash on delivery for the imports they were delivering - same deal as your buyer.

 

Goods-in would point out (again) that they don't have cash, we'd paid the import duty by deferment and that we have a credit account with UPS.

 

Most courier firms are hard to deal with, worse since Brexit/COVID, but in our area at least, UPS are by far the worst.

[Owen]

I sold a bass to Norway (hi if you are reading this). Customs in Norway told me that CITIES said they could destroy the bass if I could not prove it was the right sort of Ebony. I don't think I have ever spontaneously sweated like that before. I eventually proved that it was the right sort of Ebony, but that is the last time I will do that. On a side note the courier managed to break the bass, but the insurance coughed up full whack eventually.